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Football Officiating => National Federation Discussion => Topic started by: OHref71 on August 20, 2014, 11:38:45 AM
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On a successful try B commits a personal foul and A elects to take on subsequent Kickoff. A kicks from the B 45 and it goes untouched out of bounds at B10. What are B's options. We have had a discussion about this and there has been some disaggreement about one of the options.
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Spot where it went OOB - B10
Rekick from the B40
Spot at the B15 (30 yds in advance of the kick)
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isn't it 25 yards in advance in NFHS so 20 yardline? This is where the discussion came in. Some people said that since 25 from the 45 was more than half the distance that the 3rd choice was B 1st & 10 at the 22 1/2 instead of the 20.
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isn't it 25 yards in advance in NFHS so 20 yardline? This is where the discussion came in. Some people said that since 25 from the 45 was more than half the distance that the 3rd choice was B 1st & 10 at the 22 1/2 instead of the 20.
Sorry, it is 25. 30 is the NCAA rule.
But no, it is not a "half the distance penalty", it's a spot. If the kick off was from the 45, then the spot is the 20. Statistically, if you chose either the inbounds spot, or the spot 25 yards from the kick, it's not even a penalty in FED, the NCAA or the NFL.
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Rekick from the B40
Shouldn't the rekick, if chosen, be from the 50 yard line?
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Shouldn't the rekick, if chosen, be from the 50 yard line?
Yes! >:(
Got the theory of the question right, botched all the details! Shame on me.
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I try to think about this penalty more in terms of OPTIONS instead of memorizing specific yard lines. Cause once that happens you get into this situation.
When a kick goes OOB R has three options:
- Take it at the spot when out of bounds
- Take it 25 yards in advance of the previous spot
- Re-kick 5 yards behind the previous spot
So based on the given situation:
- R 10 yard line (probably not coach)
- R 20 yard line (maybe/maybe not)
- Rekick from the 50 (most likely what coach will take)
Remember half the distance penalties only apply when related to offending teams goal line:
10-1-5 . . . Enforcement of a penalty cannot take the ball more than half the distance from the enforcement spot to the offending team’s goal line.
Since the penalty is moving the ball towards R's goal line no problem to go to 20.
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The 25 yard award is solid and never split on half-the-distance enforcements. There is/used to be a case where, through a collection of DB fouls on B, K's free kick line was at R's 20. An OOB kick would offer R only the re-kick if the penalty was accepted. Reminder : The 25 yard award isn't one of the opportunities of spot choice between the hashes, just spot it on the hash of the OOB side. Don't give the captain all three choices (take play, re-kick, 25 yd. award) only re-kick or the best field position of the others. Thursday TRIVIA : When is the only situation a team might want to accept the WORST field position????
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Had a game last year when the kickoff was from the R20. Team tried an onside kick and it went out of bounds. Coach said, "We want it at the 35." I told him he wanted it where it went out of bounds at the 5. He surely didn't want to give them another onside kick from the 25, and the third option was 25 yards from the spot of the kick. He said, "That's a touchback, we get it at the 20." I liked his logic, but told him that option was lost. His team took the ball at the 5 and drove 95 yards for a touchdown.
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Thursday TRIVIA : When is the only situation a team might want to accept the WORST field position????
I'm using the kick out of bounds play as the play to accept worst field position... (I'm thinking outside the box here, probably not what you thought of at all - I'd like to hear your answer)
1. A player needs a certain amount of yards for some team/league record and there isn't much time left. Give the team the ball at the 20 instead of the 35 if the player needs 70 yards for some record.
2. Team R needs 3 points to qualify for playoffs. Team R winning 10-8. Team R needs a safety to tie game 10-10 to go to overtime to try to win the game by 3 or more. Easier safety = worse field position.
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Sorry,Bbeagle, but good try. Hint #1: The end of the half or game is looming...... :)
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BUZZZZZZZ....Time's up ^no Consider this : 0:03 to play in the game and K has scored the go ahead TD....(1) K1 kicks toward the sidelines; (2) K2 is first to touch the ball @ R's 48; (3) Clock starts on legal touching ; (4) Kick goes OOB @R's 45, untouched by R,as time expires.
R now has 3 choices : (1) Decline the penalty = game over :( :( ; (2) Accept the penalty and chose for K to re kick = all K would have to do is knock ball from tee with big toe and fall on it = game over :( ??? :(; (3) Accept the penalty AND accept the 25 yard award = R will be allowed an untimed down from their 35... :thumbup :thumbup....don't go home yet!
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Yes! >:(
Got the theory of the question right, botched all the details! Shame on me.
Sadly, only the details count on Friday night :)
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I try to think about this penalty more in terms of OPTIONS instead of memorizing specific yard lines. Cause once that happens you get into this situation.
When a kick goes OOB R has three options:
- Take it at the spot when out of bounds
- Take it 25 yards in advance of the previous spot
- Re-kick 5 yards behind the previous spot
So based on the given situation:
- R 10 yard line (probably not coach)
- R 20 yard line (maybe/maybe not)
- Rekick from the 50 (most likely what coach will take)
Remember half the distance penalties only apply when related to offending teams goal line:Since the penalty is moving the ball towards R's goal line no problem to go to 20.
Well technically the goal line is a factor. However, I agree with everyone- the 25yd option is solid. If it can't be awarded it's not offered.
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If R takes the ball at the OOB spot, is that considered a declination of the penalty?
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If R takes the ball at the OOB spot, is that considered a declination of the penalty?
Yes -- it's the result of the play.
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Which takes me to the spot option. It appears the book calls this a "penalty", however, when calculating penalties for the game, this is NOT counted as a penalty.
So if the ball goes OOB during the last play of the half, is there an untimed time if you choose the spot option?
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Interesting question...but very hard to happen. Would have to be legally touched by K without R touching it (which would cause the clock to start) and clock would have to expire during the down.
The perfect storm could cause this to happen though.
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Interesting question...but very hard to happen. Would have to be legally touched by K without R touching it (which would cause the clock to start) and clock would have to expire during the down.
The perfect storm could cause this to happen though.
A scores with :05 left. Kickoff. During the kick, there is a penalty which causes the ball to be re-kicked. The time expired on the play as Team B took more than :05 running around with the ball. We now have a kickoff with :00 left. Team A chooses to 'end the half' by kicking the ball out-of-bounds (no time left). Well, this penalty will give Team B a free down with :00 left.
Trick question: Now it's team B 1st and 10 with :00 left. What situations could allow Team A to get another play before the end of the half? How many plays can we officials allow with :00 left?
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A scores with :05 left. Kickoff. During the kick, there is a penalty which causes the ball to be re-kicked. The time expired on the play as Team B took more than :05 running around with the ball. We now have a kickoff with :00 left. Team A chooses to 'end the half' by kicking the ball out-of-bounds (no time left). Well, this penalty will give Team B a free down with :00 left.
Team A is foolish. When you have to rekick with :00 on the clock and don't want to give B/R a chance for a return or another play, just knock the ball off the tee and fall on it. Kicking OOB is just dumb.
Trick question: Now it's team B 1st and 10 with :00 left. What situations could allow Team A to get another play before the end of the half? How many plays can we officials allow with :00 left?
Well, we are now confusing A's and B's (the censor changed my plural of B to HORSE HOCKEY!) because A is the team that starts the down on offense. So let's say Red has the ball for an untimed down, they fumble, White recovers, Red fouls during the return. White will now get an untimed down.
As for how many could there be, well theoretically, an infinite number.