Author Topic: Who is in Who is out?  (Read 65722 times)

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Offline TXMike

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #75 on: September 14, 2010, 04:26:32 PM »
At this point there is no need to endorse either one.  There will be a court hearing in october before any decision has to be made.  Hopefully folks will be patient enough to wait until then.

bbarn01

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #76 on: September 14, 2010, 05:22:40 PM »
In all fairness, lets look at this from a middle ground standpoint: The ONLY thing that the UIL is doing is registering all officials who wish to be considered for the playoffs. If you do not want to work the playoffs, then you do not have to register. There is nothing mandating that officials JOIN the UIL. That is not what is being asked here. The ONLY thing being asked of officials is simply to register with the UIL.

The stance that some are taking is "I will not register and help cause a stoppage of play". What will happen is about 50% of officials will refuse to register and the 50% of officials who would not be normally working the playoffs will see themselves thrust into action so in essence, there will not actually be a shortage of officials. Out of the 50% of officials that will not be working the playoffs, about 30% of those would not be calling anyways so in essence, 15% of quality of officials will probably miss the playoffs.

Here is the bottom line folks: This is not an attempted takeover by the UIL. This is also not an attempt by the UIL to dissolve TASO. The UIL is perfectly acceptable to having two or more state officiating organizations. The ONLY thing the UIL is doing is making sure that all officials working in Texas are registered with the UIL. All officials must be held accountable and TASO has not done a very good job of doing that. TASO has been doing things under the "good old boys" system for many years and you have to change the way you do business with the times.  The UIL has to improve officiating and the way we as officials do business.

Offline Etref

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #77 on: September 14, 2010, 05:29:44 PM »
I call BS!


It is insulting that you say "the UIL has to improve officiating". They do not have a clue about football and wouldn't know anything about what a football official does if it bit them on the butt.

Why the deadline?
What happens next year?
Will it always be free?
Who will do the training?
What can we expect next?


Answer some of those questions instead of insulting us saying UIL will make officials better.


" I don't make the rules coach!"

504coach

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #78 on: September 14, 2010, 05:34:22 PM »
In all fairness, lets look at this from a middle ground standpoint: The ONLY thing that the UIL is doing is registering all officials who wish to be considered for the playoffs. If you do not want to work the playoffs, then you do not have to register. There is nothing mandating that officials JOIN the UIL. That is not what is being asked here. The ONLY thing being asked of officials is simply to register with the UIL.

The stance that some are taking is "I will not register and help cause a stoppage of play". What will happen is about 50% of officials will refuse to register and the 50% of officials who would not be normally working the playoffs will see themselves thrust into action so in essence, there will not actually be a shortage of officials. Out of the 50% of officials that will not be working the playoffs, about 30% of those would not be calling anyways so in essence, 15% of quality of officials will probably miss the playoffs.

Here is the bottom line folks: This is not an attempted takeover by the UIL. This is also not an attempt by the UIL to dissolve TASO. The UIL is perfectly acceptable to having two or more state officiating organizations. The ONLY thing the UIL is doing is making sure that all officials working in Texas are registered with the UIL. All officials must be held accountable and TASO has not done a very good job of doing that. TASO has been doing things under the "good old boys" system for many years and you have to change the way you do business with the times.  The UIL has to improve officiating and the way we as officials do business.


What is their plan to improve officiating?  What is their plan to hold people accountable?  How are they going to pay for these goals?  Why is it that when asked about these issues both TT or Dr. B had a different answer for AD's, coaches, officials, and Super's?  The fact of the matter is this was poorly executed by the UIL and they have lost all credit/good will with officials.  If they would like to get it out then put their plan in writing.

Offline fencewire

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #79 on: September 14, 2010, 05:58:25 PM »
I spoke with a BB official and he said that the rank and file member didn't notice any difference last year, training was done by the chapter as it was done before.  Games were assigned by the chapter, playoffs were the same as they had always, coaches agreed to officials until regional tourneys, same as before.  As far as he knew, there were no officials in the chapter that were summoned to Austin for an accountability hearing.  He said that he really didn't care one way or the other just wanted to call BB games and from their initial year there was only one difference.  They actually had to log on to the fed website and take a test rather than sitting at a meeting answering the same 50 t/f questions on pieces of paper all together and handing the tests in.

TXSmogs

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #80 on: September 14, 2010, 06:27:43 PM »
I have been a member of my Chapter since 1976.  SFOA was a great.  IMHO, it's time for us to have our own organization again.  It's been my observation a large percentage of Football officials only do this sport and are very focused, if not obsessed with becoming better.  Football officials, as an organization, had their feces cohesive during the SFOA days, and being lumped in with the other sports had only done us harm.  What do you think,  especially those who actually were members of SFOA?    

Offline DallasLJ

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #81 on: September 14, 2010, 08:01:51 PM »
In all fairness, lets look at this from a middle ground standpoint: The ONLY thing that the UIL is doing is registering all officials who wish to be considered for the playoffs. If you do not want to work the playoffs, then you do not have to register. There is nothing mandating that officials JOIN the UIL. That is not what is being asked here. The ONLY thing being asked of officials is simply to register with the UIL.

