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Football Officiating => General Discussion => Topic started by: Ralph Damren on April 18, 2022, 06:51:02 AM
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The players looked like players......
The officials looked like officials.....
The fans looked like empty seats......
The crowds seemed bigger during the pandemic , did anyone know there was a game being played ??? ???. The Celts, Bruins and Sox were also playing...I did not watch football long :puke:
What say you ?? :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: (7-man crew)
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The problem with playing in a central location yet using city names for the teams. The Birmingham Stallions drew fairly well Saturday night.
Playing the rest of the games on Easter Sunday in the South, which is still a pretty big deal with church and family dinners for some, wasn't a great idea either.
The games all appeared to be close and a couple went down to the end of the game.
I just don't think that an alt league that the NFL is not obviously backing will make it.
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The problem with playing in a central location yet using city names for the teams. The Birmingham Stallions drew fairly well Saturday night.
Playing the rest of the games on Easter Sunday in the South, which is still a pretty big deal with church and family dinners for some, wasn't a great idea either.
The games all appeared to be close and a couple went down to the end of the game.
I just don't think that an alt league that the NFL is not obviously backing will make it.
I agree, HLinNC, it sorta' seemed like singing Christmas Carols at Easter :!# ! In the late 60's I lived in Hartford. The Hartford Knights, of the Continental Football League, lived in Hartford then. They were affiliated with the Buffalo Bills...sorta' like their minor league. They drew well then as many fans looked at the players as possible stars of the future. I'm not sure that the fans can get such a grasp on the USFL players as the NFL will be treated as a rival , not a parent club. Competing with NBA and NHL playoffs, along with MLB, probably won't be a good draw to the average sports fan. :bOW
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I can't wait until an upset player swats that dang drone outta the air. Just gimmicks that serve to do nothing but promote the television network. They do nothing for the game, itself. And get that dang cameraman off the frickin' field. Geez. Amateurs.
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I just want to see a 3-point try!
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Along with a replay official, do they also have a censorship official P_S :o :-X ? With both players and coaches mic'd live, one of those seven >:D 'naughty' >:D words will surely slip in the heat of battle :puke: Parents may be advised that this game is rated :PG-13 and mute is advised for those younger as 'closed-caption' will only show the Queen's English. P_S
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There should be a built in delay just like any other broadcast.
It was refreshing listening to Mike Riley Saturday night repeatedly saying "gosh darnit". I thought I was watching Happy Days.
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Being of the season, I recall after the Boston Marathon massacre. The city of Boston was on a full lockdown, canceling a Red Sox game. After the bad guy was caught P_S, the Sox were back in business. In pre-game, the governor, mayor and a player - Big Papi - were to speak . gov and mayor did fine tiphat: tiphat:. Then came Big Papi " THIS IS OUR F >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D CITY, BOSTON,STRONG" tR:oLl.Out over the airwaves it went, the Sox Jerry Remy responded" Er.... I don't know if I would have put it QUITE like that... :-[ !"
Later that evening ,the commissioner of the FCC spoke to say that normally such a censorship flaw would have drawn a heavy fine to the network. Rarely are exceptions made, one was made that day.
I, too, assume that the USFL has a time delay with a grammar school teacher at the bleep button. Celts, Bruins, Sox and my own baseball umping will be my sports time, and of course, chatting with you guys :).
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Later that evening ,the commissioner of the FCC spoke to say that normally such a censorship flaw would have drawn a heavy fine to the network. Rarely are exceptions made, one was made that day.
I, too, assume that the USFL has a time delay with a grammar school teacher at the bleep button. Celts, Bruins, Sox and my own baseball umping will be my sports time, and of course, chatting with you guys :).
Somewhere. some time ago the sausage industry decided it wasn't a great idea to advertise the ALL inner details of exactly how sausage was made. A concept that seems to apply as well to a game where highly competitive adults engage in aggressive physical interaction. Sometimes too much detail is simply too much detail.
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Was I seeing things or did they have multiple cameramen on the field during live action? I know I know I saw a ground-level camera about five yards in front of and to the side of the place kicker on the opening kickoff, and thought I saw other cameramen in the middle of the field during scrimmage downs (not drones, hand-held cameras being carried by people). Did anyone else see it? I wonder what the rules and mechanics are for those additional obstacles?
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Was I seeing things or did they have multiple cameramen on the field during live action? I know I know I saw a ground-level camera about five yards in front of and to the side of the place kicker on the opening kickoff, and thought I saw other cameramen in the middle of the field during scrimmage downs (not drones, hand-held cameras being carried by people). Did anyone else see it? I wonder what the rules and mechanics are for those additional obstacles?
