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Football Officiating => National Federation Discussion => Topic started by: ilyazhito on July 02, 2018, 11:46:17 AM
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I know that 5-man officiating crews are the norm almost everywhere for high school football during the regular season (with some exceptions, such as RI (4), MD (6), GA (6), and some states using 7), but some states use 7-man mechanics as well, whether for the playoffs only, or for the playoffs and certain regular season games. If your state uses 7-man mechanics in any capacity, what sort of mechanics do you use? Is it straight CCA mechanics, homemade mechanics, or a combination of the two?
Thank you for the input! For the record, I personally would support 7-man crews for all varsity games, as well as 5-man crews for JV, but I understand that money could make this an issue, hence why 7-man is used most often for the playoffs at the high school level.
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South Carolina has its own mechanics for 4, 5, and 7 man mechanics. These can be found on the website SCFOA.net under Policies and Procedures.
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PA uses 6-man for regular season and most of the way through district playoffs. Some more sparsely populated districts still use 5 man.
For the district championship and all of the state playoffs, we use 7 man.
PA has their own 7 man and 6 man manual, but it's very close to the CCA manual that you really don't even notice a difference.
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South Carolina has its own mechanics for 4, 5, and 7 man mechanics. These can be found on the website SCFOA.net under Policies and Procedures.
OK. Any specific differences from CCA, other than not switching sidelines for the 2nd half, and having only a 25-second play clock? This might be helpful to know for officials who work both high school and college.
In Washington, D.C., there are several different football officials associations, WDFOA (of which I was formerly a member), which covers D.C. private schools and public school games for the MD suburbs (Montgomery County, Prince George's County, Howard County, Southern Maryland Athletic Conference), EBO (my current football association), which covers D.C. public schools and some charter schools, and JUSO, which covers charter schools only. WDFOA uses 6-man mechanics for all its varsity games, including playoffs (except for a few schools that only pay for 5-man crews). EBO uses 5-man crews in the regular season, and straight CCA 7-man mechanics for the playoffs (except for not switching sidelines and only a 25-second play clock). JUSO uses 5-man crews for the regular season, but I am not sure of what they do for the playoffs.
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Here in Utah we use 4 man for Sophomore games, and 5 man for JV and Varsity.
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NC uses 7 man for late playoff rounds (semi finals and finals). There are documents/presentations on the state website (https://www.nchsaa.org/officiating-education-football) with the mechanics, but I don't know the CCA rules well enough to know if they are the same/different/similar/whatnot.
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CCA refers to the Collegiate Commissioners Association, a group that writes officiating mechanics manuals for various college sports, so that NCAA and NAIA officials have standard practices nationwide. For instance, there is the CCA Football Manual for a Crew of 5/6, CCA Football Manual for a Crew of 7/8, CCA Men's Basketball Manual, CCA Women's Basketball Manual, etc. The rules for college football are different, and are written by the NCAA Football Rules Committee (You can download the college football rulebook for free, as a PDF, from the NCAA website, but you must buy the CCA Football Manual from the Referee website, or another source). The reason why I asked was because NFHS has no mechanics resources for 7-man crews (the assumption is that states will use 4 and 5-man crews), so states either have to develop their own, or borrow from the college manuals.
To my knowledge, Florida also uses the CCA football manual for its playoff games that use 7-man crews (everything from the 2nd round of the playoffs all the way to the state finals).
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Colorado uses 5 man for all varsity contests, including playoffs and championship games. We use 3 man mechanics for Freshman and JV games. However last year some high schools started using 4 man mechanics for Freshman & JV games. If it's all about the safety of the players, I feel all sub varsity games should have 4 man mechanics. However I know $ is always the issue.
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FL uses 5 man for both JV and Varsity, although there are a couple of schools who are willing to pay for 7 in the regular season. We use 7 for all rounds of playoffs. The FHSAA provides detailed mechanics for 7 man on their website.
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FL uses 5 man for both JV and Varsity, although there are a couple of schools who are willing to pay for 7 in the regular season. We use 7 for all rounds of playoffs. The FHSAA provides detailed mechanics for 7 man on their website.
what he said, but if I'm not mistaken the state has a few different mechanics than CCA 'by the book'. not talking about B/F & H/L changing sidelines, but a few small ones. (but I may be wrong)
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I would add too that the majority of the 7-man mechanics taught at the state has the primary focus on mechanics/keys - which is good.
But a topic not covered here in FL and I reviewed NC just now is keys on kickoffs where each guy has 2-3 guys they stay with for much of the play.
