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Football Officiating => NCAA Discussion => Topic started by: kid50 on October 17, 2015, 09:32:54 PM

Title: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: kid50 on October 17, 2015, 09:32:54 PM

I think this is a stretch that the kicker is still in a position to make the kick (holder with knee on the ground). 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:13912910

Thoughts?

Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: Legacy Zebra on October 17, 2015, 09:35:25 PM

He doesn't have to be in position to kick it the whole time. The exception only requires he be in position to kick it at the snap.

Title: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: TxSkyBolt on October 17, 2015, 10:29:08 PM

Legal play.

Exception: The ball remains alive when an offensive player has simulated a kick or at the snap is in position to kick the ball held for a place kick by a teammate. [The ball may be kicked, passed or advanced by rule] (AR4-1-3-I)


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Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: BrendanP on October 18, 2015, 05:32:06 PM

Quote from: TxSkyBolt on October 17, 2015, 10:29:08 PM

Legal play.

Exception: The ball remains alive when an offensive player has simulated a kick or at the snap is in position to kick the ball held for a place kick by a teammate. [The ball may be kicked, passed or advanced by rule] (AR4-1-3-I)


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You learn something new every day. It was my understanding, and had been mentioned on RefStripes during my lurker period, that the ball isn't dead as long as the holder never establishes possession with his knee on the ground.

Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: yarnnelg on October 18, 2015, 07:16:42 PM

Got a debate going. LSU situation, holder, kicker and center with restrictions on contact. If the Kick is blocked, only the player blocking the kick may hit the holder. So, LSU, holder with knee down, gunner comes from the right side and dives, touching the holder before he throws the pass. Is the holder down at that point or does he need to be knocked from that position? He's literally a defenseless player.

Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: Legacy Zebra on October 18, 2015, 07:46:58 PM

Being a defenseless player doesn't mean he can't be hit, it means he can't be hit in the head or neck. Also, he isn't a holder once there is nobody in position to make a kick. But you'll also note that the exception never calls him a holder with regard to him to not being down. If he keeps his knee down, and doesn't get rid of the ball, the defense would just need to meet the "so held that is forward progress is stopped" portion of the rule.

Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: yarnnelg on October 18, 2015, 08:41:00 PM

Makes sense. Thanks

Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: bkdow on October 19, 2015, 02:48:09 PM

Can he pass the ball from his knee?

Title: Re: LSU Fake Field Goal
Post by: BFlushR on October 19, 2015, 03:24:03 PM

Yes, it's a NFHS rule that he has to rise before passing the ball, but OK in NCAA.