The stance that some are taking is "I will not register and help cause a stoppage of play". What will happen is about 50% of officials will refuse to register and the 50% of officials who would not be normally working the playoffs will see themselves thrust into action so in essence, there will not actually be a shortage of officials. Out of the 50% of officials that will not be working the playoffs, about 30% of those would not be calling anyways so in essence, 15% of quality of officials will probably miss the playoffs.

Here is the bottom line folks: This is not an attempted takeover by the UIL. This is also not an attempt by the UIL to dissolve TASO. The UIL is perfectly acceptable to having two or more state officiating organizations. The ONLY thing the UIL is doing is making sure that all officials working in Texas are registered with the UIL. All officials must be held accountable and TASO has not done a very good job of doing that. TASO has been doing things under the "good old boys" system for many years and you have to change the way you do business with the times.  The UIL has to improve officiating and the way we as officials do business.

  I am not sure what you mean by "TASO has been doing things under the good old boys system for many years."  TASO does not, and has not been handing out games.  Also, you accuse TASO of not doing a good job of accountability.  Again, give some examples.  Most discipline is handled at the Chapter level.  For TASO to get involved, someone has to make a complaint.  To my knowledge, TASO has never sat on a complaint.  Instead, when brought to its attention, TASO has taken actions against members for soliciting -- which I think it was it driving some people to the UIL  -- because they want to politic to get playoff games the coaches or their Chapters will not give them.

Offline JasonTX

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #82 on: September 14, 2010, 09:32:13 PM »
Diversity standards as in we need x number of officials of this race and x number of officials of this race in a crew?  If so that already happens.

I realize this is idle speculation, but the UIL will have a ready made source of training material for football.  That source is the National Federation.  Something to chew on.

I don't think that will happen.  Texas uses NCAA rules by the choice of the UIL.  They have always had the power to change to NFHS and never have in the many years they have existed so I don't see why they would do so now.

Offline blindref757

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #83 on: September 14, 2010, 10:25:07 PM »
I know this...all of this crap is wearing on me.  Refereeing is a lot less fun this year for me.  My crew got drafted for a game at the ISD where I work down in the intermediate school...and the coach doesn't want me to work the game.

I'm perfectly happy to bow out and spend a Friday with my family instead of referee.  I guess there will be life after football. 

Offline TXMike

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #84 on: September 15, 2010, 05:00:57 AM »
I spoke with a BB official and he said that the rank and file member didn't notice any difference last year, training was done by the chapter as it was done before.  Games were assigned by the chapter, playoffs were the same as they had always, coaches agreed to officials until regional tourneys, same as before.  As far as he knew, there were no officials in the chapter that were summoned to Austin for an accountability hearing.  He said that he really didn't care one way or the other just wanted to call BB games and from their initial year there was only one difference.  They actually had to log on to the fed website and take a test rather than sitting at a meeting answering the same 50 t/f questions on pieces of paper all together and handing the tests in.

Uhhhhhh, when is the last time you took a TASO football test?

Offline fencewire

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #85 on: September 15, 2010, 05:25:35 AM »
Took it this year, and I am sure that there is some passing around of information, and yes there are 50 t/f questions.

I am 100% sure that the test wasn't passed out at a chapter meeting where folks just congregated, and answered the test in group fashion, many just listening and contributing nothing, marking T or F on the sheet and handing it back to chapter members to grade.

All I asked him was, what were the differences between last year and the years before UiL and how many people were summoned to Austin to be held "accountable"...   The testing was the biggest difference that he mentioned, and apparently it was all done through the NFHS site, nothing UiL based.

I think he even said that there was a second part of the rules testing that had to be done sometime during the season, not just the start of the year.

Offline TXMike

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #86 on: September 15, 2010, 05:34:54 AM »
When mentioning the testing you said they had to log on to the fed website and take a test rather than sitting at a meeting answering the same 50 t/f questions on pieces of paper all together and handing the tests in.  My point was that we do not take the TASO test like that any longer.  It is online.

WABill

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #87 on: September 15, 2010, 05:50:27 AM »
I'm perfectly happy to bow out and spend a Friday with my family instead of referee.  I guess there will be life after football. 

Did that once this year already.  Looking forward to many more nights like that.

Offline Etref

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #88 on: September 15, 2010, 07:55:52 AM »
I have been a member of my Chapter since 1976.  SFOA was a great.  IMHO, it's time for us to have our own organization again.  It's been my observation a large percentage of Football officials only do this sport and are very focused, if not obsessed with becoming better.  Football officials, as an organization, had their feces cohesive during the SFOA days, and being lumped in with the other sports had only done us harm.  What do you think,  especially those who actually were members of SFOA?    


TXSMOGS, you are quite right.

If we can all go back in our memory banks we will see that in the early 90's, the UIL came to SFOA and said you have to take over these basketball and other sports because we cannot handle them. SFOA did and formed TASO. Now just because football cannot make miracles happen with problem children they are being punished.


Ohhhh, well like Blindref said more time at home with the family.
" I don't make the rules coach!"