On that, it's certainly worth it for a local assn to download a copy of the CCA manual and take a look at that.
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FWIW, in our association, we have enough officials to do 7-man crews for the larger (AAA/Division 5 and 6) schools we cover. Our VP of mechanics at the time - an observer for the CAA - drew up our 7 man mechanics manual, borrowing heavily from CCA mechanics, but tweaking a few things.
To my knowledge, we're the only association in VA with enough officials to regularly provide 7-man crews during the regular season, though I may be incorrect.
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Georgia has approved the use of 7-man this year and mandated its use in the playoffs. We are essentially using the CCA manual.
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Cool! I never would have thought that would have happened, but kudos to the GHSA for getting this right. 6-man is good as an emergency system, and for sideline management, but has a gaping hole in the deep middle of the field (unless the 6th official is the Center Judge, which is only used in Europe on an experimental basis).
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We've had 7 man crews since I started in Maine back in 1971.
R, U, FJ (now LJ) ,HL , DBG (down box guy-gender neutral), NPM ,SPM(north & south polemen -also gender neutral). We since have added BJ and CG (clip guy).
......I believe it is now time for a sardine and pickle salad eAt&...
eAt& :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: (7-man crew)
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(unless the 6th official is the Center Judge, which is only used in Europe on an experimental basis).
Where in Europe do they use 6-man mechanics with a CJ? I thought the 6-man mechanics over here are the usual ones with FJ and SJ, and CJ is only in 8-man crews.
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Ohio is in the 2nd yr of an experiment (which by all accounts is going quite well) with using 6 man crews with a CJ. Used in limited regular season games and later rounds of the playoffs.
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Cool! I never would have thought that would have happened, but kudos to the GHSA for getting this right. 6-man is good as an emergency system, and for sideline management, but has a gaping hole in the deep middle of the field (unless the 6th official is the Center Judge, which is only used in Europe on an experimental basis).
I think 6 man is great for high school football. There's a hole in the deep middle, but who really throws deep middle? You still get a decent look from S and F, plus the H and L can help too.
If given the choice between 5 and 6, I would take 6 any day of the week.
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I agree. Much prefer 7 though
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I think 6 man is great for high school football. There's a hole in the deep middle, but who really throws deep middle? You still get a decent look from S and F, plus the H and L can help too.
If given the choice between 5 and 6, I would take 6 any day of the week.
I really wish we could get 6-man crews for varsity in NW Pennsylvania. I know that you are in PA too, Bossman, but in the Erie area, we make do with 5. It's so frustrating to know that we probably miss things because there simply aren't enough eyes.
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Ohio has added a 6th officials but the position that added was the Center Judge.
5 man mechanics with a C. They are in their third year and they like it.
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:thumbup Does the Gold Book mention that though? I was under the impression that only 5-man games worked in Ohio counted towards the playoffs, so 6-man games with a Center Judge would presumably not count to the required number a crew had to work for the playoffs. Maybe I'm wrong, and the Gold Book was changed for this season to include 6-man with a Center Judge as an acceptable alternative.
Still, I would hope to eventually see NFHS create materials for 6 and 7-man mechanics, because many states use those mechanics on their own, whether for playoffs, or throughout the year.
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6 man games that have the permission of the state office (and pretty much all of them have that advance permission) do count for playoff consideration. It's only the 2nd year so mechanics are still being refined, but it's working well so far.
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Kalle, the International American Football Officials Association Manual of Football Officiating by Jim Briggs has two sections specifically devoted to the responsibilities of the Head Linesman, Line Judge, and Back Judge in 6C Mechanics (6-man mechanics with a centre judge).
