Author Topic: Advice needed  (Read 12171 times)

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Offline SCHSref

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Advice needed
« on: November 07, 2014, 11:50:03 AM »
So, I just ended my 2nd year officiating (LJ) and love it.  I really want to get to the next level (officiating Friday night games) and sometimes that is very difficult with the way things are set up (not complaining, just explaining  ;) ) and wanted some advice from you veterans.  There is an abundance of LJs in our state and Back Judges are needed, so I was thinking about switching to that position in order to up my chances of Friday night games. 

With all that being said, is there anything that you can post on here (besides the obvious "Read the rule book") mechanics or tricks of the trade (help remembering certain nuances of the rules) that can help me?

Thank you in advance and I wish everyone participating in playoffs safety, wisdom, and humility in your upcoming games.

God speed!
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Offline HLinNC

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2014, 12:19:48 PM »
It makes sense to switch positions if there is a greater need.  You can always work wing.  I never worked enough BJ to feel comfortable back there but could do it in a pinch if needed.

Pick out the best BJ in your group and pick his brain.  Since the playoffs are starting, tag along with crews as they advance, if they will let you, and watch them.  Join study groups if you have them this spring.

Don't know the local politics there but one of the things that held me back was I didn't know the ins and outs til a friend sat me down and asked me if I was interested in moving up.  I said sure.  He said, "well the fellas say you don't ride with them on Friday nights so they don't think you are interested."  I told him that I misunderstood, that my assumption was when I was considered good enough I would be notified to move up.  I got told quick that my skills were there but I needed to hobnob and be social to see if I "fit in".
The next season I rode to a couple of road trips and got voted up at the end of the season.

Offline SCHSref

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2014, 12:55:55 PM »
It makes sense to switch positions if there is a greater need.  You can always work wing.  I never worked enough BJ to feel comfortable back there but could do it in a pinch if needed.

Pick out the best BJ in your group and pick his brain.  Since the playoffs are starting, tag along with crews as they advance, if they will let you, and watch them.  Join study groups if you have them this spring.

Don't know the local politics there but one of the things that held me back was I didn't know the ins and outs til a friend sat me down and asked me if I was interested in moving up.  I said sure.  He said, "well the fellas say you don't ride with them on Friday nights so they don't think you are interested."  I told him that I misunderstood, that my assumption was when I was considered good enough I would be notified to move up.  I got told quick that my skills were there but I needed to hobnob and be social to see if I "fit in".
The next season I rode to a couple of road trips and got voted up at the end of the season.

Thanks for the advice   pHiNzuP  It has been explained to me like this:  The officials are chosen for the games based on a ratings system.  They start at the top and assign the 4A games first, 3A next, 2A, and then 1A.  If you are way down on the list due to your ratings, then you are not likely to be picked.  One of the things that kills my rating is my lack of experience and the fact that I have never been rated/evaluated for a game due to the fact that I have never had one.   hEaDbAnG
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Offline TampaSteve

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2014, 03:11:51 PM »
it never hurts to learn/know to work more than one position.  Goodness, I encourage you to learn them all.

With experience too comes knowing the game, what to call, what not to, game management, etc. - you can read/learn all the rules, learn all the mechanics, but these nuances, depending on who you are, come in time

Offline TampaSteve

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2014, 03:15:58 PM »
Thanks for the advice   pHiNzuP  It has been explained to me like this:  The officials are chosen for the games based on a ratings system.  They start at the top and assign the 4A games first, 3A next, 2A, and then 1A.  If you are way down on the list due to your ratings, then you are not likely to be picked.  One of the things that kills my rating is my lack of experience and the fact that I have never been rated/evaluated for a game due to the fact that I have never had one.   hEaDbAnG
in as far as evaluated: get your games if you can & send them to your assn evaluator...heck send them to me if you want.  I'll give you feedback if you want.
But once you get the feedback, what you do with it is key..

Offline SD_Casey

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2014, 09:47:01 AM »
I'm just a pup myself so keep that in mind when you're reading this.  It's all still pretty fresh for me though so maybe a valid perspective?  I'm not anybody important but I might be able to contribute from my very limited experiences since I am right down there in the muck with you.

I live in South Dakota so there are probably some pretty major differences in population, school sizes, etc. but hopefully some of this can be applied.  I just finished my fourth season.  This season was my first year as Referee and Crew Chief.  Our crew earned a first round playoff game and a second round playoff game (quarterfinal).  I worked at what I would probably equate with being 2A in your state.  The higher end of the lower tier.

