Rule Change Suggestions

[HLTN]

1.  Allow some contact fouls to be called USC.  These would apply to pushes, shoves, etc after the ball is dead.  This would those penalties a little more teeth and allow them to count toward a disqualification. 

2.  Some fouls by A behind the LOS should be penalized from the previous spot. 

3.  Ban all blocks below the waist.

4.  Here in TN, we are using the 40/25 second play clock.  I would like to start the clock when the ball is set after out of bounds plays.

5.  Make all face mask penalties 15 yards.

[ilyazhito]

That's why I'd limit it to the 15-yard penalties. NCAA does, anyway.

[AlUpstateNY]

Football is a (great) game involving intense physical contact, played by people between the ages of 8 and 60+, that depending on the Level, have dramatically different secondary objectives.

Considering the significant maturity, physical development, talent and skill differences, it seems both logical and rational to tailor the governing rules of play to better fit progressive levels.

[VALJ]

Not a rule change, but can we get an editorial clarification to the new rule about fouls under two minutes?  Even after a full season, there are still an awful lot of officials who interpret this as "the offended team can start the clock on the ready if the clock would normally start on the snap."  Those of us in the NFHS group on Facebook see this at least once a week, and this week alone there are three separate threads about it...

I'm definitely in favor of allowing contact USC fouls after the play is over, instead of having to enforce it as a personal foul.  There's a difference between a kid who isn't paying attention and hits a kid late, and a kid shoving someone because he's tired of getting his butt handed to him and trying to start some garbage.

And I hope every year to see the rule changed from "7 on the line" to "4 or less in the backfield".  If A only has 10 men on the field, they're already at a disadvantage. Throwing a flag for a 6-man line when there are only 10 kids on the field seems like we're punishing them for putting themselves at a disadvantage.  And heck, if a team can have 6 on the line, 4 in the backfield, and still gain yards, then B should be ashamed of themselves anyway.

[Ralph Damren]

I've brought this one up before with no luck, but I'm still hopeful.

Make it a foul to have more than 4 in the backfield rather than less than 7 on the line.  When A operates with 6 on the line and 4 in the backfield, they're already at a disadvantage - why punish them twice?  In prior years, I believe the rationale for not accepting this is "It doesn't help anyone except the officials who would rather count to 4 than to 7."  Given the other changes that make our jobs more difficult, what's wrong with one that helps us out?   

It's been on the final docket a couple of times but has failed to get a super (67%) majority. I have always been a strong supporter of it, as have many of the active officials that are state reps, but to no avail.

[Ralph Damren]

Holding on A is 10 yd penalty from previous spot instead of spot of the foul.

The high majority feeling (including mine) is that the All-But-One principle if both fair and simple. The hold occurring in the backfield may have freed the QB sack or a runner's loss of yardage and deserves to remain a spot foul. A change would benefit the offense which, in the opinion of many, doesn't need any benefits.

[Ralph Damren]

Personally, I think the NCAA and the NFL already have too many penalties against the D that are AFD. Not in favor of expanding them to NFHS.

Agree fully. At their levels alumni support and ticket sales are the prime objective. High scoring offenses help fuel that. At our level, safety, simplicity , and fair balance between offense & defense are the prime objectives. The roughing fouls (passer/kicker/holder/snapper) carry an awarded first down as they are contact with a defenseless player. Many feel if all PFs by B carried an AFD that it would dilute the severity of the roughing fouls.

I've been on the NFHS Rules Committee since 1992 and have learned that : "We should do it because the big boys do (NCAA & NFL) !!" is never a good reason for a rule change. I recall when the NCAA had the halo rule on punts. In was about to come to the floor for a final vote when a NCAA rep who attends our meetings asked to speak. He announced that the NCAA was about to remove the rule as coaches were playing games with it. WHOOPS...I guess we don't want that one!!! Many of us said. l

[bama_stripes]

I've been on the NFHS Rules Committee since 1992 and have learned that : "We should do it because the big boys do (NCAA & NFL) !!" is never a good reason for a rule change.

