Author Topic: Championship Games  (Read 1750 times)

SCline and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline MowerMan

  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • FAN REACTION: +0/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #25 on: January 11, 2022, 08:08:52 PM »
What motivation does an official have to continue to officiate if he has called a state championship game?

Online Etref

  • Administrator
  • ***
  • Posts: 2113
  • FAN REACTION: +77/-23
  • " I don't make the rules coach!"
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #26 on: January 11, 2022, 08:53:25 PM »
Work another one. I know some who have worked multiples.

Also continue to improve is a big motivation, none of us has ever worked a perfect game
" I don't make the rules coach!"

Offline MowerMan

  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • FAN REACTION: +0/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #27 on: January 11, 2022, 09:48:41 PM »
My point is…..some want to limit how many championships an official can work. If an official has worked one, then what is his motivation to continue to officiate?

Offline JasonTX

  • *
  • Posts: 2661
  • FAN REACTION: +105/-51
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #28 on: January 11, 2022, 10:23:17 PM »
My point is…..some want to limit how many championships an official can work. If an official has worked one, then what is his motivation to continue to officiate?

That won't fly.  One per year is the rule.  No limit to a number in a career.

Offline JasonTX

  • *
  • Posts: 2661
  • FAN REACTION: +105/-51
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #29 on: January 11, 2022, 10:24:32 PM »
Is any of this documented somewhere, policies in place, etc? Because I’ve not seen anything even remotely close to that, written down anywhere.

Page 7 of the TASO football operating procedures.  They are in your members portal.

Offline dammitbobby

  • *
  • Posts: 628
  • FAN REACTION: +14/-7
  • I know just enough to be dangerous...
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #30 on: January 11, 2022, 10:26:57 PM »
The point isn’t to limit how many championship games an official can work - the ultimate goal is to get coaches out of the election process, and also to ensure that as many officials as possible have the opportunity to call a championship game.

If your objective, your goal, is solely to call a championship game, and you feel you have no other motivation to be an official, then IMO you’re doing this for the wrong reasons. Or at least, not the same reasons as me.

Like most officials, I’ll likely never call a championship game. If I do, great, but I’m still going to want to keep calling, and keep improving, and get better. I derive quite a bit of satisfaction from this avocation, and it’s not tied to just calling a championship game.

You may have other reasons, those are mine.

Offline dammitbobby

  • *
  • Posts: 628
  • FAN REACTION: +14/-7
  • I know just enough to be dangerous...
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #31 on: January 11, 2022, 10:54:58 PM »
Page 7 of the TASO football operating procedures.  They are in your members portal.

Can you send me a link, or point me to where it is located, tomorrow?  I've looked high and low for this and can't find it, even when searching.

Edit: Did find these on chapter websites (but can't find in TASO portal):

Tyler chapter:  http://tylerfootballofficials.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/TASO-Football-Operating-Procedures.pdf (this one looks dated though)

Fort Worth: https://www.fwfo.org/Forms/Upload/182.pdf  (doc says 2021, but file name is 2017)



« Last Edit: January 11, 2022, 11:08:49 PM by dammitbobby »

Offline CosmoKramer

  • *
  • Posts: 43
  • FAN REACTION: +3/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #32 on: January 12, 2022, 11:41:45 AM »
It'll never be changed overnight.  But, two things TASO could do, that could hep set the stage for change in the future: 

1) Implement a rule that says crews/officials can only call one championship game/year.  'Sorry coach, the crew you wanted has already been requested, and they are therefore unavailable, pick again.'

2) Implement a more aggressive rule that says crews/officials can only officiate one championship game in a three-year cycle.  'Sorry coach, that crew/official worked a championship game 2 years ago, and are ineligible to call another one until after next year, pick again.'

TASO would have a much stronger leg to stand on, regarding changes, if they put something like 1 or 2 to a membership vote (to my knowledge, they have never done so, for anything).  That way if UIL/coaches complain, they could at least say, 'Hey, this is what our members - your game officials - wanted', and it would be less likely to be perceived as TAO leadership advocating for the change.

Option 2 gets you further down the road of change; option 1 causes less friction.

Unfortunately, I don't think TASO has any interest in advocating for any changes that would benefit those outside larger chapters.  I've been critical of TASO in the past, because I don't see the value that they provide to me as a member, in advocating for me, in areas like this.  Maybe they are, and if so, they are just doing an spectacularly bad job at communicating what all they are working on, that benefits all members. 

As it stands now, I have to pay a $65 tax every year, for which I get nothing (that I can see) in return.

Unfortunately you're not too far off on this take and your comments about TASO.  TASO is valuable in coordinating communications with the UIL and providing a centralized use of mechanics with the attempt for all to be consistent.  I can only image how bad, or inconsisten, things would be if TASO did not provide this guidance.  However, when it comes back to the process of allowing coaches to select officials TASO seems to elect to stay out of this process, unless it is to benefit someone directly.  Not to get in to it here but there's a specific reason why there's now a TASO rule stating you can only officiate one state championship game in a season.  It goes back several years ago when someone was requested for two games, he worked both games.  But, there is a value of what TASO provides it's members.  But I will also say this, it's certainly not for the insurance.  I've heard numerous recent stories of officials getting hurt officiating (not just football) only to have to deal with this insurance not paying out for said injury.  The insurance provided is pretty much useless. 

