Championship Games

[MowerMan]

What motivation does an official have to continue to officiate if he has called a state championship game?

[Etref]

Work another one. I know some who have worked multiples.

Also continue to improve is a big motivation, none of us has ever worked a perfect game

[MowerMan]

My point is…..some want to limit how many championships an official can work. If an official has worked one, then what is his motivation to continue to officiate?

[JasonTX]

My point is…..some want to limit how many championships an official can work. If an official has worked one, then what is his motivation to continue to officiate?

That won't fly.  One per year is the rule.  No limit to a number in a career.

[JasonTX]

Is any of this documented somewhere, policies in place, etc? Because I’ve not seen anything even remotely close to that, written down anywhere.

Page 7 of the TASO football operating procedures.  They are in your members portal.

[dammitbobby]

The point isn’t to limit how many championship games an official can work - the ultimate goal is to get coaches out of the election process, and also to ensure that as many officials as possible have the opportunity to call a championship game.

If your objective, your goal, is solely to call a championship game, and you feel you have no other motivation to be an official, then IMO you’re doing this for the wrong reasons. Or at least, not the same reasons as me.

Like most officials, I’ll likely never call a championship game. If I do, great, but I’m still going to want to keep calling, and keep improving, and get better. I derive quite a bit of satisfaction from this avocation, and it’s not tied to just calling a championship game.

You may have other reasons, those are mine.

[dammitbobby]

Page 7 of the TASO football operating procedures.  They are in your members portal.

Can you send me a link, or point me to where it is located, tomorrow?  I've looked high and low for this and can't find it, even when searching.

Edit: Did find these on chapter websites (but can't find in TASO portal):

Tyler chapter:  http://tylerfootballofficials.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/TASO-Football-Operating-Procedures.pdf (this one looks dated though)

Fort Worth: https://www.fwfo.org/Forms/Upload/182.pdf  (doc says 2021, but file name is 2017)

[CosmoKramer]

It'll never be changed overnight.  But, two things TASO could do, that could hep set the stage for change in the future: 

1) Implement a rule that says crews/officials can only call one championship game/year.  'Sorry coach, the crew you wanted has already been requested, and they are therefore unavailable, pick again.'

2) Implement a more aggressive rule that says crews/officials can only officiate one championship game in a three-year cycle.  'Sorry coach, that crew/official worked a championship game 2 years ago, and are ineligible to call another one until after next year, pick again.'

TASO would have a much stronger leg to stand on, regarding changes, if they put something like 1 or 2 to a membership vote (to my knowledge, they have never done so, for anything).  That way if UIL/coaches complain, they could at least say, 'Hey, this is what our members - your game officials - wanted', and it would be less likely to be perceived as TAO leadership advocating for the change.

Option 2 gets you further down the road of change; option 1 causes less friction.

Unfortunately, I don't think TASO has any interest in advocating for any changes that would benefit those outside larger chapters.  I've been critical of TASO in the past, because I don't see the value that they provide to me as a member, in advocating for me, in areas like this.  Maybe they are, and if so, they are just doing an spectacularly bad job at communicating what all they are working on, that benefits all members. 

As it stands now, I have to pay a $65 tax every year, for which I get nothing (that I can see) in return.

Unfortunately you're not too far off on this take and your comments about TASO.  TASO is valuable in coordinating communications with the UIL and providing a centralized use of mechanics with the attempt for all to be consistent.  I can only image how bad, or inconsisten, things would be if TASO did not provide this guidance.  However, when it comes back to the process of allowing coaches to select officials TASO seems to elect to stay out of this process, unless it is to benefit someone directly.  Not to get in to it here but there's a specific reason why there's now a TASO rule stating you can only officiate one state championship game in a season.  It goes back several years ago when someone was requested for two games, he worked both games.  But, there is a value of what TASO provides it's members.  But I will also say this, it's certainly not for the insurance.  I've heard numerous recent stories of officials getting hurt officiating (not just football) only to have to deal with this insurance not paying out for said injury.  The insurance provided is pretty much useless. 