The reverse of that is: “Just because we don’t want to mirror the NCAA is never a good reason NOT to change a rule.”  And yet that’s the perception many of us have about some of the RC members.

It boggles my mind that 33%+ of the RC would have a problem with the “4 backs” change, especially since (if we’re honest with ourselves) that’s how a majority of officials are counting anyway.

[FLAHL]

It boggles my mind that 33%+ of the RC would have a problem with the “4 backs” change, especially since (if we’re honest with ourselves) that’s how a majority of officials are counting anyway.

+1 Bama

That's what I did when I was a wing official.  If the R & U signaled that they had 11 on offense, I made sure there were no more than 4 in the backfield.

[bbeagle]

I've been on the NFHS Rules Committee since 1992 and have learned that : "We should do it because the big boys do (NCAA & NFL) !!" is never a good reason for a rule change.

I completely disagree.

Players, coaches and fans all know the NCAA/NFL rules, because they watch them on TV. Fans don't have access to the NFHS rules. Players and coaches want to play, not study differences.

The referees look horrible to the players, coaches and fans when a rule in NFHS is properly enforced but looks completely wrong because of what they've seen in NCAA, NFL. Some games get out of control just for this reason.

For example, we had a game this year where a home team player was grabbed by his collar, pulled to the side, and he broke the tackle and ran 5 more yards. We didn't call the horse collar, correctly, which would have been a foul in NCAA/NFL, but not in NFHS. They punted shortly thereafter, where R muffed the ball at the 5 yard line, wild scramble for the ball and K recovered 2 yards deep in the end zone. During the fumble, just before the recovery, the BJ blew his whistle as the ball crossed the goal line. Right call in NFHS. To the fans it looked like we had an early whistle. Fans screamed at the refs for being idiots blowing the whistle too early. So, so far according to the fans in a few minutes time, we blew 2 calls. The first one, ironically, the NFHS is LESS concerned about safety, the other one is not a safety issue at all.

A little later, we had the home team's QB scramble around in the backfield looking to throw on a 3rd and 10, 2 deep receivers were knocked down. The QB was sacked on the play. We had nothing since there was no pass thrown. This is another where NFHS is LESS concerned about safety.

After that, the fans were rabid the entire game since we were obviously poor officials. It was caused by rule differences that don't need to be rule differences.

[CalhounLJ]

I agree that the differences between the rules gives us grief. However, I disagree that we should write NFHS rules based on fan ignorance. IF anything, we should do a better job of communicating to the coaches, players, fans, and announcers. I have called intentional grounding 3 times this year where the QB threw the ball away outside the tackle box and in each case, all hell broke loose. That's not my fault. It's due to a lack of understanding of the rules of football. The sad thing is, the coaches are the worst ones. My opinion is that a football coach should have to take a rules test to qualify to teach, just like a math teacher has to take a profiency test to teach math...

Oh well, that's my rant for the day. Ya'll have a great night tonight..

[SCHSref]

I agree that the differences between the rules gives us grief. However, I disagree that we should write NFHS rules based on fan ignorance. IF anything, we should do a better job of communicating to the coaches, players, fans, and announcers. I have called intentional grounding 3 times this year where the QB threw the ball away outside the tackle box and in each case, all HECK broke loose. That's not my fault. It's due to a lack of understanding of the rules of football. The sad thing is, the coaches are the worst ones. My opinion is that a football coach should have to take a rules test to qualify to teach, just like a math teacher has to take a profiency test to teach math...

Oh well, that's my rant for the day. Ya'll have a great night tonight..

Had a subvarsity game last night. Threw a flag for USC on B. A got half the distance to the goal, but now 3rd down. Coach didn't understand why it wasn't an automatic first. Kept yelling at me on the field while the team is trying to run a play. At half, I ran over there and told him the only penalties that were auto-first downs, especially on Thursdays and Fridays.  He didn't like it, but he couldn't argue it.

Every year, officials have clinics and tests to ensure that they know the rules and can enforce them properly. That is a good thing.

