Author Topic: Mouthpiece  (Read 15946 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

NJOfficial

  • Guest
Mouthpiece
« on: September 18, 2014, 01:19:01 PM »
In NFHS rules it says no white or clear mouthpieces are allowed.  Does anyone know why? And how hard do you enforce this rule?

Jim D.

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2014, 01:24:06 PM »
It's harder for an official to determine if a player has a mouthpiece in if it's white or clear.  I enforce it by asking the coach if everyone is legally equipped.  It's the coach's responsibility to make sure they have the right kind, not mine.

Offline Rulesman

  • Past Keeper of the Keys
  • Refstripes Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3839
  • FAN REACTION: +65535/-2
  • Live like tomorrow never comes.
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2014, 01:24:40 PM »
So they can be seen.
"Gentlemen, we are going to relentlessly chase perfection, knowing full well we will not catch it, because nothing is perfect. But we are going to relentlessly chase it, because in the process we will catch excellence. I am not remotely interested in just being good."
- Vince Lombardi

Offline NorCalMike

  • *
  • Posts: 770
  • FAN REACTION: +23/-8
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2014, 01:27:07 PM »
The requirement is to allow the officials to be able to tell if the mouthpiece is in. Supposedly having a white or clear mouthpiece makes it difficult for us to tell if the player is actually wearing a mouthpiece.

We haven't really had a problem for several years now. About four or five years ago, I was checking equipment and found a player with a white mouthpiece. I tell the coach the player needs get a new mouthpiece. They don't have any spares so the coach takes out a sharpie and colors the mouthpiece black. I hope that stuff isn't toxic.

Offline Atlanta Blue

  • *
  • Posts: 3781
  • FAN REACTION: +160/-71
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2014, 02:06:34 PM »
If the mouthpiece is white and looks like this, it's a problem:



But if it's all white but looks like this, please leave it alone:


Offline Tom.OH

  • *
  • Posts: 391
  • FAN REACTION: +6/-0
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2014, 05:51:24 PM »
The requirement is to allow the officials to be able to tell if the mouthpiece is in. Supposedly having a white or clear mouthpiece makes it difficult for us to tell if the player is actually wearing a mouthpiece.

We haven't really had a problem for several years now. About four or five years ago, I was checking equipment and found a player with a white mouthpiece. I tell the coach the player needs get a new mouthpiece. They don't have any spares so the coach takes out a sharpie and colors the mouthpiece black. I hope that stuff isn't toxic.

My crew had 3 players with all white mouthpieces last week! They all were strapped to the face mask so we had them put blue tape on the strap.
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. And inside of a dog, it's to dark to read."
Groucho Marx

Offline AlUpstateNY

  • *
  • Posts: 4729
  • FAN REACTION: +341/-919
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2014, 06:36:50 PM »
"Necessity is the mother of invention".

Offline sir55

  • *
  • Posts: 205
  • FAN REACTION: +12/-5
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2014, 11:40:34 PM »
If they are seen before they enter the game, they don't participate, it's illegal equipment.  If they are in the game with it, its an USC penalty on the head coach.  When the coach says his players are properly equipped, that includes the proper type and color of mouth piece. This rule has been around for several years and has not been a big problem.  The reason for the prohibition of white and clear is to allow the officials to readily determine that the player is properly equipped and wearing the required equipment during play. The mouth piece protects the player from mouth and tooth injuries and helps with concussion injuries. The NFHS has determined that this is required equipment, just like helmets and shoulder pads. If the coaches and school officials thought this was a bad rule, I am sure they would have the NFHS change or modify it.  It is a player safety rule, so until they do, it gets enforced.       

jfurdell

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2014, 02:17:01 AM »
Please don't flag a team 15 yards for an improperly colored mouth guard.  They have the protective equipment; that's the important thing.  Talk to the player; tell him to fix it for next week; let 'em play.

Offline Kevin Durst

  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • FAN REACTION: +3/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2014, 08:22:49 AM »
Please don't flag a team 15 yards for an improperly colored mouth guard.  They have the protective equipment; that's the important thing.  Talk to the player; tell him to fix it for next week; let 'em play.


Our crew will not penalize the team 15 yards for an improperly colored mouth guard.  We will also not tell him to fix it before next week.  We will send him to the sidelines and tell him to get a legal mouthpiece before he comes back in.

Offline VALJ

  • *
  • Posts: 2428
  • FAN REACTION: +90/-14
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2014, 08:24:41 AM »

Our crew will not penalize the team 15 yards for an improperly colored mouth guard.  We will also not tell him to fix it before next week.  We will send him to the sidelines and tell him to get a legal mouthpiece before he comes back in.

+1

jfurdell

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2014, 02:29:54 PM »
Our crew will not penalize the team 15 yards for an improperly colored mouth guard.  We will also not tell him to fix it before next week.  We will send him to the sidelines and tell him to get a legal mouthpiece before he comes back in.

Mouth guards are sometimes custom fitted, and when they are custom fitted, they can help prevent concussions.  Rather than send a player possibly scrambling for a random ill-fitting mouthguard on the sideline, I prefer to let him wear the one he has.

cougar729

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2014, 03:59:20 PM »
Seems like some officials are always looking for trouble.  If you've seen it and its white or clear, haven't you still "seen" it?