[Etref]

As I said before,
School Superintendents make up the UIL. The staffin Austin (Breitaupt,et al) work for them and are motivated to do what they want. The Superintendents want the control (coaches).

Would we all like to work a Championship game…… of course. Are we likely to……….nope.

[CosmoKramer]

As I said before,
School Superintendents make up the UIL. The staffin Austin (Breitaupt,et al) work for them and are motivated to do what they want. The Superintendents want the control (coaches).

Would we all like to work a Championship game…… of course. Are we likely to……….nope.

I do not disagree with anything you said.  My only comment in response is, as I've heard it stated by many others, if TASO wants to say they do not get involved with the coaches selection process then they should not of created their own policy stating officials can only work one state game a year.  That in itself is getting involved in what coaches might want and contradicts what TASO says they will not do.  Personally, I do not want to see an individual work multiple games.  But if it's up to the coaches, then leave it up to the coaches 100%. 

[Etref]

 

[JasonTX]

One group that isn't being mentioned is the THSCA.  Texas High School Coaches Association.  If a rule or policy doesn't have their blessing it will never see daylight.  That's the group who would have to agree with removing coaches from the assigning process, not the UIL.  Here's a trivia question.  Where is the UIL policy that states coaches are allowed to request officials by name?

Another tidbit.  Many of you remember the day when the "sixman" playoffs would use a split crew between the two chapters that had teams playing against each other.  What happened to doing that?  Well, the assignors at that time made a pact that we would no longer do that.  Coaches would have to choose one chapter.  Been that way for at least 10 years and there's not a rule that says they can't use split crews but the assignors made an agreement amongst themselves to not allow it.

[bctgp]

Please don't forget that the rules you are mentioning about limiting how many Championship games a crew can work in a season is something that is determined by the TASO Football Division Board.  This Board is primarily made up of elected members. If you want to change it then run for a position on the Board and build a consensus with others to make the change.

[CosmoKramer]

Please don't forget that the rules you are mentioning about limiting how many Championship games a crew can work in a season is something that is determined by the TASO Football Division Board.  This Board is primarily made up of elected members. If you want to change it then run for a position on the Board and build a consensus with others to make the change.

Now this statement is a little comical.  We all know there's no way a person in a smaller chapter can run for and win the election of President, Vice-President, etc.  This has been tried many times and the larger chapters have the voting majority that prevail.  That only leaves the district director and that itself also becomes political.  If fact, I know of one district that has an agreement in place that the director position will rotate among chapters and the chapter that is designated for the given period simply assigns the director.  There's no formal election process that takes place.  So getting on the Board is not as simple as running for a position. 

[JasonTX]

Now this statement is a little comical.  We all know there's no way a person in a smaller chapter can run for and win the election of President, Vice-President, etc.  This has been tried many times and the larger chapters have the voting majority that prevail.  That only leaves the district director and that itself also becomes political.  If fact, I know of one district that has an agreement in place that the director position will rotate among chapters and the chapter that is designated for the given period simply assigns the director.  There's no formal election process that takes place.  So getting on the Board is not as simple as running for a position.

The rotation of the district director position help the smaller chapters have representation.   Some districts have 3 or 4 chapters and within those is a bigger chapter that could run the table every election and the smaller chapters would never get to represent.  These are just "gentlemen's agreements"  and every election cycle those positions are still announced and anyone within those districts could still run if they wanted.  There are many opportunities to serve without being on the board. 

[TexDoc]

Here's a trivia question.  Where is the UIL policy that states coaches are allowed to request officials by name?

There is no such rule, per se.  What is does say, in effect, is that coaches must agree on officials.  Somewhere in our history, some chapters have interpreted that to mean coaches pick officials as a way of agreeing to them. 