If I had my druthers, I would require EVERY  head coach to get with an official in their district and hold a mandatory rules clinic for the coaching staff. It might mitigate some of the flags on coaches as well as help them to communicate the rules to the players.

[FLAHL]

If I had my druthers, I would require EVERY  head coach to get with an official in their district and hold a mandatory rules clinic for the coaching staff. It might mitigate some of the flags on coaches as well as help them to communicate the rules to the players.

We tried this more than once.  "If you hold it, they will come," does NOT apply to coaches and rules clinics.

[brettjr2005]

I completely disagree.

Players, coaches and fans all know the NCAA/NFL rules, because they watch them on TV. Fans don't have access to the NFHS rules. Players and coaches want to play, not study differences.

The referees look horrible to the players, coaches and fans when a rule in NFHS is properly enforced but looks completely wrong because of what they've seen in NCAA, NFL. Some games get out of control just for this reason.

For example, we had a game this year where a home team player was grabbed by his collar, pulled to the side, and he broke the tackle and ran 5 more yards. We didn't call the horse collar, correctly, which would have been a foul in NCAA/NFL, but not in NFHS. They punted shortly thereafter, where R muffed the ball at the 5 yard line, wild scramble for the ball and K recovered 2 yards deep in the end zone. During the fumble, just before the recovery, the BJ blew his whistle as the ball crossed the goal line. Right call in NFHS. To the fans it looked like we had an early whistle. Fans screamed at the refs for being idiots blowing the whistle too early. So, so far according to the fans in a few minutes time, we blew 2 calls. The first one, ironically, the NFHS is LESS concerned about safety, the other one is not a safety issue at all.

A little later, we had the home team's QB scramble around in the backfield looking to throw on a 3rd and 10, 2 deep receivers were knocked down. The QB was sacked on the play. We had nothing since there was no pass thrown. This is another where NFHS is LESS concerned about safety.

After that, the fans were rabid the entire game since we were obviously poor officials. It was caused by rule differences that don't need to be rule differences.

First off, sorry if sharing video links isn't allowed.  Someone let me know and I'll immediately remove it.  But I feel that this first play perfectly displays what you might be talking about (didn't see your play, of course, so maybe they were potential blockers still) and it's something that we never see called and I honestly didn't even know about for my first couple years because all the vets harped on "defense can make contact until the ball is thrown" which isn't technically correct, and I admittedly didn't dig deep enough into the book when I first started. 

Anyways, it takes 2 or 3 minutes for him to go all the way through it and get his full explanation out but I think it's worth a watch on this subject.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99ZdC9a9wSo

[CalhounLJ]

Thanks for posting this video Brett. Thankfully, I had a great WH in my early years who educated me on this exact philosophy. Way too often we overlook the part about a receiver who is no longer a potential blocker..

[stevegarbs]

It's been on the final docket a couple of times but has failed to get a super (67%) majority. I have always been a strong supporter of it, as have many of the active officials that are state reps, but to no avail.

I'd like to go further and suggest we modify the eligibility requirements to being by number only along with the no more than 4 backs. Watching the NFL over the past few years I am unable to figure out how they determine eligibility by position as it seems every wide out is either on the line or a quarter of a step off the line. Heck most tackles line up deeper than the slot receivers...

[bbeagle]

First off, sorry if sharing video links isn't allowed.  Someone let me know and I'll immediately remove it.  But I feel that this first play perfectly displays what you might be talking about (didn't see your play, of course, so maybe they were potential blockers still) and it's something that we never see called and I honestly didn't even know about for my first couple years because all the vets harped on "defense can make contact until the ball is thrown" which isn't technically correct, and I admittedly didn't dig deep enough into the book when I first started. 

Anyways, it takes 2 or 3 minutes for him to go all the way through it and get his full explanation out but I think it's worth a watch on this subject.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99ZdC9a9wSo

In our area, we've been instructed to officiate exactly as that first LJ did. Wait for the pass, then throw the flag. It's not a foul unless there is a pass thrown.