TV shows and movies, with all the special effects and realistic props, etc are enjoyable and believable . The Goodyear blimp was one thing, but with drones flying thru pass patterns and cameramen in both backfields, makes this more of a production than a game. In 2005, Maine's horror author , Stephen King filmed Empire Falls in Maine. It stared Paul Newman, Ed Harris and Helen Hunt AND had a 0:00.15 scene of a football game...remind me to tell you guys about that some day..... :puke:
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Woke up this morning to about 3" of snow covering everything, after the power came back on. Maybe it's just too early for "Spring" football even with lots of shiny new innovations.
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TV shows and movies, with all the special effects and realistic props, etc are enjoyable and believable . The Goodyear blimp was one thing, but with drones flying thru pass patterns and cameramen in both backfields, makes this more of a production than a game. In 2005, Maine's horror author , Stephen King filmed Empire Falls in Maine. It stared Paul Newman, Ed Harris and Helen Hunt AND had a 0:00.15 scene of a football game...remind me to tell you guys about that some day..... :puke:
Thanks, Ralph. Over the course of my career I was involved in two games that had camera crews in and around the field filming for documentary purposes. Had some camera positioning issues pre-game (What do you mean we can't have a camera platform tripod set up in the end zone?) but overall it was a positive experience. Would like to hear your stories when you get the chance.
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Woke up this morning to about 3" of snow covering everything, after the power came back on. Maybe it's just too early for "Spring" football even with lots of shiny new innovations.
Must be a regional thing, supposed to be 96 here tomorrow.
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Spring's answer to a Nor'easter. Plenty of rain - 1.5-2 inches, plenty of wind - 45-50 MPH, some snow - 1 inch. NO BASEBALL TODAY
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Thanks, Ralph. Over the course of my career I was involved in two games that had camera crews in and around the field filming for documentary purposes. Had some camera positioning issues pre-game (What do you mean we can't have a camera platform tripod set up in the end zone?) but overall it was a positive experience. Would like to hear your stories when you get the chance.
The movie casting took 2 local high school football teams, 4 football officials and a grandstand of screaming kids. I watched the officials from afar as a range war quickly developed. Many wanted to become a 'movie star' , but how could the four ^TD ^TD ^TD ^TD be chosen ??? ??? ??? ???. I quickly announced that I only handle rules 1-10 and this was rule 11 8] . The football game scene was Ed Harris making out with Helen Hunt who was Paul Newman's wife. The football game was in the background. The players, coaches and officials were on the set for about 6 hours, mostly just standing around.The footage of the game lasted about 15 seconds. The officials were paid $50. for being extras, our game fee then was $60.
IF YOU WISH TO BE A 'MOVIE STAR' ,THINK BEFORE YOU SIGN tR:oLl :puke:
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USFL Rule differences:
On a Try Team A may attempt:
* A 1-point Field Goal snapped from the 15-yard line, or;
* A 2-point Touchdown snapped from the 2-yard line, or;
* A 3-point Touchdown snapped from the 10-yard line
Note: Should Team B score a touchdown (defensive conversion) during any try attempt, Team B is awarded 2-points
Teams can attempt to retain the football after a try by choosing:
* A traditional onside kick attempt from the A-25 yard line, or;
* 4th and 12 from the A-33 yard line. If A earns a first down, A retains possession, otherwise, B takes possession at the deadball spot.
I like the 3-point try
I like the 4th and 12 replacement for the Onside Kick (I would prefer 4th and 12 from the A-38? - easier to set up and everyone would know Team A needs to get to the 50?)
While some may disagree, I would support these changes in NFHS
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* 4th and 12 from the A-33 yard line. If A earns a first down, A retains possession, otherwise, B takes possession at the deadball spot.
I'm pretty sure a similar rule change was proposed several years ago in the NCAA. I seem to remember Greg Schiano proposing it while he was still at Rutgers (I could definitely be wrong on this though). I think his proposal was something like 4th and 15 from the 30 yard line. Team A could either go for it or punt it (since they said punts were much safer or had fewer injuries). If they made it, they kept the ball. If they didn't make it, Team B took over at the dead ball spot. I thought it was a pretty good idea since they were trying to make kickoffs less dangerous.
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I wouldn't mind the 3-point PAT, but I wouldn't be in favor of moving the PAT kick back. The kick now is far from automatic and why make it harder ? A defensive score on a PAT has never been on my wish list :(. Possibly an Ivy League math major could calibrate the success rate of a conventional onside kick and pare it with the success rate of a 4th & ___ scrimmage down.