Football Officiating Manual said:
7. The following are the valid crew formations we recognise:
Formation Crew size/label Core group Wing group Deep group
120 3 R H, L
220 4 R, U H, L
221 5 R, U H, L B
222 6D R, U H, L F, S
321 6C R, U, C H, L B
223 7 R, U H, L B, F, S
323 8 R, U, C H, L B, F, S
Bossman, a BJ is useful for more than just deep pass plays up the middle. I know, because I have been a BJ and a 6-man deep wing, as well as a line of scrimmage official. I had a play when I was the FJ, and a receiver dove to catch a pass with his back to me. I had no angle whatsoever to rule correctly on that play, and neither did the SJ. The only person who could have had an angle to see that would have been the BJ, but there was none on the field that day (it was only a 6-man HS game in MD), as HL would have been too far, LJ would have not had a good angle, and U's attention would be elsewhere. Other similar plays that are problematic for a 6-man crew, but can be covered well in a 7-man crew include contact by defenders on the inside of receivers on passing plays (At TBFOC, the clinicians showed videos of plays at the college level that were along the sideline where the receiver was grabbed/contacted from the inside, and where only the BJ had a flag, because only he had a good angle. I would assume that similar situations would happen in high school games as well). This is similar to basketball, where a 2-man crew cannot rule properly on plays where there is contact on a ball handler or a shooter opposite the Trail and above the free-throw line extended (That play is in Trail's primary, but he has no good angle to see it. Lead may have an angle, but he should not be looking there, because he has responsibilities elsewhere.), but a 3-man crew can rule properly on that play, because they have an extra official with an inside-out look, just like a football 7-man crew has a Back Judge with an inside-out look to complement the Field Judge and Side Judge's outside-in looks.
I would have to disagree with you on 5 or 6. Personally, I would prefer to work 5-man, because it is easier to build up to 7-man from there by adding two deep wing officials than it would be to move a deep wing with no Back Judge experience to the middle. I know, because I attended the Tom Beard Football Officials Clinic for multiple years as a back judge, even though I started out in a group that did 6-man for their varsity games. It required some adjustments to my perspective to change my keys and areas of responsibility, but with some camp and (semi-pro) game experience, I can be as competent as a 7-man BJ as I was as a 6-man FJ/SJ. In my new association, some of the playoff deep officials (FJ/SJ) are regular season back judges, but others are line of scrimmage officials who move deep, because they can run, and the only adjustments that they have to make are a different starting position and different responsibilities on kick plays (the keys are similar, because both 5-man wings and 7-man deep wings are responsible for the widest man on the line of scrimmage. BJ will pick up the inside receiver on the strong side (same as in 5-man), and the wings in 7-man pick up the backs or other interior receivers on their side who were not picked up by the BJ).
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6 man games that have the permission of the state office (and pretty much all of them have that advance permission) do count for playoff consideration. It's only the 2nd year so mechanics are still being refined, but it's working well so far.
Crazy that the OHSAAFB website added materials on the CJ just before the season started in August. Maybe the OHSAA is starting to change from its old ways. It would be cool to see the mechanics in action come playoff time, and maybe eventually see 7-man crews working HS playoffs nationally.
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Kalle, the International American Football Officials Association Manual of Football Officiating by Jim Briggs has two sections specifically devoted to the responsibilities of the Head Linesman, Line Judge, and Back Judge in 6C Mechanics (6-man mechanics with a centre judge).
Huh, I've completely missed that. Thanks!
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New league in my area here in Michigan is using 7 man for varsity and 5 man for Freshman & JV. This is for all league and non league games.
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Awesome! How did they get that to work?
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Kalle, the International American Football Officials Association Manual of Football Officiating by Jim Briggs has two sections specifically devoted to the responsibilities of the Head Linesman, Line Judge, and Back Judge in 6C Mechanics (6-man mechanics with a centre judge).
Football Officiating Manual said:
7. The following are the valid crew formations we recognise:
Formation Crew size/label Core group Wing group Deep group
120 3 R H, L
220 4 R, U H, L
221 5 R, U H, L B
222 6D R, U H, L F, S
321 6C R, U, C H, L B
223 7 R, U H, L B, F, S
323 8 R, U, C H, L B, F, S
Bossman, a BJ is useful for more than just deep pass plays up the middle. I know, because I have been a BJ and a 6-man deep wing, as well as a line of scrimmage official. I had a play when I was the FJ, and a receiver dove to catch a pass with his back to me. I had no angle whatsoever to rule correctly on that play, and neither did the SJ. The only person who could have had an angle to see that would have been the BJ, but there was none on the field that day (it was only a 6-man HS game in MD), as HL would have been too far, LJ would have not had a good angle, and U's attention would be elsewhere. Other similar plays that are problematic for a 6-man crew, but can be covered well in a 7-man crew include contact by defenders on the inside of receivers on passing plays (At TBFOC, the clinicians showed videos of plays at the college level that were along the sideline where the receiver was grabbed/contacted from the inside, and where only the BJ had a flag, because only he had a good angle. I would assume that similar situations would happen in high school games as well). This is similar to basketball, where a 2-man crew cannot rule properly on plays where there is contact on a ball handler or a shooter opposite the Trail and above the free-throw line extended (That play is in Trail's primary, but he has no good angle to see it. Lead may have an angle, but he should not be looking there, because he has responsibilities elsewhere.), but a 3-man crew can rule properly on that play, because they have an extra official with an inside-out look, just like a football 7-man crew has a Back Judge with an inside-out look to complement the Field Judge and Side Judge's outside-in looks.