Offline TexDoc

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #89 on: September 15, 2010, 08:03:25 AM »
All officials must be held accountable and TASO has not done a very good job of doing that.

Please explain what in the world this means.  This is the same rhetoric UIL has been spewing since this whole thing started.  What the hell is meant by "accountability?"  Is it being accountable for rules knowledge, hustling, tossing coaches or players, showing up on time, not getting paperwork in, not taking a test, not being in shape, not wearing a UIL hat, not following 1204...what exactly? 

GameWillTravel

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #90 on: September 15, 2010, 08:38:21 AM »
Just found out my 7th grader has a UIL Art contest. Thats right boys and girls A ART CONTEST. Now you know why they want to TAKE OVER football. ITS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY. They have programs that lose money so this is a way cover all there programs. What about the Insurance that we have with TASO, is UIL (Big Brother) going to have the same. If 50% of the Officials do not sign up with UIL and cannot call Playoff games. Are you going to let a 3 year official call 3 round playoff game Good Luck on that. I would pay 25.00 a year to the UIL to  leave us the Hell alone.

Offline TXMike

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #91 on: September 15, 2010, 08:52:00 AM »
I would pay 25.00 a year to the UIL to  leave us the Hell alone.

In the last year or so of this issue, that is the BEST idea I have heard yet!

504coach

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #92 on: September 15, 2010, 08:53:08 AM »
Just found out my 7th grader has a UIL Art contest. Thats right boys and girls A ART CONTEST. Now you know why they want to TAKE OVER football. ITS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY. They have programs that lose money so this is a way cover all there programs. What about the Insurance that we have with TASO, is UIL (Big Brother) going to have the same. If 50% of the Officials do not sign up with UIL and cannot call Playoff games. Are you going to let a 3 year official call 3 round playoff game Good Luck on that. I would pay 25.00 a year to the UIL to  leave us the Hell alone.

I would pay them $25 a year also to leave me alone and not send me any BS emails.  If they would have pushed this as a tax and not a we are going to change the way your group has opperated that would have been more well received then what they are trying to do now.  Fact remains they did a horrible job rolling this out.  They ignored all dynamic change best practices and they now have a cluster to clean up.

Offline Etref

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #93 on: September 15, 2010, 08:57:27 AM »
I would pay them $25 a year also to leave me alone and not send me any BS emails.  If they would have pushed this as a tax and not a we are going to change the way your group has opperated that would have been more well received then what they are trying to do now.  Fact remains they did a horrible job rolling this out.  They ignored all dynamic change best practices and they now have a cluster to clean up.

And too much pride and ego to back off.


" I don't make the rules coach!"

GameWillTravel

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #94 on: September 15, 2010, 09:14:42 AM »
For all you officials that are Pro UIL is that a good idea that you can live with. ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
« Last Edit: September 15, 2010, 09:18:38 AM by GameWillTravel »

Offline Welpe

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #95 on: September 15, 2010, 09:22:17 AM »
I don't think that will happen.  Texas uses NCAA rules by the choice of the UIL.  They have always had the power to change to NFHS and never have in the many years they have existed so I don't see why they would do so now.

I pray you are correct Jason.  Now that I've gone to NCAA rules from NFHS, I don't want to go back!

GameWillTravel

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #96 on: September 15, 2010, 09:35:25 AM »
All the Chapters Pres should send a letter to all the officials in there chapters and find out how there Chapter stands on the matter (Take a Vote). Then send the results to the UIL and TASO maybe that would HELP

HAshleyTX

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #97 on: September 15, 2010, 11:09:13 AM »
So if our testing is going to be done through the NFHS then how long do we think the NFHS will be willing to handle seperate NCAA products for Texas only?  The thought may be that we will not go to FED rules but after we have been in bed with the NFHS for awhile I predict that the subject will be submitted sooner or later.  NFHS is a powerful organization with a lot of pull. Once we are pulled in, thier influence will eventually be too strong to ignore.

Offline fencewire

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #98 on: September 15, 2010, 11:18:33 AM »
I haven't seen anything that would say that our testing is going to be done through NFHS.  Though it is a valid question for any chapter that chose to align themselves with the UIL.  this is all based COMPLETELY from their latest communication, and in no way predicts what might happen at a later date.

Quote
Registration should not be confused with membership. Each chapter will decide whom their service provider will be for rule books, insurance, training, etc. Chapters may
choose either TASO or UIL for these services. However, all individual officials who wish to officiate UIL contests must register with the UIL annually, regardless of their
chapter membership affiliation.

...

Quote
However, all officials must complete the free registration process annually.

Offline JasonTX

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Re: Who is in Who is out?
« Reply #99 on: September 15, 2010, 11:42:27 AM »
So if our testing is going to be done through the NFHS then how long do we think the NFHS will be willing to handle seperate NCAA products for Texas only?  The thought may be that we will not go to FED rules but after we have been in bed with the NFHS for awhile I predict that the subject will be submitted sooner or later.  NFHS is a powerful organization with a lot of pull. Once we are pulled in, thier influence will eventually be too strong to ignore.

I hope the UIL is smarter than that to change rules.  I think they realize that by changing the rules we would all be first year officials all over again.