Taunting

[NorCalMike]

Last night's game is turning to a blow out. Team K is up by 30. During the free kick, Team K tackler lays a great legal hit on the ball carrier right in front of Team R's bench. After the tackle, one of the team K players goes into a profanity-laced taunt. HL was in the area and heard the taunt but couldn't tell which player said it.

Team R coach goes nuts (rightfully so in my opinion) about there not being a flag for the taunt. HL flags coach for UNS.

I was on the other side of the field so I didn't hear any of it.

My personal feeling is that I would have flagged K's taunt even if I couldn't identify the actual player. I would then asked the players who said it while reminding them that the UNS will go against the coach if someone doesn't take responsibility. What do you guys think of this?

Also think we should have giving the Team R coach a little leeway before throwing the UNS flag since the HL knew the taunt occurred. This whole mess created such an ill will amongst that whole team that we had trouble with them the rest of the game.

[Atlanta Blue]

So you KNOW someone on K taunted R, and the R coach gets the flag.  And you had trouble with that team  the rest of the night.  Gee, I wonder why?

If you don't know which player said it, you still know it was a flag on K.  Flag it!  And why would you assign it to the head coach if you didn't know which player it was on?

Suppose there was a flagrant face mask foul on K, but you didn't get a number.  You would still flag it!  And would you toss the head coach?  Of course not.

There are a few USC fouls that are assigned to the head coach.  Taunting is not one of them.

[NorCalMike]

AB I felt bad about the whole thing but since I was no where near the play I couldn't do anything about.

As as assigning the foul to head coach, this the same philosophy as we use if someone on the bench says something that constitutes unsportsman like conduct and we can't assign it to a specific person. May not be the way you guys do things but it's pretty common way of dealing with it here. Not saying its right, just the way we do it.

[Atlanta Blue]

AB I felt bad about the whole thing but since I was no where near the play I couldn't do anything about.

When I said, "you", it was the collective "you" as a crew, not "you" individually.  Did anyone try to talk to H or the R and get it right?

Not saying its right,

In that statement, you are correct! 

[HLinNC]

This isn't basketball, we aren't flagging bench technicals.  How many team K players were inTeam R's sideline?  There should have been more than wing over there.

[shooter1]

Blue--you are so correct--it is not assigned to the coach.  But--taunting leads to nothing good--it certainly needs to be penalized and stopped.

[AlUpstateNY]

Last night's game is turning to a blow out. Team K is up by 30. During the free kick, Team K tackler lays a great legal hit on the ball carrier right in front of Team R's bench. After the tackle, one of the team K players goes into a profanity-laced taunt. HL was in the area and heard the taunt but couldn't tell which player said it.

Team R coach goes nuts (rightfully so in my opinion) about there not being a flag for the taunt. HL flags coach for UNS.

I was on the other side of the field so I didn't hear any of it.

My personal feeling is that I would have flagged K's taunt even if I couldn't identify the actual player. I would then asked the players who said it while reminding them that the UNS will go against the coach if someone doesn't take responsibility. What do you guys think of this?

Also think we should have giving the Team R coach a little leeway before throwing the UNS flag since the HL knew the taunt occurred. This whole mess created such an ill will amongst that whole team that we had trouble with them the rest of the game.

If you don't know who said what, WHO would you flag?  Is it possible it was someone on Team R, trying to intice you to GUESS?  As for the coach who lost his composure, that is ENTIRELY on him.  Most officials recognize and understand the sometimes emotional strain coaches are subjected to, and provide usually excessive leeway.  However, there are lines that ALL ADULTS & GROWNUPS have to recognize and respect, despite unanticipated, sudden stress.

When one of those lines is crossed, there's nobody to fault exscept the person doing the crossing, who should be well aware of the consquences before CHOOSING to "go(es) nuts".

"Guessing" is never a good idea when it comes to assessing guilt, and it's a luxury we're not allowed.

Is this any different than a helmet seemingly jerked downward, but you don't SEE a hand grasping a facemask?

[Ralph Damren]

The HC is responsible for the sportsmanship and behavior of his team box, so an unidentifiable voice / act coming from his team box is his responsibility. In the OP, the taunt came from a player on the oppsite side of the field. IMHO, you could have an USC on an unidentified player. IMHO, you could bring out the fouling players' huddle and explain : "Coach, the unsportsmanlike act was one of your players yelling, '@#$% &*^% you' to the opponents, you may take a second or two to address your players." I've had players confess, tattle or apologize. I've had coaches just state : "Next one of you that opens his mouth is benched". It usually seems to get the game back under control.

[AlUpstateNY]

The HC is responsible for the sportsmanship and behavior of his team box, so an unidentifiable voice / act coming from his team box is his responsibility. In the OP, the taunt came from a player on the oppsite side of the field. IMHO, you could have an USC on an unidentified player.

After further consideration, I think you're right, an UNC foul on the team, despite not identifying the guilty party is appropriate in this situation, provided the covering official actually heard the tirade.  However suggesting that a coach is somehow "entitled" to "go nuts" because of ANY call/no call, real or perceived is nonsense, and unacceptable. (Nuts is a word that means different things to different people)

It may well be appropriate to bend over backwards trying to explain why the call was made/not made, and to allow for some excess emotion as you calm the situation, but respect is a two way street, and even though you might stretch your "line" somewhat to fit the particular situation, when (if) it's pushed to the point of being actually crossed it needs to be dealt with, immediately.

[Atlanta Blue]

Yes, a coach could certainly go over the line.  But in a case like this, he should get a pretty long leash before getting a flag. 

[AlUpstateNY]

Absolutely, but even LONG leashes eventually run out of stretch.

[CalhounLJ]

Is this any different than a helmet seemingly jerked downward, but you don't SEE a hand grasping a facemask?

Yes it's different because we are certain a foul has occurred. We just don't know who committed the foul. More like clearly seeing a hand on the face mask but not knowing whose hand.


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[NorCalMike]

The coach didn't go nuts. He was loudly protesting the fact that no call of UNS was made. He didn't cuss, throw anything, or come onto the field. I think the way I would have handled the coach in this situation if I was over at that side of the field would be to acknowledge his complaint and ask him to let us move on. I have found that most of the time when coaches are complaining about a call or no call, they calm down after we acknowledge the complaint.

Unfortunately the official who decided to not to flag the UNS, decided to flag the coach for his complaint. This just compounded the problem.