New Force

[GA Umpire]

 I will attempt to get the Board back to discussing football, if that is possible.
I found the case play below in my off season study.

6.3.1 SITUATION A:

A scrimmage kick by K1 comes to rest on R's 6-yard line. R1 attempts to recover and advance, but muffs the ball so that it rolls into the end zone where:

(a) R2 downs the ball; or
(b) R3 recovers and advances out of the end zone; or
(c) K2 recovers and downs the ball in the end zone.

RULING: The ball became dead as soon as it broke the plane of R's goal line. It is a touchback in (a), (b) and (c). The kick had not ended because muffing does not constitute ­possession, therefore, it is a kick into R's end zone which is an automatic touchback. The covering official should sound the whistle immediately when the ball becomes dead as a result of breaking the goal-line plane. Force is not a factor on kicks going into R's end zone. R will put the ball in play, first and 10, from their 20-yard line. (2-24-2, 8-5-3a)


The above case states this is a touchback.
By definition this is still a kick, but 2-13-1 states a new force can be added to a grounded kick by a muff.
Since the ball is at rest when it is muffed, what is the rationale for the muff not being a new force?

[ChicagoZebra]

In NFHS, force is not relevant on a kick that enters R's end zone. It is always a touchback. The A, B, C options are meant to throw you off... the ball is dead by the time any of the actions occur.

A kick is a kick is a kick. No player has recovered the kick, therefore it is still a kick.

By rule, a new force has been applied to the muff of a ball at rest (although in practice as opposed to a test, that is up for debate). But again, the new force is not relevant.

[Ump33]

2-13-4 . . . Force is not a factor:
a. On kicks going into R’s end zone, since these kicks are always a touchback regardless of who supplied the force.

[AlUpstateNY]

2-13-4 . . . Force is not a factor:
a. On kicks going into R’s end zone, since these kicks are always a touchback regardless of who supplied the force.

It has long seemed, one of the simplest, yet most significant, confusing, problem generating and most important aspects of "a kick", as relates to the game of football, is that of the bazillion things that we've all seen happen to kicks, ONLY TWO can actually cause a kick to end (no longer be subject to the rules related to "kicks"). 

NFHS: 2-24-2:  "a kick ends when a player gains possession or when the ball becomes dead while not in player possession.".

[Ralph Damren]

IMHO, there are two points of discussion here :

WHEN CAN A MUFF ADD A NEW FORCE TO A KICK?....If R muffs a grounded kick back into K's end zone. K's kick is blocked @ K's 10, in trying to scoop up the kick bouncing away from K's EZ and muffs it back toward and into pylon = new force, TB, K @20-new series.

WHEN DOES THE KICK AT REST BECOME DEAD?.....If no one is making a play for it, it should become dead. IF the game was being played on an extremely muddy field and the kick didn't bounce but plopped in the mud with a receiver approaching it, I'd keep it alive - as in the case.

[AlUpstateNY]

IMHO, there are two points of discussion here :

WHEN DOES THE KICK AT REST BECOME DEAD?.....If no one is making a play for it, it should become dead. IF the game was being played on an extremely muddy field and the kick didn't bounce but plopped in the mud with a receiver approaching it, I'd keep it alive - as in the case.

Seem perfectly logical, according to NFHS rules, a kick is a kick until it stops being a kick "ends", which is defined explicitly in NFHS 2-24-2.

[BIG UMP]

I can live with the rule but I don't believe we should award R a TB.  B should blow it dead and it be declared dead at the 6.

By rule no, but fair yes.

[ChicagoZebra]

I can live with the rule but I don't believe we should award R a TB.  B should blow it dead and it be declared dead at the 6.

By rule no, but fair yes.

You have players running after a loose ball and you are going to blow it dead?

[AlUpstateNY]

I can live with the rule but I don't believe we should award R a TB.  B should blow it dead and it be declared dead at the 6.

By rule no, but fair yes.

It can ABSOLUTELY be both "fair" and "by rule".  NFHS 2-1-1 tells us, "A live ball is a ball in play. A ball becomes live when the ball has been legally snapped or free kicked and a down is in progress". NFHS 2-1-1 advises "a dead ball is a ball not in play"

During a kick, the ball becomes live, when (FREE: when kicked, SCRIMMAGE: after a legal snap) and stays "live" until it's no longer in play. There are detailed instructions for when, "the ball becomes dead and the down is ended NFHS 4-2-2-A through L (item "D" refers specifically to during kicks (Free &/or Scrimmage). Item E2 specifically relates to a motionless, grounded loose ball.

In essence, the "covering official" is responsible to determine whether, "a kick at rest becomes dead by his judgment whether the ball remains "in play".

[zoom]

It can ABSOLUTELY be both "fair" and "by rule".  NFHS 2-1-1 tells us, "A live ball is a ball in play. A ball becomes live when the ball has been legally snapped or free kicked and a down is in progress". NFHS 2-1-1 advises "a dead ball is a ball not in play"

During a kick, the ball becomes live, when (FREE: when kicked, SCRIMMAGE: after a legal snap) and stays "live" until it's no longer in play. There are detailed instructions for when, "the ball becomes dead and the down is ended NFHS 4-2-2-A through L (item "D" refers specifically to during kicks (Free &/or Scrimmage). Item E2 specifically relates to a motionless, grounded loose ball.

In essence, the "covering official" is responsible to determine whether, "a kick at rest becomes dead by his judgment whether the ball remains "in play".

I would have to see it, but I would only blow it dead if the ball came to a stop and CLEARLY no one was trying to recover it.  If R muffs it after it becomes still and it is subsequently recovered by K prior to it crossing R's goal line, K deserves to next snap the ball.  I wouldn't want to rob K of that possibility by blowing it dead as soon as the kick stops rolling.

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[CalhounLJ]

I agree. If there is a player/players close enough to be trying to recover it, I’m waiting to see what happens. Completely different from the ball lying there with nobody around. 


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