Questions to ponder.....
Would K need to be in scrimmage kick formation ??? ??? ?
If R blocked the kick, would the ball remain alive ??? ??? ?
If B fouled on this 'go for broke' play, would A gain possession ??? ??? ?
Would it just be easier just to give B the ball at the 30/35/40 like in many scrimmages ???
Remember, in the early daze of basketball, a jump ball was held after each basket...someone finally said , let's just give the ball to the other team. In our game, how would K/A be able to get the ball back after they scored, one might ask ? ...By playing good defense, another might answer :thumbup.
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USFL Rule differences:
Teams can attempt to retain the football after a try by choosing:
* A traditional onside kick attempt from the A-25 yard line, or;
* 4th and 12 from the A-33 yard line. If A earns a first down, A retains possession, otherwise, B takes possession at the deadball spot.
I like the 3-point try
I like the 4th and 12 replacement for the Onside Kick (I would prefer 4th and 12 from the A-38? - easier to set up and everyone would know Team A needs to get to the 50?)
While some may disagree, I would support these changes in NFHS
On the 2 "4th & 12" options, how would the precise LTG spot be established (and subsequently determined) if measurement was necessary?
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Especially in high school, there's no reason to make kicks harder. As it is, kick tries in JV games are exceedingly rare around me because if the team has a decent kicker, he's on Varsity and the JV team just goes for two every time.
The 3 point try feels a bit gimmicky to me though. Not to say I wouldn't eventually come around, but I'm not sold yet.
I wouldn't mind seeing the Schiano proposal make an attempt somewhere though. There would need to be some sort of study (or a lot of trial an error) at determining where to put the ball/LTG. If it's a 10+ yard situation, I could see that being difficult for a lot of middling to average high school teams, but you wouldn't want to make it too easy for the really good teams.
Also, if it's a complete mismatch -- 12 time consecutive state champion vs. Little Sisters of the Poor -- LSP could *literally* never get possession of the ball if they couldn't stop that play. You'd probably need a mercy rule caveat.
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On the 2 "4th & 12" options, how would the precise LTG spot be established (and subsequently determined) if measurement was necessary?
Al, no different than a touchback, which is set by rule, 1/10, B-20 (which then becomes the A-20). The LTG is precisely 10 yards in advance, i.e., the A-30. If a subsequent dead ball spot is touching the back edge of the A-30, or beyond, with Team A in possession, - first down.
So, for 4/12 at the A-33, by rule, then the LTG is precisely 12 yards in advance, i.e., the A-45. So, if Team A advances the ball to the near edge of the A-45, with Team A in possession, - first down.
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So, for 4/12 at the A-33, by rule, then the LTG is precisely 12 yards in advance, i.e., the A-45. So, if Team A advances the ball to the near edge of the A-45, with Team A in possession, - first down.
And I'm willing to bet that the yard lines and the LTG have been selected exactly for the ease of measurement, as the A-45 is a full yard line. No unambiguity in determining the outcome (unless of course you have weird penalties enforced before the play, but these would have to be really weird to make the LTG to be a non-five yarder).
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And I'm willing to bet that the yard lines and the LTG have been selected exactly for the ease of measurement, as the A-45 is a full yard line. No unambiguity in determining the outcome (unless of course you have weird penalties enforced before the play, but these would have to be really weird to make the LTG to be a non-five yarder).
Weird? What's weird about the USFL? :)
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Full Disclosure:
I didn't mean to suggest, if, this were to be proposed in NFHS that we could move the kick-try line?
Rather:
* 1-point Field Goal would be put in play at the 3-yard line
* 2-point Touchdown would be put in play at the 3-yard line
* 3-point Touchdown would be put in play at the 10-yard line
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What ever happened to the "BRING BACK THE DROP KICK" crowd :o ! I figured that would have been added with an extra point or such :thumbup .
:sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR:
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What ever happened to the "BRING BACK THE DROP KICK" crowd :o ! I figured that would have been added with an extra point or such :thumbup .
:sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR: :sTiR:
How about these options Ralph?
Proposed NFHS Try options
* 1-point place-kick field goal try would be put in play at the 3-yard line
* 2-point touchdown try would be put in play at the 3-yard line
New * 3-point drop-kick field goal try would be put in play at the 3-yard line
New * 3-point touchdown try would be put in play at the 10-yard line
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How about these options Ralph?
