Author Topic: You're never too old to see something new....  (Read 5414 times)

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Offline Ralph Damren

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You're never too old to see something new....
« on: October 17, 2015, 11:43:23 AM »
(NOTE: The story is true, the names have been changed to pertect the aged)

     Once a year, our assigner puts togather a crew of the five oldest officials. We refer to it as "the ole' duffers crew". Some refer to it as something else ;) ;). Last night was our game...average age : 68....average years of service : 38. This occurred that caused us to conference, and I felt you guys might enjoy pondering it :

          (1) Screachin' Weasels vs Squarting Dawgs, close game, late in 3rd period;
          (2) Dumptruck, the Weasels FB gains 1st down @ Dawgs 5, in center of field;
          (3) Porkchop, the Dawg's NG enters the game to replace Slim, the D-Back;
          (4) Slim was watching the prom queen and not paying attention 8];
          (5) Dumptruck again takes handoff and lumbers into EZ as time expires;
          (6) Slim comes to and steps out the back of EZ before ???/after  ??? the snap;
          (7) BJ  ^flag tosses his hankie very high, as does HL ^flag;

We then needed to put our tired ole' brains togather via a conference to sort this out....it probably took about 30 seconds, you give it a try ;).......

Offline sir55

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2015, 01:04:33 PM »
If before the snap, its a dead ball illegal substitution. Half the distance, replay the down with an untimed down in the 3rd period. If after, its illegal participation. TD counts. If they take it on the try, try is attempted in 3rd period. If they take it on KO, mark off the 15 for the KO to start the 4th period.

Offline FLAHL

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2015, 02:33:36 PM »


    ...average age : 68....average years of service : 38
         

Wow. I bet you guys have some stories. Congrats.  :bOW

Offline GA Umpire

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2015, 04:08:37 PM »
If before the snap, its a dead ball illegal substitution. Half the distance, replay the down with an untimed down in the 3rd period. If after, its illegal participation. TD counts. If they take it on the try, try is attempted in 3rd period. If they take it on KO, mark off the 15 for the KO to start the 4th period.

If he exited the end zone before the snap, it is a DB foul and no time should have run off the clock.  Half the distance penalty, and clock starts on the ready.  If time expires before the snap, then an untimed down.  I would probably start the clock on the snap to limit confusion and an explanation to the Dawg's  HC.  If after the snap, then as FLAHL states.

ECILLJ

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2015, 05:03:07 PM »
If Slim only stepped out and did not return, he did not illegally participate.  ::)

If Slim only stepped out leaving 10 on the defense then we don't have illegal substitution.  ???

I going with wave it off.  ^talk

Cubs lead off in 2 hours.  aWaRd

Offline ncwingman

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2015, 06:47:24 PM »
If Slim only stepped out leaving 10 on the defense then we don't have illegal substitution.  ???

It is if he leaves through the back of the endzone. If he leaves off the sideline properly, I've got nothing.

Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2015, 07:25:07 PM »
If he exited the end zone before the snap, it is a DB foul and no time should have run off the clock.  Half the distance penalty, and clock starts on the ready.  If time expires before the snap, then an untimed down.
I agree the clock should have stopped on the pre-snap whistle, so we still have time in the 3Q.  But if time expires before the next snap. no untimed down, as there was not a foul DURING the last play.  Clock on the RFP, as the foul wasn't done to conserve or use time illegally.  If the clock runs out before the snap, move to the other end of the field and play the 4th quarter.

Offline Jackhammer

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2015, 08:44:00 PM »
Guys you missed the most important fact in the play situation:  Average Age = 68

You count the TD, run the PAT,  take advantage of the quarter change  and then walk slowly to kickoff positions.


Note: not my real answer
"The only whistle that kills a play is an inadvertent one"

"The only thing black and white in officiating is the uniform"

Offline VALJ

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2015, 12:40:10 PM »
If time expires before the snap, then an untimed down. 

Negatory.  NFHS Code, an untimed down can only occur if time runs out during a down in which a penalty or an inadvertent whistle occurs.

ECILLJ

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2015, 11:01:13 PM »
After re-reading the play, I have some new thoughts.

If he stepped out prior to the snap, we have illegal substitution, 5 yd. succeeding spot foul.

If he stepped out after snap, we have 15 yd. succeeding spot foul.

Both of these are defensive fouls on a scoring play. A may elect to take on try or kick-off.

The period ended on an accepted defensive penalty, so we will have an untimed kick-off. (Never seen one of those.)

 pray:; This is my new answer.

Martin Kiff

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2015, 12:05:48 AM »
38 years times 7 new rule changes per year.  That's 266 rule changes.  Go with the PAT,  change the quarter before the kickoff and shorten the game.  If anyone complains,  point to the 87 year old referee and tell the coach to bring some Viagra with him.

Offline Ralph Damren

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Re: You're never too old to see something new....
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2015, 08:03:08 AM »
Thanks, guys, for your opinions. Our conference ironed out the following :
 
   Slim was trying to get out of town, so it would be illegal substitution, not illegal participation.
   
   Did he cross the endline before or after the snap ??? ??? BJ wasn't sure..HL was : "He definitely stepped out before the snap yEs:"

   That meant that it was a dead ball foul and the play that just happened (Dumptruck's TD), didn't really.

   The penalty moved the ball to the 2 1/2, the clock was reset to 0:03 (time when snap occurred), and Tugboat,s coach was advised : "Foul happened before the play got off, coach, so it didn't count."
Coach responded : "Ayuh, 'spect you guys know what you are talking about as you were doing this before I was born."

   Dumptruck ,regained his wind from the delay and again lumbered into paydirt as time expired.

   PAT from that end...then the journey to the other end for kickoff.

   IF it had been a live ball foul, TD stands,  5 yards enforced on PAT or kickoff. Period ends after PAT.

Another example of the WHEN, in the 4 W's of reporting a foul.