Author Topic: National Anthem Protest in N.J.  (Read 597 times)

Offline NVFOA_Ump

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National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« on: October 29, 2017, 06:53:43 AM »
Refs refuse to work high school game after anthem protest

MONROE, N.J. (AP) – A father and son who were to officiate a high school football game Friday night walked off the field after members of one team knelt during the national anthem.

Ernie and Anthony Lunardelli said they told officials from Colts Neck and Monroe high schools before the game they would not work if any players protested.

They were replaced by two officials in training after four Monroe players took a knee on their home field.

The two officials told mycentraljersey. com they respect the players’ right to protest, but

they believe such acts are disrespectful.

The pair stood on the field with their hands on their hearts while the anthem was played, then left immediately.

“What they are doing with this kneeling and everything, they have the right do to that, but the national anthem has nothing to do with them kneeling,” said Ernie Lunardelli.

Any thoughts on this issue?
« Last Edit: October 29, 2017, 08:50:45 AM by Rulesman »
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Offline ncwingman

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2017, 10:13:52 AM »
Actions have consequences. If you want to be assigned a game, show up for pregame and then leave before the game starts, you certainly can if you're willing to accept the consequences of your actions.

In this case, those consequences will likely be removed or reduced game assignments in the future for being unreliable and putting the rest of the crew in that situation.

Unrelated, I'm impressed that NJ apparently has enough officials that chain crews are manned by "officials in training" and not just home team parents. (Source -- longer article on the matter
« Last Edit: October 30, 2017, 09:36:53 AM by carol1995 »

Offline CalhounLJ

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National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2017, 01:45:23 PM »
Refs refuse to work high school game after anthem protest

MONROE, N.J. (AP) – A father and son who were to officiate a high school football game Friday night walked off the field after members of one team knelt during the national anthem.

Ernie and Anthony Lunardelli said they told officials from Colts Neck and Monroe high schools before the game they would not work if any players protested.

They were replaced by two officials in training after four Monroe players took a knee on their home field.

The two officials told mycentraljersey. com they respect the players’ right to protest, but

they believe such acts are disrespectful.

The pair stood on the field with their hands on their hearts while the anthem was played, then left immediately.

“What they are doing with this kneeling and everything, they have the right do to that, but the national anthem has nothing to do with them kneeling,” said Ernie Lunardelli.

Any thoughts on this issue?
IMO, one form of protest is as bad as the other. I have a son about to deploy to the Middle Easr, and so I get the offense at the disrespect. But I also realize that when I take an assignment I have a responsibility to fulfill that obligation. There are othe r ways to deal with this situation.


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Offline J12

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2017, 03:57:05 PM »
Actions have consequences. If you want to be assigned a game, show up for pregame and then leave before the game starts, you certainly can if you're willing to accept the consequences of your actions.

In this case, those consequences will likely be removed or reduced game assignments in the future for being unreliable and putting the rest of the crew in that situation.

Unrelated, I'm impressed that NJ apparently has enough officials that chain crews are manned by "officials in training" and not just home team parents. (Source -- longer article on the matter


Not to hijack the thread but just an FYI.  I'm from NJ and there is a serious problem with shortages of officials here.  Most of the time the chain crew is hometown dads, but occasionally trainees are used.  As I understand it, trainees have to work a certain number of games on the chain crew.  I think they just got lucky that they had them there on Friday.

Offline AlUpstateNY

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2017, 06:35:42 PM »
Children are not eligible to vote, for good reason.  They are not mature enough to understand political issues well enough to avoid being manipulated by unscrupulous adults willing to take advantage of their emotions.  Schools are allowed to formulate rules specially designed to protect their charges from such inappropriate manipulation, and should exercise their responsibility to insure such manipulation is not permitted.

Inappropriate behavior left unchecked is guaranteed to provoke an ever increasing cycle of escalation, until it is stopped, at the source.  Willfully disrespecting our Flag, by children, is unacceptable and especially inappropriate within any Public (or publicly endorsed) secondary school environment or setting, and should be prohibited, subject to appropriate consequences.