I would have to disagree with you on 5 or 6. Personally, I would prefer to work 5-man, because it is easier to build up to 7-man from there by adding two deep wing officials than it would be to move a deep wing with no Back Judge experience to the middle. I know, because I attended the Tom Beard Football Officials Clinic for multiple years as a back judge, even though I started out in a group that did 6-man for their varsity games. It required some adjustments to my perspective to change my keys and areas of responsibility, but with some camp and (semi-pro) game experience, I can be as competent as a 7-man BJ as I was as a 6-man FJ/SJ. In my new association, some of the playoff deep officials (FJ/SJ) are regular season back judges, but others are line of scrimmage officials who move deep, because they can run, and the only adjustments that they have to make are a different starting position and different responsibilities on kick plays (the keys are similar, because both 5-man wings and 7-man deep wings are responsible for the widest man on the line of scrimmage. BJ will pick up the inside receiver on the strong side (same as in 5-man), and the wings in 7-man pick up the backs or other interior receivers on their side who were not picked up by the BJ).
So for your first point, yes, 7 man over 6 man any day of the week.
For 5 vs 6, I would go 6 every time. I disagree the transition from 5 to 7 is easier. I'm involved in a college association that has members from OH and WV that use 5 man mechanics. The new guys have very bad habits from 5 man. Deep wings get beat and want to get spots. LOS officials are running all over the place when they don't need to. U's unnecessarily running to the LOS. Working as a sideline official going from 6 to 7 is easy breezy. Essentially identical mechanics except for pass keys.
Benefits of 6 over 5:
I thing people are so afraid of not having someone deep middle is the biggest problem. In reality, maybe 2 passes go deep middle in a whole year. That is one of the only holes in 6 man, and it only becomes an issue if something actually happens on those 2 passes.
--2 people under the post on FG. You don't need to pull a wing official to go under the post and you have better coverage of all 22 players with 4 officials.
--Extra downfield coverage for modern day pass-happy football.
--Better sideline coverage. All plays can be boxed in by the short and deep wings.
--Goal line is ALWAYS covered by 2 officials. Never have the inside-out look and have it be a guess at the pylon.
--You can work reverse mechanics on changes of possession.
--Wings can officiate keys and stay near the LOS. Can help with pass blocking better.
--U and R don't have to worry about the LOS or forward/backward passes.
--Great coverage on kickoffs. 3 officials on the K/R restraining lines and 3 officials on the goal line. Everything boxed in and you can work reverse mechanics.
--Punt coverage is good to have extra eyes and the LOS officials can keep the play boxed in. Everything boxed in and you can work reverse mechanics.
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I observed two Ohio six-man playoff crews last year and then watched the state finals. I like the six man crew with the Center Judge. The mechanics were easy enough, and I assume that some small changes are likely.
But here in NW Ohio we are having trouble enough coming up with five officials for varsity games. Our crew is using a second year official for half our games. Other crews have done the same, and I've heard of several games where crews went with only four. I've worked a couple of sub-varsity games this year with three when the school was willing to pay four. We just don't have enough guys available.
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Benefits of 6 over 5:
I thing people are so afraid of not having someone deep middle is the biggest problem. In reality, maybe 2 passes go deep middle in a whole year. That is one of the only holes in 6 man, and it only becomes an issue if something actually happens on those 2 passes.
--2 people under the post on FG. You don't need to pull a wing official to go under the post and you have better coverage of all 22 players with 4 officials.
--Extra downfield coverage for modern day pass-happy football.
--Better sideline coverage. All plays can be boxed in by the short and deep wings.
--Goal line is ALWAYS covered by 2 officials. Never have the inside-out look and have it be a guess at the pylon.
--You can work reverse mechanics on changes of possession.
--Wings can officiate keys and stay near the LOS. Can help with pass blocking better.
--U and R don't have to worry about the LOS or forward/backward passes.
--Great coverage on kickoffs. 3 officials on the K/R restraining lines and 3 officials on the goal line. Everything boxed in and you can work reverse mechanics.
--Punt coverage is good to have extra eyes and the LOS officials can keep the play boxed in. Everything boxed in and you can work reverse mechanics.
This is very well stated.