Proposed NFHS Try options
* 1-point place-kick field goal try would be put in play at the 3-yard line
* 2-point touchdown try would be put in play at the 3-yard line
New * 3-point drop-kick field goal try would be put in play at the 3-yard line
New * 3-point touchdown try would be put in play at the 10-yard line
I'd vote for that :). I place for soccer goalies that couldn't make a save ^TD
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Forget the rules. Sell some tickets, and then worry about the rules. Even Birmingham ain't exactly packin' 'em in. More people at a birthday party for a 6-year old than for any of the other games. But, it appears some crews are getting more than one game per weekend. If the checks aren't bouncing, two games per week might be a good thing.
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I'd vote for that :). I place for soccer goalies that couldn't make a save ^TD
OK - Would you also support it if we added 2-points for a defensive conversion? :!#
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OK - Would you also support it if we added 2-points for a defensive conversion? :!#
Only if a runner could go airborne by grabbing onto a low flying drone and then parachute into the end zone. In my daze of youth , we used to play tackle football without any adult supervision on the local high school field with no barb-wired fence or disclaimer/warning signs. The game would usually last until suppertime with the last play for each team being a "I KNOW NO BOUNDS " where the runner could leave the field of play, running behind the bleachers, bomb shelters, hula hoops and the likes. His only goal was to make it to the end zone before getting tackled. Only one rule : Can't use any mode of transportation (bikes, roller skates, ponies, trollies etc) to git there. If the USFL was to adopt this, the boundary should be set at the stadium parking lot. Fans in isle seats could be placed in danger and a disclaimer on the reverse side of the ticket should explain such.
EDITORIAL NOTE: These are only musings of a tired and grumpy ole' duffer, returning from a spring cleaning of our lakeside cottage and not a suggestion or proposal for NFHS rules. Leaving school property during a school function could cause a liability issue. 8]
:sTiR:
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In this era of '24/7' coverage of everything, I'm afraid sometimes topics get quite obscure. The other night there was a riveting discussion on a local sports radio station regarding the current pay scale of the USFL......
It was stated that the minimum player's salary is $600/game BUT the players all have to stay in a league-owned hotel . If they choose to have a roommate, each are charged $75/night :!#. If my math is correct, that sounds like $525 of your paycheck would leave a player with $75 spending money :o :puke:
The talking heads also went on to say that if the USFL makes a profit ,after three years, teams from far away cities may come to play , not just local teams with names from far away cities tiphat:
I quickly turned off the radio and went back to sleep. 8] In the morning, I pondered : (1) Was this just a bad dream ??? , (2) "fake news" :puke: , (3) A remake of the movie....
THEY SHOOT HORSES, DON'T THEY ? -I don't think Jane Fonda would star in this one :!#
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WE ARE A MERE FEW WEEKS FROM THE USFL SEASON-OPENING KICKOFF tR:oLl
Do any of you know if they have pre-season games and will they be televised ??? ???
Where nearly all the teams claim to be from places that they are not really from, the USFL could hold an auction to their fans to rename those teams and raise some needed $$$...
If I was to bid, Estcourt Station (Maine's northern-most town) probably would be my choice. However, part of Estcourt Station is in Canada and can only be reached by a road from Canada.I'm unsure if the USFL is ready for international exposure. I am sure, that not being a USFL fan, I would not bid in such an event.
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When I went to school in Scotland, there was a football club named Partick Thistle in Glasgow that got relegated from the top flight all the way down to the bottom... the top two teams, Celtic and Rangers, absolutely hate each other, (violently at times) and when challenged, oftentimes people would say they were a Partick Thistle supporter to get out of the situation (and possibly evoke sympathy). Every once in a while you'd see a jersey, but not often.
I'd love to see the Estcourt Station <insert mascot> being a viable contender/answer when asked who someone's favorite team is.
Just because.
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Ralph, I think Fox and NBC are the two networks carrying USFL. I imagine a lot of the games will wind up on their cable or streaming channels.
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When I went to school in Scotland, there was a football club named Partick Thistle in Glasgow that got relegated from the top flight all the way down to the bottom... the top two teams, Celtic and Rangers, absolutely hate each other, (violently at times) and when challenged, oftentimes people would say they were a Partick Thistle supporter to get out of the situation (and possibly evoke sympathy). Every once in a while you'd see a jersey, but not often.
I'd love to see the Estcourt Station <insert mascot> being a viable contender/answer when asked who someone's favorite team is.
Just because.