[CosmoKramer]

There is no such rule, per se.  What is does say, in effect, is that coaches must agree on officials.  Somewhere in our history, some chapters have interpreted that to mean coaches pick officials as a way of agreeing to them.

Coaches must agree on officials show what ends up happening is the coaches will tell the chapter the officials, by name, they want/require and that if they don't get those specific individuals they take their services elsewhere.  And most chapter leaders then accommodate that request to avoid losing the game to another chapter.   

[ElvisLives]

Coaches must agree on officials show what ends up happening is the coaches will tell the chapter the officials, by name, they want/require and that if they don't get those specific individuals they take their services elsewhere.  And most chapter leaders then accommodate that request to avoid losing the game to another chapter.

That is what happens, alright.

[TexDoc]

Coaches must agree on officials show what ends up happening is the coaches will tell the chapter the officials, by name, they want/require and that if they don't get those specific individuals they take their services elsewhere.  And most chapter leaders then accommodate that request to avoid losing the game to another chapter.

That works during the playoffs, definitely.  But that doesn't work during regular season very well because a school expects a chapter to cover not only varsity but also all of the sub varsity games they have.  The schools in middle ground, between two chapters, have the ability to choose which of those chapter they will use, but that doesn't fly when the school is very near one chapter's center.  The travel distance, availability of officials from a more distant chapter, and extra pay for mileage quickly become factors.

[ElvisLives]

That works during the playoffs, definitely.  But that doesn't work during regular season very well because a school expects a chapter to cover not only varsity but also all of the sub varsity games they have.  The schools in middle ground, between two chapters, have the ability to choose which of those chapter they will use, but that doesn't fly when the school is very near one chapter's center.  The travel distance, availability of officials from a more distant chapter, and extra pay for mileage quickly become factors.

So, geography plays a factor? 


Of course it does, contrary to what some folks might think. Particularly after the 3rd round of playoffs, when the game sites tend to move within the I-35/I-45/I-10 triangle. If there are perfectly qualified folks within 50 miles, why pay for perfectly qualified folks that are 100 miles away? So, perfectly capable and qualified folks located in El Paso, Amarillo, Lubbock, Midland-Odessa, and other 'outlying' areas tend to get left out of the discussion. Not the officials' faults. It is a flaw in the system, which contributes to folks leaving the avocation. They don't have much incentive to continue to work hard to get these assignments. Officials have egos, too. They want the top assignments, and most are willing to make the effort required to earn those assignments. But, if simple geography virtually eliminates them from consideration, then, at some point, it just doesn't make sense to continue bustin' hump.

[JasonTX]

So, geography plays a factor? 


Of course it does, contrary to what some folks might think. Particularly after the 3rd round of playoffs, when the game sites tend to move within the I-35/I-45/I-10 triangle. If there are perfectly qualified folks within 50 miles, why pay for perfectly qualified folks that are 100 miles away? So, perfectly capable and qualified folks located in El Paso, Amarillo, Lubbock, Midland-Odessa, and other 'outlying' areas tend to get left out of the discussion. Not the officials' faults. It is a flaw in the system, which contributes to folks leaving the avocation. They don't have much incentive to continue to work hard to get these assignments. Officials have egos, too. They want the top assignments, and most are willing to make the effort required to earn those assignments. But, if simple geography virtually eliminates them from consideration, then, at some point, it just doesn't make sense to continue bustin' hump.

There are many stories such as what we experience and I'm sure all chapters see the same thing, especially those that you just named.  There was a 3rd round game in my backyard, not far from Oklahoma, and the two teams went with a chapter near the ocean.  It doesn't make any sense to me to bypass several chapters who are a whole lot closer and "neutral" chapters at that, in order to get one that is the furthest away.  I know a lot of it is superstitions by coaches.  I've seen a ton of playoff games by nearly all the chapters in person, and there really isn't a distinguishable difference.  Maybe one day the coaches will realize we all follow the same rules and wear the same type of uniform.