This disrespectful behavior is a "snowball" rolling down a steep mountain, and needs to be terminated before it escalates it's speed and causes unanticipated and excessive damage further down the slope.  School administrators need to step up to their responsibilities and condemn and prevent acts of public disrespect by students, regardless of their own personal, political and or social leanings which may not be fully comprehensible by the CHILDREN they are charged with supervising and protecting from external, inappropriate issues.   
« Last Edit: October 29, 2017, 06:37:54 PM by AlUpstateNY »

Offline Rulesman

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2017, 07:21:13 PM »
“Should be prohibited” can debated all day long but woe be the first school district that tries to stifle the First Amendment. Sorry Al. It ain’t gonna happen.
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Offline ncwingman

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2017, 09:22:49 PM »
Willfully disrespecting our Flag, by children, is unacceptable and especially inappropriate within any Public (or publicly endorsed) secondary school environment or setting, and should be prohibited, subject to appropriate consequences

The Supreme Court decided, in 1943, that a public school cannot force students to salute the flag or recite the Pledge of Allegiance. Forcing students to stand for the national anthem, or punishing students who do not, is a violation of their First Amendment rights to free speech. Children or not, they still have these rights.

Offline BrendanP

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2017, 09:26:02 PM »
Rulesman is correct. We had this debate in 1969, when a handful of students were suspended from school because they wore black arm bands to protest the Vietnam war. The Supreme Court then ruled in Tinker V. Des Moines that students are in fact protected by the First Amendment on school grounds and that the school cannot punish students for exercising their rights simply because they don't like the opinion being expressed.

IMO, this issue has absolutely nothing to do with the flag or veterans, it has everything to do with race. One side is speaking out against the low place on the social totem pole that our society assigns them, and the other side is angry at the fact that they dare question said space on the totem pole.

Offline AlUpstateNY

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2017, 10:11:29 PM »

IMO, this issue has absolutely nothing to do with the flag or veterans, it has everything to do with race. One side is speaking out against the low place on the social totem pole that our society assigns them, and the other side is angry at the fact that they dare question said space on the totem pole.

Thank you for the official legal history, I stand corrected. 

However I would suggest, " it has everything to do with race" may be just a tad overstated, although an exaggerated perception of "  it has everything to do with race" may apply.  Who exactly is it in "society" that assigns "totem pole" positions, as it appears an awful lot of people of every race, who have exerted the effort necessary to maximize the opportunities available to them,  have managed to achieve success?

Why drag our Flag into a discussion that's long being addressed and successfully being adjusted, for those willing to adjust.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2017, 10:17:45 PM by AlUpstateNY »

Offline carol1995

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2017, 09:46:44 AM »
To change the subject a little bit here, does anyone find this odd?

"Anthony Lunardelli, who graduated from Monroe in 2008 and played football at the high school..."

I've always been of the mindset that I would never work anywhere that could potentially cause controversy.  I would certainly never work a high school game where I graduated from and played.  I bowed out of a game one time because my father-in-law worked in the district of the visiting team.  There's just no need to cause any potential controversy.  There are plenty of other games to work.

Offline JasonTX

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2017, 12:06:54 PM »
The best way to stop these protests is to take away their platform.  Just don't even play the national anthem.  I'm just not sure what all these protesters would do if we took that away from them.  I'd rather protect the honor for what the anthem stands for by not playing it than playing it and having it be disrespected.

Offline Bullycon

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2017, 01:11:49 PM »
I would be irate if my so-called fellow officials left me and my crewmates out to dry like that.

If you want to blacklist that school so you never have to see the protests, fine. But to accept the assignment and then willfully abandon it minutes before the contest is inexcusable.

I'd never give either of them another varsity assignment again.

Offline scrounge

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2017, 05:08:53 PM »

Offline The Roamin' Umpire

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2017, 08:19:12 AM »
Inappropriate behavior left unchecked is guaranteed to provoke an ever increasing cycle of escalation, until it is stopped, at the source.  Willfully disrespecting our Flag, by children, is unacceptable and especially inappropriate within any Public (or publicly endorsed) secondary school environment or setting, and should be prohibited, subject to appropriate consequences.

Quote from: Supreme Court Justice Abe Fortas
It can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinker_v._Des_Moines_Independent_Community_School_District

Offline The Roamin' Umpire

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2017, 08:20:36 AM »
Why drag our Flag into a discussion that's long being addressed and successfully being adjusted, for those willing to adjust.

I wasn't there, but I would bet the same argument was used against protesters during Vietnam.

Offline AlUpstateNY

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Re: National Anthem Protest in N.J.
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2017, 12:43:26 PM »
Repeating, or condoning, bad behavior doesn't correct or excuse it.