The Maine side of the border has a population of four in Estcourt Station. If there were a mascot, I would say it was the Sled Dawgs as ,without driving thru Canada, the closest Maine town - Allagash - can only be reached by dog sleds or snowmobiles in the Winter. Their 'team motto' could be : "ONLY THE LEAD DOG IN A DOG SLED HAS A CHANGE OF SCENERY. cRaZy
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Ralph, I think Fox and NBC are the two networks carrying USFL. I imagine a lot of the games will wind up on their cable or streaming channels.
Thanks, HL, but our CBS affiliate often carries Law & Order reruns . An other activity for we Mainers will be watching the mud dry :).
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WE ARE A MERE FEW WEEKS FROM THE USFL SEASON-OPENING KICKOFF tR:oLl
I have not seen it mentioned here, but the XFL starts tonight. ESPN.
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I have not seen it mentioned here, but the XFL starts tonight. ESPN.
Is it live or reruns of their short lifespan ??? If reruns, a sharp bookie could profit from an unsharp football junkie :!# . As I recall, the highlight of the XFL games was, in lieu of a coin toss, two opposing big ole' Bubbas would dive for a loose football.
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Is it live or reruns of their short lifespan ??? If reruns, a sharp bookie could profit from an unsharp football junkie :!# . As I recall, the highlight of the XFL games was, in lieu of a coin toss, two opposing big ole' Bubbas would dive for a loose football.
The XFL is live football and started this weekend.
Below is a link to their rules modifications.
https://www.xfl.com/rules
The kickoffs are very different this season.
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The XFL is live football and started this weekend.
Below is a link to their rules modifications.
https://www.xfl.com/rules
The kickoffs are very different this season.
That does spur my interest to at least watch the opening kickoff. I love sports and football is at the top of my list BUT THE New England Bruins are 42-8 (best in NHL) and THE New England Celtics are
42-17 (best in NBA) . The Sox are in spring training and I'm preparing for my umpiring as soon as the mud dries. My football will be mostly chattting with you guys and a state coaches clinic coming up in a few weeks. Chatting with you guys is more fun :).
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ESPN 4 PM EST 2/26
XFL game -somebody plays somebody...stay tuned.../.
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Orlando vs SA, watched the first period. Mutterings of an ole' duffer.....
Sorta' like watching two unranked college teams - some players claim to fame was once drafted by NFL.
They didn't show 'coin toss' which used to be two big ole' Bubbas diving for a loose ball.
It appeared to be three officials in the backfield- the ref(wearing an adjustable hat), guy with red hat and lady with a ponytail.
Kickoffs seemed confusing.
Fans all sat on one side of the stadium.
Will USFL play XFL for some kind of championship ??
.....but it is football
Time to walk my hunting dawg before the sun sets.....
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Red hat's job is to spot the football, no other job. They are using 7 person crews with 1 RO and 1 X (ball spotter). All XFL officials are FBS level.
Striped t-shirts look cheesy.
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Red hat's job is to spot the football, no other job. They are using 7 person crews with 1 RO and 1 X (ball spotter). All XFL officials are FBS level.
Striped t-shirts look cheesy.
The striped tee shirts along with the adjustable hats make the officials resemble what one might see on a Pop Warner field.
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adjustable hats
More maddening- the referee (white) hats were all adjustable as were the female officials. (The NFL just went to adjustable caps for the ladies this past season, ostensibly so they didn't have to keep tucking ponytails up in their cap.). The ball spotters (red hats) and male non-referees were all wearing sized/solid back caps. The uniforms look cheap, save the pants. The former Alliance league unis were a bit gaudy but at least still looked official.
Under Armour is obviously the uniform sponsor but they screwed the pooch on this rig. One would think Dean Blandino would have had more influence than that.
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Will there be a playoff between the XFL & USFL to see who's the best of....whatever ??
last question....
Would the best of these two leagues be able to compete with the worst NFL team ??
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Will there be a playoff between the XFL & USFL to see who's the best of....whatever ??
last question....
Would the best of these two leagues be able to compete with the worst NFL team ??
Remember when a group of college all-stars would play an NFL team? (Yes, that used to happen, but those days are looooong gone, and ain't never coming back). The All-Stars competed, but were just out-classed. I think a USFL/XFL vs NFL second level team would be much like that.
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Remember when a group of college all-stars would play an NFL team?
The last game was in '76. It got called due to a t-storm with torrential rain. It was starting to die before that as NFL coaches didn't want their star rookie draft choices playing in it.
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Remember when a group of college all-stars would play an NFL team? (Yes, that used to happen, but those days are looooong gone, and ain't never coming back). The All-Stars competed, but were just out-classed. I think a USFL/XFL vs NFL second level team would be much like that.
1963 the college All-Stars beat the Green Bay Packers