If the pass is never thrown, Rule 9-3d is never called. I agree with you, and I think it should be called. Maybe I should bring it up with our interpreter next year and see why we don't use 9-3d, or interpret it very differently.

[Ralph Damren]

The reverse of that is: “Just because we don’t want to mirror the NCAA is never a good reason NOT to change a rule.”  And yet that’s the perception many of us have about some of the RC members.

It boggles my mind that 33%+ of the RC would have a problem with the “4 backs” change, especially since (if we’re honest with ourselves) that’s how a majority of officials are counting anyway.

IFP over the LOS used to be determined by where it left the QBs hand while, in reality, we were gauging by his feet. The NFHS finally agreed to tweak the rule to that. Hopefully the 5 backs and not 6 linesman will become our barometer on this. IMHO, the ole' adage of : "Teddy Roosevelt was going to outlaw football if it didn't remove the flying wedge" is sorta' outdated.

A word about rule differences....I also work baseball ,where there are just as many differences between NFHS, NCAA & MLB. Baseball is a game where 90%+ is fair/foul, ball/strike, and out/safe. The differing codes are rarely noticed, outside of DH or not in MLB. Our sport is more "rulesy" and the differences become more apparent. Just as the NL & AL unable to settle on a DH, our different codes will always remain different. I recorded several sound bites entitled : "Before You Boo, There May Be A Difference In The Rule!" that a local sports radio station  plays one of before each of their broadcast games. You guys could do the same. Speak at booster club meetings, and the like. Those of you that work other sports, think about it, there are probably many differences in your codes, too.

[BIG DON]

Had this last night, Team B jumps the snap count and is called for encroachment,  The fans are going ballistic he got back before the snap.  While I am in agreement that he got back before the snap but tonight we are playing NFHS rules and its a foul for the violation of the neutral zone.


Not a rule change, but can we get an editorial clarification to the new rule about fouls under two minutes?  Even after a full season, there are still an awful lot of officials who interpret this as "the offended team can start the clock on the ready if the clock would normally start on the snap."  I agree with this I have not seen Officials that do this wrong, but I am seeing a lot of coaches that don't understand this rule.


 

[Kleiny]

Such a good question!!!

1 - stop enforcing offensive holding penalties from the spot of the foul if they occurred behind the line of scrimmage!  Some of these penalties end up being 15...17...or 19 yards!  It’s absolutely not right and should be changed as soon as possible‼️

2 - if the offense makes a substitution then the defense should be given an opportunity to do the same.

3 - overtime should begin at the 20 yard line and a coin toss should happen only once (at the beginning of OT).

4 - defensive pass interferences should be a spot foul if they occurred within 15 yards of the LOS.

5 - defense should be allowed to “get back” to their side of the ball if they happened to cross the neural zone (like NCAA).

6 - an extra line should be placed on the sidelines (between the 25 yard lines) at one yard deeper than the current “no go zone” to emphasize where players/coaches are allowed vs not allowed.  More room is needed in high school as opposed to other levels and I think everyone who officiated knows exactly what I mean.  There needs to be an “officials only” area, which we currently have; a “coaches only” area, which could be 1 to 2 yards further; followed by the general area where anyone is allowed.  High School officials simply need more help with the sidelines.

7 - The QB should be allowed to “throw it away” as long as he is outside the tackle box and the ball crosses the LOS.

8 - get rid of the 5 yd face mask penalty!

9 - The clock should be restarted once the ball is set after a player is tackled out of bounds and there is more than TWO minutes left on the clock (2nd and 4th quarters)!

10 - coaches should be required to attend at least four association meetings throughout the season to discuss rules and get to know area officials.

11 - extra point attempts should be live plays that allow the defense to return fumbles/interceptions for 2 points.

12 - free kicks, punts, and extra point attempts (yes...all three types of kicks) should NOT be blown dead if the ball crosses the goal line.  Stop punishing the return team just because the opposing team has a good kicker!  Also...maybe bring the spot up to the 25 instead of the 20 following touchbacks?!