1 You did say no useless platitudes but one thing I think guys overlook is always being available for any assignment at all when you're needed.  For the past few years, when my region coordinator e-mails me and says "I need another official on Saturday morning for the 8th grade consolation scrimmage down at the School for the Blind.  You have to wear knickers and you'll be working 2-man mechanics."  I reply "send me the game time.  I will be there."  Short, sweet and to the point.  I will do what is needed WHEN it is needed, no questions asked.  Those guys appreciate having somebody they can count on.

2 Go to a clinic.  In SD we have our own High School clinic.  Our clinic ( http://www.siouxempirefootballofficials.com/ ) is a 5 man clinic but it isn't one of the ones where you go to 'strut your stuff.'  It's all business.  We go there to get better.  I can't even explain how helpful it having an experienced official (NFL, Pac12, Big10 etc) shadowing you on every play.  They are literally standing 5 feet behind you and giving feedback on your calls and mechanics and just as importantly, philosophy.  Also, I got to hold a Super Bowl ring  :bOW

3 Get extra reps at scrimmages and "Jamborees".  What is it they say about Luck?  It's only opportunity and preparation?  You never know when you'll get very VERY lucky. This past summer we held a Jamboree (scrimmage with officials) on a Saturday morning.  There were a bunch of 25 year vets and state evaluators there to help us get better.  I was the only one who showed up at my position.  Mmmm.  All those reps!  eAt& and nobody to share them with.

4 When you're working some of the lower-level stuff, practice your intangibles.  Definitely call the game but practice something else relevant to your position while you're there.  I go down and work youth league games.  I know there's a lot of hate for youth league games on this board but I think they're a great place to practice things other than making calls.  I don't go there looking for holding fouls (though there are plenty of those!)  I go there to work on game flow.  I work on trying to keep the game running smoothly with the same amount of time between snaps.  I try doing different things with my pre-snap routine.  I work on giving crisp signals.  I get extra practice handling coaches.  Or when I get the call to go work a Jr High game on a Saturday morning at one of the bigger schools, I tell the game admin to bust out the field mic so I can practice my microphone mechanics.  Always be working on something else in addition  to calling the game.

I hope some of this helps.  I'm no sage (barely an acolyte) but it's been working for me so far.

Good Luck and God Bless.

Casey
« Last Edit: November 10, 2014, 09:49:02 AM by SD_Casey »

Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2014, 09:53:54 AM »
I just finished my fourth season.  This season was my first year as Referee and Crew Chief. 
Wow!  For most officials in Georgia (at least in the Metro area), you don't even see a Varsity field until year 3  unless it's as an ECO, penalty charter or on a chain crew.

But I love your advice about being available.  90% of success is showing up.

Offline SD_Casey

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Re: Re: Advice needed
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2014, 11:06:16 AM »
Wow!  For most officials in Georgia (at least in the Metro area), you don't even see a Varsity field until year 3  unless it's as an ECO, penalty charter or on a chain crew.

But I love your advice about being available.  90% of success is showing up.
Most of our R's up here are what you would expect.  I am a bit of an outlier.  Don't get the wrong idea about us guys up here in the tundra.

But just like AB said. It's about showing up. 

Going to all of these junior high games when needed led to an assigner calling me in a panic when he needed somebody to work a scrimmage for a local college and he needed somebody there in the next 60 minutes.

I showed up and worked hard and got a phone call for the next scrimmage. And the next. And then spring games.

The "powers that be" are people too. And they all know each other.  If you can earn a reputation as somebody who is talented and always willing to help out, that gets remembered and rewarded.

Take Atlanta Blue's advice and be the guy who shows up.

Offline Curious

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2014, 11:18:39 AM »
Wow!  For most officials in Georgia (at least in the Metro area), you don't even see a Varsity field until year 3  unless it's as an ECO, penalty charter or on a chain crew.

But I love your advice about being available.  90% of success is showing up.

We've got 3rd and 4th year officials doing state finals here (Michigan) :!#....

Speaks to a number of issues - but mostly to a shortage of younger officials and a clearly conscious, yet unspoken, attempt to have more minorities working tournament games.  Before anybody jumps down my neck, I don't feel the latter is necessarily a bad thing; but I also don't believe newer officials, in general, are properly evaluated (i.e., adequately observed) to be assigned at this (tournament) level.

I also strongly believe that newer officials lack the experience to handle the pressure of such assignments; and, being thrust into the "boiling pot" does not serve them well.


Offline VALJ

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2014, 12:14:02 PM »
We've got 3rd and 4th year officials doing state finals here (Michigan) :!#....