Offline HLinNC

  • *
  • Posts: 3491
  • FAN REACTION: +133/-24
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2014, 09:16:21 AM »
By now, everyone should know the mouthpiece can't be white or clear.  If they don't, that is on them and their coach.

No different than a less than clear eyeshield.

If you don't want to flag it, send him off; but don't kick the can down the road for the next crew to have to deal with.

"Well they let him use it last week". pi1eOn

Offline Curious

  • *
  • Posts: 1314
  • FAN REACTION: +36/-50
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2014, 10:58:58 AM »
Lets add mouthpiece inspection  P_S to the pre-game toss ritual. >:D

Offline HLinNC

  • *
  • Posts: 3491
  • FAN REACTION: +133/-24
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2014, 11:03:49 AM »
In the general course of looking for illegal towels, "warpaint", "tiger tails", play cards on the belt, and bicep bands, I guess the odd white or clear mouthpiece can occasionally be observed :P

Offline NorCalMike

  • *
  • Posts: 770
  • FAN REACTION: +23/-8
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2014, 11:10:34 PM »
Lets add mouthpiece inspection  P_S to the pre-game toss ritual. >:D
I always look at mouthpieces during my pre game check of equipment.

Offline prab

  • *
  • Posts: 669
  • FAN REACTION: +37/-47
  • Wherever you go, there you are!
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2014, 11:54:08 AM »
It seems that the simple solution to the growing mouthpiece controversy would be to require each officiating crew to have at least one member who is a board certified dentist or orthodontist.  While the referee and umpire are conducting their pregame meeting with the coaches, the dentist/orthodontist could check every player's mouthpiece, not only for color, but for proper fit, etc.  Players found to have cavities or other dental problems could be handled in a manner similar to the current concussion protocols.

For every simple problem there exists a complex solution.

Offline NorCalMike

  • *
  • Posts: 770
  • FAN REACTION: +23/-8
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2014, 03:24:11 PM »
It seems that the simple solution to the growing mouthpiece controversy would be to require each officiating crew to have at least one member who is a board certified dentist or orthodontist.  While the referee and umpire are conducting their pregame meeting with the coaches, the dentist/orthodontist could check every player's mouthpiece, not only for color, but for proper fit, etc.  Players found to have cavities or other dental problems could be handled in a manner similar to the current concussion protocols.

For every simple problem there exists a complex solution.
LOL
California is such a nanny state that someone in a legislature might run with this. :sTiR:

busman

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2014, 02:06:40 PM »
Or maybe enforce the rule as it is?  Just saying.

Offline prab

  • *
  • Posts: 669
  • FAN REACTION: +37/-47
  • Wherever you go, there you are!
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2014, 05:49:43 PM »
Or maybe enforce the rule as it is?  Just saying.

Enforcing the rule as it is written might actually work.  However it lacks the basic elements of elegance and "joie de vivre".

NJOfficial

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2014, 06:46:32 PM »
I wish they had a rule book with the rules that we are actually supposed to enforce.

jfurdell

  • Guest
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #22 on: September 23, 2014, 12:00:52 PM »
Seems like some officials are always looking for trouble.  If you've seen it and its white or clear, haven't you still "seen" it?

THIS

No different than a less than clear eyeshield.

Actually, it's very different from a tinted eyeshield, which makes it difficult to see the player's eyes and could prevent medical personnel from diagnosing a concussion.  I will absolutely not let a player play with a tinted vistor.  With a white mouthguard, the player is suitably protected.  No, he's not legal by the rules, but I'm letting him play & letting him know he needs to fix it.  If he has no mouthguard, or it's been altered/cut down, he's not playing.

Uh oh, I'm not enforcing a rule in the rulebook


Offline AlUpstateNY

  • *
  • Posts: 4729
  • FAN REACTION: +341/-919
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #23 on: September 23, 2014, 12:47:58 PM »
Every now and then, the Rule Makers create a rule to be clear and simple for EVERYONE to understand, and straightfowrawd to enforce.  Uniform Adornments is a prime example; rather than itenize 10,000 allowable items they stated 2 permissable items (a specific sweatband & defined towel). 

Mouthpieces of any color combination known or imagined, with the very specific exceptions of pure white or clear are allowable, making the rule understandable and clear to any and all players, parents, coaches and even mouthpiece manufacturers.  Makes you wonder how, and perhaps why, such a problem even happens.  When that rule was added the notion was that eliminating white and clear mouthpieces would be a simple, standard way of determining whether or not a player was wearing a mouthpiece IF AND WHEN A QUESTION AROSE ABOUT ONE BEING PRESENT.

Sometimes it's just as easy, and practical, to follow a simple rule as it is to resist one.


Offline Eastshire

  • *
  • Posts: 92
  • FAN REACTION: +6/-2
Re: Mouthpiece
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2014, 07:05:37 AM »
THIS

Actually, it's very different from a tinted eyeshield, which makes it difficult to see the player's eyes and could prevent medical personnel from diagnosing a concussion.  I will absolutely not let a player play with a tinted vistor.  With a white mouthguard, the player is suitably protected.  No, he's not legal by the rules, but I'm letting him play & letting him know he needs to fix it.  If he has no mouthguard, or it's been altered/cut down, he's not playing.

Actually, it's not. The way it was explained to us at our soccer rules meeting was that clear and white mouthguards can be difficult to see if/when a player gets one lodged in the back of their throats. That could cause medical personnel a problem if they don't realize they need to clear the player's airway.