13 - consider adding an “uncatchable” option to be considered for pass interference penalties. 

14 - “fourth down fumble rule” needs to be adopted!  Only the player who last had possession can recover a “forward fumble” on fourth down.

15 - give officials the authority to send a player to the sidelines for four consecutive plays (a “cool down” rule).  This would be a wise rule and could definitely help officials keep control of emotional players/situations.

[AlUpstateNY]

I completely disagree.

Players, coaches and fans all know the NCAA/NFL rules, because they watch them on TV. Fans don't have access to the NFHS rules. Players and coaches want to play, not study differences.

The referees look horrible to the players, coaches and fans when a rule in NFHS is properly enforced but looks completely wrong because of what they've seen in NCAA, NFL. Some games get out of control just for this reason.

For example, we had a game this year where a home team player was grabbed by his collar, pulled to the side, and he broke the tackle and ran 5 more yards. We didn't call the horse collar, correctly, which would have been a foul in NCAA/NFL, but not in NFHS. They punted shortly thereafter, where R muffed the ball at the 5 yard line, wild scramble for the ball and K recovered 2 yards deep in the end zone. During the fumble, just before the recovery, the BJ blew his whistle as the ball crossed the goal line. Right call in NFHS. To the fans it looked like we had an early whistle. Fans screamed at the refs for being idiots blowing the whistle too early. So, so far according to the fans in a few minutes time, we blew 2 calls. The first one, ironically, the NFHS is LESS concerned about safety, the other one is not a safety issue at all.

A little later, we had the home team's QB scramble around in the backfield looking to throw on a 3rd and 10, 2 deep receivers were knocked down. The QB was sacked on the play. We had nothing since there was no pass thrown. This is another where NFHS is LESS concerned about safety.

After that, the fans were rabid the entire game since we were obviously poor officials. It was caused by rule differences that don't need to be rule differences.

If you're doing this to "look good" to Coaches, players and fans, you might rethink it.  Rules designed for GROWN MEN, and multi million dollar industries DON'T automatically apply to children and teenagers. 

Part of your job is to explain decisions to Coaches and/or players.  THEY need to accept what YOU say, whether they like, or agree, with you and return the respect you show with your explanation.  How much emotional BS you want to allow in that exchange is entirely UP TO YOU.   Either YOU command respect, or you don''t, and only YOU can control how much BS you're willing to listen to and ACCEPT.

As for fans, once they've paid admission they can behave as ignorantly as they choose.  If you have yet to learn to TOTALLY IGNORE them, you need to develop that SKILL, or you could try convincing them to stop watching TV and listening to sports casters.

Odds are decidedly against both sides of ANY field from equally praising your work, that's part of the territory.  The only compliments that matter, are those from your crew mates.

[scrounge]

My $0.02

Such a good question!!!

1 - stop enforcing offensive holding penalties from the spot of the foul if they occurred behind the line of scrimmage!  Some of these penalties end up being 15...17...or 19 yards!  It’s absolutely not right and should be changed as soon as possible‼️  Would like but if it adds too much complexity, I see why they're not going to do so.

2 - if the offense makes a substitution then the defense should be given an opportunity to do the same. No. This would be a disaster to consistently enforce among the range of high school officials, esp in 4 man crews

3 - overtime should begin at the 20 yard line and a coin toss should happen only once (at the beginning of OT). This is by state adoption. Ohio's already does start at the 20

4 - defensive pass interferences should be a spot foul if they occurred within 15 yards of the LOS. Sure, but no big deal if not. I like the NCAA rule, esp in red zone - walk till you hit the spot, 15 yds or the 2 yd line, whichever comes first

5 - defense should be allowed to “get back” to their side of the ball if they happened to cross the neural zone (like NCAA). Nah, it's easier this way and safer, no free plays needed. Don't jump if you don't want a penalty.

