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Football Officiating => National Federation Discussion => Topic started by: Frank in FL on July 25, 2011, 09:11:58 AM
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We had a question the other night concerning the use of basketball type "half sleeves" worn in football. Our position was that they were not undershirts and only sleeves and therefore should be treated the same way as sweat bands.
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Per the state from 2009 or so, can't wear the "Iverson sleeves" as you described.
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Thanks Steve. I thought I remembered it, but we couldn't find it anywhere.
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Interesting though you see them worn on TV for the State finals. ???
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We had a question the other night concerning the use of basketball type "half sleeves" worn in football. Our position was that they were not undershirts and only sleeves and therefore should be treated the same way as sweat bands.
What rule are you hanging your hat on with this one? 1-5-3c-1 addresses the issue only if the sleeve is ball colored. IMO, any other interpretation is a stretch, at best. These are not sweatbands so I don't see how you can justify that road.
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What rule are you hanging your hat on with this one? 1-5-3c-1 addresses the issue only if the sleeve is ball colored. IMO, any other interpretation is a stretch, at best. These are not sweatbands so I don't see how you can justify that road.
No, there are not sweatbands. They are adornments similar to bicep bands and are therefore illegal.
Somebody hollar at Bigjohn and have him weigh in on this. ;)
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Hanging it on our state rules interpreter who I just heard from. He says they are illegal so I guess that's that.
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We treat them as adornments as well. If they can wear them so that it looks like a long-sleeve compression shirt under the jersey we generally let it go, but if it's obviously one of the "Iverson-style" sleeves, then it's an adornment and not allowed.
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No, there are not sweatbands. They are adornments similar to bicep bands and are therefore illegal.
Somebody hollar at Bigjohn and have him weigh in on this. ;)
Although I don't necessarily agree, our state treats them as pads, and thus legal.
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I think state interpreters should look up some images of turf burn before making uninformed decisions. With the increasing dominance of turf fields, it is a concern.
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think state interpreters should look up some images of turf burn before making uninformed decisions. With the increasing dominance of turf fields, it is a concern.
Then the Iverson sleeve manufacturers need to pull what the spat manufacturers did a year or so ago and demonstrate a valid use for them. We consider them illegal adornments but I can see how they might guard against turf burn.
I remember back in my college days on the old "billiard surface" turf a lot of the guys wore those neoprene sleeves.
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I think state interpreters should look up some images of turf burn before making uninformed decisions. With the increasing dominance of turf fields, it is a concern.
+1
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Per the State here, at least in +/-2009 when they made a ruling, I seem to remember their statement along the lines of the "iverson sleeves" (paraphrase) 'assist the runner in maintaining possession of the ball'.
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But don'tall those Under Armour gloves that you can purchase at Dick's also assist the runners/receivers but they still wear them, at least in my neck of the woods.
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I suppose they deemed it to be under 1-5-3c5.
..."Jerseys, undershirts or exterior arm covers/pads manufactured to enhance contact with the football or opponent."
Frustrating for me that the State requests we do not allow these sleeves, arm bands and the other things players aren't supposed to wear, yet you see a photo of the "big game" in the sports section and players are wearing them and/or you're watching a State playoff game and you see players wearing them.
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I think state interpreters should look up some images of turf burn before making uninformed decisions. With the increasing dominance of turf fields, it is a concern.
If a player is concerned about turf burn, he should wear a long-sleeved compression shirt under the jersey. But that's too easy and would abide by the rules, hence these "reasons" for needing half-sleeves.
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If a player is concerned about turf burn, he should wear a long-sleeved compression shirt under the jersey. But that's too easy and would abide by the rules, hence these "reasons" for needing half-sleeves.
So with 2 players concerned about turf burn, the one wearing a full shirt is ok with you but the one wearing just the sleeves, even though made out of the exact same material, is out of luck because of a missing couple inches of material between the mid-bicep and shoulder?
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So with 2 players concerned about turf burn, the one wearing a full shirt is ok with you but the one wearing just the sleeves, even though made out of the exact same material, is out of luck because of a missing couple inches of material between the mid-bicep and shoulder?
So why doesn't the player just wear the long sleeve shirt and comply? Why does it become the officials fault?
Not that I really care...I personally hate being uniform P_S
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So why doesn't the player just wear the long sleeve shirt and comply?
Because a long sleeve compression shirt (which everyone says is legal) is incredibly hot when worn on a warm evening.
To differentiate between a long sleeve shirt and separate sleeves made of the EXACT same material is ridiculous. If the sleeves aid in possessing the ball (and they don't), then long sleeve shirts do the exact same thing and should be banned as well. If that's the rule the Florida state interpreter is using for banning the sleeves, he missed the boat completely.
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Like I said previously... if they wear the sleeves LIKE they're part of a shirt, we're not going to be looking up their jerseys to verify it goes all the way to the armpit. Additionally, the ones who only wear the sleeve on the arm they normally carry the ball with are not going to convince us they're concerned about turf burn.
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Because a long sleeve compression shirt (which everyone says is legal) is incredibly hot when worn on a warm evening.
To differentiate between a long sleeve shirt and separate sleeves made of the EXACT same material is ridiculous. If the sleeves aid in possessing the ball (and they don't), then long sleeve shirts do the exact same thing and should be banned as well. If that's the rule the Florida state interpreter is using for banning the sleeves, he missed the boat completely.
Hot? Heat Gear LS shirts are anything but hot...
It has to do with the "cool" factor. If turf burns are a concern they make adhesive "patches" that adhere to the elbow to alleviate the problem...
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Interesting update:
I have seen these "Iverson Sleeves" which now have built-in elbow pads.
So we how have something that apparently, "under 1-5-3c5.
..."Jerseys, undershirts or exterior arm covers/pads manufactured to enhance contact with the football or opponent." - yet they have the padding for protection & kids can wear elbow pads.
Either way doesn't matter to me, really. Frustrating ni that my assn say do not to allow due the State saying "no", yet I always see them (along w/ other adornments) on the local 'game of the week' or during the State playoffs.
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Hot? Heat Gear LS shirts are anything but hot...
When worn as undershirts, UA Heat Gear LS shirts are VERY hot. Their advantage is that they are moisture wicking, and therfore draw sweat away from your body, and have it evaporate. All of that is defeated when they are worn under pads and a jersey.
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When worn as undershirts, UA Heat Gear LS shirts are VERY hot. Their advantage is that they are moisture wicking, and therfore draw sweat away from your body, and have it evaporate. All of that is defeated when they are worn under pads and a jersey.
What about the kickers? ;)
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Tennessee declared them eligible equipment just last week.
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What about the kickers? ;)
Kickers don't sweat.
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It funny that you guys say you see them on TV because our association is extra hard on that stuff (mostly because the school board and the state are hard on us) when we know games are televised. Don't know what part of Florida the OP is from, but I'm in the south and we definitely don't allow them here.