Yikes.  I didn't feel like I had a real feel for what I was doing until I was in my 5th or 6th year.  Might be time to think about moving to Michigan...  :)

Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: Re: Advice needed
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2014, 12:56:40 PM »
Take Atlanta Blue's advice and be the guy who shows up.
It was your (excellent) advice.  I just added a quote to it.  One of the failings of being a coach:  putting things into quotes, sayings, pneunomic devices helps players to remember them ("A field goal is just a punt that can score.")  Figure it might work for officials as well.

Offline SCHSref

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2014, 12:59:15 PM »
I'm just a pup myself so keep that in mind when you're reading this.  It's all still pretty fresh for me though so maybe a valid perspective?  I'm not anybody important but I might be able to contribute from my very limited experiences since I am right down there in the muck with you.

I live in South Dakota so there are probably some pretty major differences in population, school sizes, etc. but hopefully some of this can be applied.  I just finished my fourth season.  This season was my first year as Referee and Crew Chief.  Our crew earned a first round playoff game and a second round playoff game (quarterfinal).  I worked at what I would probably equate with being 2A in your state.  The higher end of the lower tier.

1 You did say no useless platitudes but one thing I think guys overlook is always being available for any assignment at all when you're needed.  For the past few years, when my region coordinator e-mails me and says "I need another official on Saturday morning for the 8th grade consolation scrimmage down at the School for the Blind.  You have to wear knickers and you'll be working 2-man mechanics."  I reply "send me the game time.  I will be there."  Short, sweet and to the point.  I will do what is needed WHEN it is needed, no questions asked.  Those guys appreciate having somebody they can count on.

2 Go to a clinic.  In SD we have our own High School clinic.  Our clinic ( http://www.siouxempirefootballofficials.com/ ) is a 5 man clinic but it isn't one of the ones where you go to 'strut your stuff.'  It's all business.  We go there to get better.  I can't even explain how helpful it having an experienced official (NFL, Pac12, Big10 etc) shadowing you on every play.  They are literally standing 5 feet behind you and giving feedback on your calls and mechanics and just as importantly, philosophy.  Also, I got to hold a Super Bowl ring  :bOW

3 Get extra reps at scrimmages and "Jamborees".  What is it they say about Luck?  It's only opportunity and preparation?  You never know when you'll get very VERY lucky. This past summer we held a Jamboree (scrimmage with officials) on a Saturday morning.  There were a bunch of 25 year vets and state evaluators there to help us get better.  I was the only one who showed up at my position.  Mmmm.  All those reps!  eAt& and nobody to share them with.

4 When you're working some of the lower-level stuff, practice your intangibles.  Definitely call the game but practice something else relevant to your position while you're there.  I go down and work youth league games.  I know there's a lot of hate for youth league games on this board but I think they're a great place to practice things other than making calls.  I don't go there looking for holding fouls (though there are plenty of those!)  I go there to work on game flow.  I work on trying to keep the game running smoothly with the same amount of time between snaps.  I try doing different things with my pre-snap routine.  I work on giving crisp signals.  I get extra practice handling coaches.  Or when I get the call to go work a Jr High game on a Saturday morning at one of the bigger schools, I tell the game admin to bust out the field mic so I can practice my microphone mechanics.  Always be working on something else in addition  to calling the game.

I hope some of this helps.  I'm no sage (barely an acolyte) but it's been working for me so far.

Good Luck and God Bless.

Casey

Your advice is well received.   aWaRd  Thanks!
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Offline SCHSref

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2014, 01:02:36 PM »
Yes...I have never turned down a game and even took on a double header at the very last moment.  I have been told that if we ever turn a varsity game down (of course for reasons other than death, illness, or emergency) prepare not to get one for a while.  Of course, I haven't had that opportunity to turn one down yet. 

We are not in crews either...we are individually assigned.  Maybe that was brought up in another thread...ugh..head hurts...
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Offline SCHSref

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2014, 01:05:30 PM »
BTW, I spread some karma...the good kind...in the thread.  Thanks for the repsonses
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justbill

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2014, 07:27:40 AM »
As has been mentioned, take as many games as you can and be available.  In addition to being someone people can rely on, the more snaps you see, the "slower" the game feels and makes your own game that much better.

Know the rules, but also the mechanics.  Know how to be in the right place at the right time.

Learn the difference between hustling and hurrying.  Move with a purpose.

At the lower level games, work all of the positions.  Try not to get tied to one too much.  Having everyone else's perspective will enhance your ability to work your primary position

Make sure you are in shape and, as important, look like you are in shape.

Above all, make sure you are controlling the things you can control and don't get caught up in the things you cannot control.  If you work hard, things will happen in time.

