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Football Officiating => Texas Topics => Topic started by: Texas_Newbie on September 01, 2021, 07:51:18 PM
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Team A 1st & 10 at their own 20....
Running the option, QB A7 is pulled down by his facemask by B45 as he pitches the ball to RB A23 behind the LOS at the 18yd line....RB A23 catches the pitch and runs a 20 yd gain to the A40....
Are we tacking on 15 yds to the end of the run?
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Team A 1st & 10 at their own 20....
Running the option, QB A7 is pulled down by his facemask by B45 as he pitches the ball to RB A23 behind the LOS at the 18yd line....RB A23 catches the pitch and runs a 20 yd gain to the A40....
Are we tacking on 15 yds to the end of the run?
You have 2 runs in your play. The Facemask is related to the run by A7 so if they accept the penalty it will be from the previous spot since the foul occurred behind the LOS. Assuming that 20 yd gain was enough for 1st down, they'll decline the penalty.
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Team A 1st & 10 at their own 20....
Running the option, QB A7 is pulled down by his facemask by B45 as he pitches the ball to RB A23 behind the LOS at the 18yd line....RB A23 catches the pitch and runs a 20 yd gain to the A40....
Are we tacking on 15 yds to the end of the run?
Although there is a provision to enforce such a penalty at the end of the last run (if no change of team possession during the down) if the foul happens during a legal forward pass play, this was NOT a legal forward pass play - at least by our interpretation of the action. When you say "pitch," we have to decide whether or not you mean a forward pass or a backward pass. On the assumption - something we hate to do - that the pass was backward, then the FMM foul is penalized per 3 & 1 from the Basic Spot, and the Basic Spot for fouls that occur during a Team A run that ends behind the NZ is the previous spot. As Jason says, the penalty would leave the ball at the A-35 (first down), but the natural result of the down is a first down at the A-40. So, Team A would decline the penalty. And, we are 'assuming' the ball was dead inbounds. So the full ruling would be:
A, 1/10, A-40, ready (25).
It is always helpful to use rule language, rather than colloquial terms, when discussing rule questions, so no one has to guess what is meant. That question might look more like this:
1/10, A-20, 4:00 (1), A=0, B=0. From the A-19, A7 throws the ball to A23 who catches it at the A-18. As A7 was throwing the ball, B45 pulled A7 down by the facemask. A23 advances to the A-40, where he is downed, inbounds.
By describing the spot from which the pass is thrown, and the spot where the pass is caught, we can determine if the pass was forward or backward. And, to be sure we get the clocks handled correctly, we should always indicate if the ball became dead inbounds, or out of bounds.
Having said this, there is some language missing in the rules that makes speaking/writing in pure rule language impossible. The best example is that there is no simple 'rule' expression for a ball carrier being tackled or so held that his progress is stopped (and the ball is dead), or being blocked, or simply falling, off his feet such that something other than hand or foot touches the ground (and the ball is dead). Although colloquial, we always use "down" (or "downed") or, in some cases, "grounded," to mean that the ball has become dead because of one of those actions.
Just food for future thought.