6 - an extra line should be placed on the sidelines (between the 25 yard lines) at one yard deeper than the current “no go zone” to emphasize where players/coaches are allowed vs not allowed.  More room is needed in high school as opposed to other levels and I think everyone who officiated knows exactly what I mean.  There needs to be an “officials only” area, which we currently have; a “coaches only” area, which could be 1 to 2 yards further; followed by the general area where anyone is allowed.  High School officials simply need more help with the sidelines. Uh....non-problem. Just enforce the restricted area and let the coaches handle their own people.

7 - The QB should be allowed to “throw it away” as long as he is outside the tackle box and the ball crosses the LOS. Fine with it, but not worth the complexity

8 - get rid of the 5 yd face mask penalty!  agreed

9 - The clock should be restarted once the ball is set after a player is tackled out of bounds and there is more than TWO minutes left on the clock (2nd and 4th quarters)! I guess, no strong opinion

10 - coaches should be required to attend at least four association meetings throughout the season to discuss rules and get to know area officials. This is not within the authority or purview of the NFHS rules committee, address this with your state. And four meetings? Quixotic

11 - extra point attempts should be live plays that allow the defense to return fumbles/interceptions for 2 points. Absolutely not, no need to put high school kids into these chaotic plays that would be rare in any case

12 - free kicks, punts, and extra point attempts (yes...all three types of kicks) should NOT be blown dead if the ball crosses the goal line.  Stop punishing the return team just because the opposing team has a good kicker!  Also...maybe bring the spot up to the 25 instead of the 20 following touchbacks?!  No, for similar reasons. But perfectly fine with 25 yd line

13 - consider adding an “uncatchable” option to be considered for pass interference penalties.  Not worth the added complexity

14 - “fourth down fumble rule” needs to be adopted!  Only the player who last had possession can recover a “forward fumble” on fourth down. Why? Again, absolutely not worth the complexity. Solution in search of problem. Why does HS need to adopt a rule put in place because Ken Stabler and Dave Casper got a TD in the 1970's??

15 - give officials the authority to send a player to the sidelines for four consecutive plays (a “cool down” rule).  This would be a wise rule and could definitely help officials keep control of emotional players/situations. This is coaches' responsibility. Send them out if you can (we can in our state) but if coach says they're ready to play, they're ready to play. If they do it again, throw the flag

[bossman72]

I completely disagree.

Players, coaches and fans all know the NCAA/NFL rules, because they watch them on TV. Fans don't have access to the NFHS rules. Players and coaches want to play, not study differences.

The referees look horrible to the players, coaches and fans when a rule in NFHS is properly enforced but looks completely wrong because of what they've seen in NCAA, NFL. Some games get out of control just for this reason.

For example, we had a game this year where a home team player was grabbed by his collar, pulled to the side, and he broke the tackle and ran 5 more yards. We didn't call the horse collar, correctly, which would have been a foul in NCAA/NFL, but not in NFHS. They punted shortly thereafter, where R muffed the ball at the 5 yard line, wild scramble for the ball and K recovered 2 yards deep in the end zone. During the fumble, just before the recovery, the BJ blew his whistle as the ball crossed the goal line. Right call in NFHS. To the fans it looked like we had an early whistle. Fans screamed at the refs for being idiots blowing the whistle too early. So, so far according to the fans in a few minutes time, we blew 2 calls. The first one, ironically, the NFHS is LESS concerned about safety, the other one is not a safety issue at all.

A little later, we had the home team's QB scramble around in the backfield looking to throw on a 3rd and 10, 2 deep receivers were knocked down. The QB was sacked on the play. We had nothing since there was no pass thrown. This is another where NFHS is LESS concerned about safety.

After that, the fans were rabid the entire game since we were obviously poor officials. It was caused by rule differences that don't need to be rule differences.

Pontius Pilate gave the fans a say once... and they've been wrong ever since.

[FLAHL]

The only compliments that matter, are those from your crew mates.

If the losing coach tells you that you did a good job, you can believe that. It’s rare, but it happens.

[js in sc]

Pontius Pilate gave the fans a say once... and they've been wrong ever since.

How true.
I don't think fans and probably coaches want to understand the high school rules and we can not fix that.
As a friend of mine said, "you can't fix stupid".