Online Etref

  • Administrator
  • ***
  • Posts: 2113
  • FAN REACTION: +77/-23
  • " I don't make the rules coach!"
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #33 on: January 12, 2022, 02:22:56 PM »
As I said before,
School Superintendents make up the UIL. The staffin Austin (Breitaupt,et al) work for them and are motivated to do what they want. The Superintendents want the control (coaches).

Would we all like to work a Championship game…… of course. Are we likely to……….nope.
" I don't make the rules coach!"

Offline CosmoKramer

  • *
  • Posts: 43
  • FAN REACTION: +3/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #34 on: January 12, 2022, 04:05:46 PM »
As I said before,
School Superintendents make up the UIL. The staffin Austin (Breitaupt,et al) work for them and are motivated to do what they want. The Superintendents want the control (coaches).

Would we all like to work a Championship game…… of course. Are we likely to……….nope.

I do not disagree with anything you said.  My only comment in response is, as I've heard it stated by many others, if TASO wants to say they do not get involved with the coaches selection process then they should not of created their own policy stating officials can only work one state game a year.  That in itself is getting involved in what coaches might want and contradicts what TASO says they will not do.  Personally, I do not want to see an individual work multiple games.  But if it's up to the coaches, then leave it up to the coaches 100%. 

Online Etref

  • Administrator
  • ***
  • Posts: 2113
  • FAN REACTION: +77/-23
  • " I don't make the rules coach!"
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #35 on: January 12, 2022, 04:34:53 PM »
 :thumbup
" I don't make the rules coach!"

Offline JasonTX

  • *
  • Posts: 2661
  • FAN REACTION: +105/-51
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #36 on: January 12, 2022, 06:33:17 PM »
One group that isn't being mentioned is the THSCA.  Texas High School Coaches Association.  If a rule or policy doesn't have their blessing it will never see daylight.  That's the group who would have to agree with removing coaches from the assigning process, not the UIL.  Here's a trivia question.  Where is the UIL policy that states coaches are allowed to request officials by name?

Another tidbit.  Many of you remember the day when the "sixman" playoffs would use a split crew between the two chapters that had teams playing against each other.  What happened to doing that?  Well, the assignors at that time made a pact that we would no longer do that.  Coaches would have to choose one chapter.  Been that way for at least 10 years and there's not a rule that says they can't use split crews but the assignors made an agreement amongst themselves to not allow it.

Offline bctgp

  • *
  • Posts: 219
  • FAN REACTION: +5/-10
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #37 on: January 12, 2022, 11:38:27 PM »
Please don't forget that the rules you are mentioning about limiting how many Championship games a crew can work in a season is something that is determined by the TASO Football Division Board.  This Board is primarily made up of elected members. If you want to change it then run for a position on the Board and build a consensus with others to make the change.

Offline CosmoKramer

  • *
  • Posts: 43
  • FAN REACTION: +3/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #38 on: January 13, 2022, 11:07:55 AM »
Please don't forget that the rules you are mentioning about limiting how many Championship games a crew can work in a season is something that is determined by the TASO Football Division Board.  This Board is primarily made up of elected members. If you want to change it then run for a position on the Board and build a consensus with others to make the change.

Now this statement is a little comical.  We all know there's no way a person in a smaller chapter can run for and win the election of President, Vice-President, etc.  This has been tried many times and the larger chapters have the voting majority that prevail.  That only leaves the district director and that itself also becomes political.  If fact, I know of one district that has an agreement in place that the director position will rotate among chapters and the chapter that is designated for the given period simply assigns the director.  There's no formal election process that takes place.  So getting on the Board is not as simple as running for a position. 

Offline JasonTX

  • *
  • Posts: 2661
  • FAN REACTION: +105/-51
Re: Championship Games
« Reply #39 on: January 13, 2022, 01:27:35 PM »
Now this statement is a little comical.  We all know there's no way a person in a smaller chapter can run for and win the election of President, Vice-President, etc.  This has been tried many times and the larger chapters have the voting majority that prevail.  That only leaves the district director and that itself also becomes political.  If fact, I know of one district that has an agreement in place that the director position will rotate among chapters and the chapter that is designated for the given period simply assigns the director.  There's no formal election process that takes place.  So getting on the Board is not as simple as running for a position.

The rotation of the district director position help the smaller chapters have representation.   Some districts have 3 or 4 chapters and within those is a bigger chapter that could run the table every election and the smaller chapters would never get to represent.  These are just "gentlemen's agreements"  and every election cycle those positions are still announced and anyone within those districts could still run if they wanted.  There are many opportunities to serve without being on the board.