Offline Rulesman

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2014, 08:02:13 AM »
Might be time to think about moving to Michigan...  :)
I couldn't stand the winters. Where's the beach?  ;D
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Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2014, 08:56:12 AM »
And when I teach baseball umpiring clinics, one of the cardinal rules that I teach:

Know what the rule MEANS, not what the rule SAYS.

Some of that comes with time and experience, which goes back to getting game experience.

I was assigning umpires for a travel ball league.  I had a double header one day that I was going to work, but I was short umpires.  I brought up a guy from that did Little League games that had shown promise.  We are in game 2, he has the plate.  It is a misty, miserable day, and the home team is killing the visitors.  We aren't yet to the run rule, but we are on our way.  Ball hit to the shortstop, who bobbles it and can't make the play.  Shortstop throws the ball back to the visiting pitcher.  There is some dirt on it, so he rubs the ball on his shirt to get the dirt off.

At the end of the inning, the plate ump comes out to me and asks, "Did you miss that balk?"

"What balk?"

"Since I'm not used to balks, I really studied all the balk rules last night.  Rubbing the ball on your uniform is a balk."

I told him I would kick his tail back to Little League if he ever called a balk like that.

1.  No one gained an advantage.
2.  It was a harmless move that actually helped the umpire from having to throw in a new ball and wipe down the other one himself.
3.  We were game 2 of a double header among two obviously mismatched teams.
4.  NO ONE GAINED AN ADVANTAGE!

Was he technically correct? Yep, it's right there in 8.02-a-3: The pitcher shall not rub the ball on his glove, person or clothing;  But WHY does the rule exist?  To keep a pitcher from defacing the ball.  By knowing what the rule MEANS, you would never call this a balk.  But if you only know what it SAYS, you'll ruin a good game (or in this case, a bad game) with a call like that.

You can apply the same thing to a hundred different situations in football as well.  Holding, being inside the nines after the RFP, coach stepping over the sideline to signal in a play, etc. etc.  All of these are fouls by the book.  But they MIGHT or might not be fouls in your game.  Knowing when they are and when they aren't is a key part of becoming a good official, and learning the difference only comes with game experience.

Know the rule book backward and forward, but don't be a rule book official.

Offline bama_stripes

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2014, 12:33:46 PM »
Know the rule book backward and forward, but don't be a rule book official.

One of the best pieces of advice I got when I started lo those many years ago:
"Call with the book, not by the book."

Offline theunofficialofficial

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2014, 12:53:17 PM »
And when I teach baseball umpiring clinics, one of the cardinal rules that I teach:

Know what the rule MEANS, not what the rule SAYS.

Some of that comes with time and experience, which goes back to getting game experience.
...

Know the rule book backward and forward, but don't be a rule book official.

Anyone have any good books, resources that go into the philosophy of the rule and not always the letter? Obviously time and experience are great ways to learn that, but sometimes finding a good resource is great for off season study.

Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2014, 12:54:25 PM »
For football, the Redding's Guide.

And avoid Referee Ragazine at all costs.

Offline VALJ

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #20 on: November 11, 2014, 01:06:25 PM »
Know the rule book backward and forward, but don't be a rule book official.

The VP of training in our association told us at every single meeting, "the rulebook is written in black and white.  Football is played in shades of grey.  The more shades of grey you can see, the better you'll be as a football official."

He also said every other week or so about something we covered that would be considered ticky-tacky: "You may know the rules chapter and verse, and call that {ticky tack thing}, and you could be the best non-working official we have in this association."

Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2014, 03:02:31 PM »
As we say about baseball, "The rule book is written by gentlemen, for gentlemen, not by lawyers, for lawyers."

Offline James

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2014, 03:47:09 AM »
The VP of training in our association told us at every single meeting, "the rulebook is written in black and white.  Football is played in shades of grey.  The more shades of grey you can see, the better you'll be as a football official."

Interesting that you say that. I just got back from my clinic (our year is finished) and the goal there was to get more consistency in the different areas. One of the things that was said was -

'Black and White calls we all get, it is the grey where we have trouble. We want to reduce the range of grey so that we are all calling the same thing every week.'

More shades of grey is correct - but it is also correct that everyone uses the same greyding (Pun - grading... oh never mind) scale.

Offline Atlanta Blue

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2014, 06:29:06 AM »
If you ask my wife, there are 50 shades of gray.  But that's another story.

Offline VALJ

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Re: Advice needed
« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2014, 08:44:07 AM »
If you ask my wife, there are 50 shades of gray.  But that's another story.

Hey-ooooooooooo!

Can your wife call mine to discuss, please?   yEs: