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Football Officiating => Texas Topics => Topic started by: Welpe on August 23, 2010, 02:34:40 PM
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Got this in a chapter e-mail blast today. I'm sure most have seen it but just sending it along.
Stay hydrated folks! This ex-Californian is trying not to melt in this heat. ;)
August 21, 2010
My fellow officials,
These past few weeks we have experienced record breaking temperatures of 100 plus and heat index readings exceeding 110 across the State. This weather trend appears to be statewide. The high temperatures, the use of artificial turf fields, and players going both ways, mandates the need to be vigilant that we are affording the student athletes and officials as well, additional opportunities to hydrate during games, and for athletes to be monitored by coaches and training staff.
For the next three weeks I would like us to call an official's time out approximately midway during each quarter of each game, for all levels of play. For 12 minute quarters approximately at the 6 minute mark 30 seconds either side; for 10 minute quarters at the 5 minute mark; the 8 minute quarters at the 4 minute mark and so forth. These time outs will be standard length and teams be instructed to go to their sidelines. It should be called following the completion of a try, after a field goal, a punt, or a change of team possession.
This policy should be relayed to Coaches during the pregame conference. During the game wing officials should verbalize that the time out may be forthcoming so staff can be preparing. We should also allow training staff to hydrate and attend to players during any extended injury timeout but should not be extended beyond when normal play should be resumed.
At the end of this three week period we will revisit this policy.
A reminder to all of our officials that proper hydration is a day long process. Start drinking fluids early and continue during the day. The fluids you take during the game should be to replenish your water loss Drink plenty and often and be mindful of how you are feeling.
Best of luck to you this week and be safe in your travels.
Bill Fecci
President TASO Football Division
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Did this go out to all TASO members or just chapter leadership?
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I didn't get an e-mail directly so I'm thinking perhaps just leadership. It was sent to us from our executive secretary.
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Two comments:
1. I think this directive is just common sense, and we do not have to wait for someone to tell us to take these measures. If it is hot enough, do what you have to do for yourself and the players to stay hydrated. I have called time outs in varsity games in the past in order to get everyone hydrated without a directive. It was a good idea to remind everyone that we can do this.
2. I have a game in a domed stadium with air conditioning on Saturday. Does the policy still stand? ;D ;D ;D
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As I'm sure most of you did, I got this same e-mail directly from TASO this morning.
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I know this is being done for safety, but doesn't it seem like we (TASO) are making up our own rules here? I can see the UIL mandating such things but does TASO have that right? Does this take away the advantage a well-conditioned, well-hydrated team has over one that is not as prepared?
Not trying to start a fight, but I can see both sides to this.
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I understand exactly what you are saying TXBJ. I take it back to the coin toss situation. If Team A wins the toss and says they want to defend the endzone instead of saying they want the ball I let Team B in theory start off each half with the ball. A coach has a limited amount of time each week to coach his kids. Some coaches use a portion of that time to go over coin tossing duties instead of practicing tackling. We would not re-do a play if a kid that knows how to do a coin toss misses a tackle. So we should not re-do a coin toss if a kid that knows how to tackle does not do the coin toss correctly. I guarantee that the team that gets screwed over one time at a coin toss will be given strict instructions on what to do during a coin toss the following week.
The same thing can be said about hydration. If a coach has a player that cramps up you can be assured that he will spend more time on proper hydration the next week. Why punish a team that has already prepared for the heat? Did this message go out to all coaches. I question the increase in liability that this email has created. Now if something happens all a lawyer has to say is why were the players not hydrated according to the mandate. When in reality the referee could not have known about the policy or both coaches told him not to do it during pregame.
Where does the player safety slippery slope end? First tint shield, now hydration, then butt padd size, then mandatory concussion reevaluation. I am not trying to sound heartless, but enough already. Safety is an issue that needs to be addressed by coaches and administrators not officials. I have actually turned in UIL reports about 28 minute half times, and not wearing safety pads. Does the UIL do anything....NOPE.
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I know this is being done for safety, but doesn't it seem like we (TASO) are making up our own rules here? I can see the UIL mandating such things but does TASO have that right? Does this take away the advantage a well-conditioned, well-hydrated team has over one that is not as prepared?
Not trying to start a fight, but I can see both sides to this.
It has been a long standing UIL policy to let officials take a time out for these type of breaks. We have the authority under the rules to take an officials time out, why not use it for a safety concern?
SECTION 3. Timeouts: Starting and Stopping
the Clock
Timeout
ARTICLE 1. a. An official shall signal timeout when the rules provide for
stopping the clock or when a timeout is charged to a team or to the referee.
Other officials should repeat timeout signals. The referee may declare
and charge himself with a discretionary timeout for any contingency not
elsewhere covered by the rules (A.R. 3-3-1-V and VI).
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It's not so much that we are taking the TO for the teams, but it's also for us officials to get some fluids. If they don't want to get water that is fine, but I will take advantage of it for myself.
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Mid period water breaks are mandatory in FL until mid October and may be taken after that if needed at discretion of the referee.
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It's not so much that we are taking the TO for the teams, but it's also for us officials to get some fluids. If they don't want to get water that is fine, but I will take advantage of it for myself.
Exactamente!!! It isn't about being fair or not fair, etc. It is about safety. That's the number 1 reason we are out there, so keep them hydrated. Would you allow the game to continue with an unsafe field or a player with unsafe equipment or if the lights went out? I hope not. The breaks should only come after change of possession, including TD's, safeties, etc. This is just plain common sense.
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I haven't gotten a TASO e-mail since I don't know when...
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Nor have I. I went to the site and put my email back in and that has been like 3 months and still nothing. Maybe it is the change to new format or something.
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I know this is being done for safety, but doesn't it seem like we (TASO) are making up our own rules here? I can see the UIL mandating such things but does TASO have that right? Does this take away the advantage a well-conditioned, well-hydrated team has over one that is not as prepared?
Not trying to start a fight, but I can see both sides to this.
In theory, a well conditioned team will still be better coming out of the break. They will be well conditioned AND hydrated. The other team will be poorly conditioned and hydrated. When the RFP whistle blows, there is still a team that has an advantage in the cardiovascular area. Remember, football is an anaerobic activity!
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You guys missing TASO emails need to contcat the web site admin. Essntially if they ever get a failure for hwatever a reason on your email address their system QUITS sending any emails to you at all. Then you need to contact them to have it reset. I have raised this issue with TASO and to me further shows a reason why we need a new web site and system. Once I had mine reset I started seeing information again.
This is also why it is important to any chapter officer who gets it they need to pass on to their memebrship.
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You guys missing TASO emails need to contcat the web site admin. Essntially if they ever get a failure for hwatever a reason on your email address their system QUITS sending any emails to you at all. Then you need to contact them to have it reset. I have raised this issue with TASO and to me further shows a reason why we need a new web site and system. Once I had mine reset I started seeing information again.
This is also why it is important to any chapter officer who gets it they need to pass on to their memebrship.
I heard they have a new website but won't roll it out until after all the rules testing is completed on the current one.
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I heard they have a new website but won't roll it out until after all the rules testing is completed on the current one.
Cool.
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I understand the points many are trying to make. However, if I'm a coach (perish the thought) of a well-conditioned team that knows how to hydrate and I run a no-huddle, "snap it as soon as they blow the ready" type of offense to wear the other team out, shouldn't I be concerned that the OFFICIALS have decided to give my opponent 4 extra time-outs per game to catch their breath and get some water?
Further, the policy leaves no room for judgment the first 3 weeks. As TexDoc said, some games are in air-conditioned indoor facilities, but the policy still says you give the extra time-outs for all games. A front could come in and it might be 70 degrees at game time but we still have to stop it 4 times a game.
As for the time-outs being for us as well as kids, we are grown men that should be smart enough to keep properlyl hydrated. If a game needs to be stopped for us, we are not in shape to be working it.
We're taking on responsibility that should be placed on the teams and I'm not sure we have the authority to do so. I'll do it rather than risk the santioning of my crew or chapter but I don't think it is right.
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^flag
So if both head coaches indicate that they do not wish to follow this prescribed hydration procedure, are we, as officials, to just dispense with its administration and go ahead and play football under the normal rules? Or is this supposed to be mandatory? Notwithstanding support from the Good Folks over at the UIL, I take it that we, at least, do have a firm agreement from the THSCA for using this procedure. z^
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Sent from - UIL Officials [officials@mail.uil.utexas.edu]
MEMO
TO: Football Coaches
FROM: UIL Athletic Staff
SUBJECT: Mandatory Timeouts
DATE: August 25, 2010
The Texas Association of Sports Officials (TASO) recently sent a memo to football officials mandating a new policy regarding heat related issues. This memo creates a new rule that is currently not part of the NCAA rules, nor is it a UIL rule. This policy has been considered in previous years but has been objectionable to coaches, therefore has not become policy.
The UIL Legislative Council must approve changes to policy. If this policy is important to our schools it should be presented to the UIL Medical Advisory Committee, UIL Athletic Committee and/or to the UIL Legislative Council.
NCAA Football Rules 68 Section 3 regarding timeouts states: “The referee may declare and charge himself with a discretionary timeout for any contingency not elsewhere covered by the rules.”
In the interim, schools may utilize procedures that ensure the protection and safety of student athletes by mutual agreement. Any other mandatory rule changes or policies are not authorized by the UIL.
Pre-determined, mandatory timeouts during each quarter are not authorized and shall not be utilized unless both schools mutually agree to this provision prior to the contest.
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And now water is controversial
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As was pointed out already, we have the authority to order the timeout, without mutual agreement. This is a knee jerk reaction by UIL (and we know why). If you want to ask for the mutual agreement beforehand, go for it. Does anyone seriously think any coach will NOT go along with this???
Also, where is "Rule 68" in the NCAA rulebook?
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I am still looking for rule 68....maybe its in the new football rule manual.
I was just thrilled to post something before you!
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I find it interesting TASO can't manage to send me one email but the UIL sent me one at two different email addresses, despite me never giving them contact info.
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WOW the UIL wants to make this a big deal instead of simply saying the easiest thing, ask coaches in pre game if they want to adhere to this. They are making a big deal out of nothing. This is not any different then a televised game or game that requires extended media time outs, guys are gonna get water then.
I do not see how an extra 30 seconds on natural changes of possesion, td/pat transitions etc are gonna be a huge deal.
Unbelievable.
AND why is the UIL contacting me directly?? They need to communicate through TASO on this period. Then allow one message to trickle down. Just my 2 cents.
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It's a shame that we can do something that is allowable by rule in the interest of the kids' safety...and the UIL turns it into a POURING contest about jurisdiction. ^flag
SCREW YOU UIL...I'M GOING TO FOLLOW THE TASO GUIDELINE BECAUSE YOU HAVE NO AUTHORITY MR. TIMMONS!!! ^no
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I also am blown away, cause UIL is able to contact me better than TASO. So do we or don't we? Got a game tomorrow so kind of need to know.
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I haven't received anything from the UIL. I will be following the guidelines sent to me by my chapter. :)
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We will ask the coaches. It is that simple. It is a precaution measure that can be used. If coaches say no then it is on them.We will just ask them before the game. If both are good then do it. Else a normal game. Not like it would be that abnormal anyway if you instituted this. I am truly baffled by the entire debate and why it got here.
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This just plain stupid.. I have all they authority I need Under the rules to send these kids to the sideline for water. I will excercise that authority and water the kids. With or without UIL or Coaches approval. Every Year we hear of a High School Kid, College Kids, and profesional atheletes DIE because of heat and lack of hydration. I don't care one bit if the coaches UIL or anyone else has an issue with me allowing them to get water even if it gives em time to rest. That is an acceptable side effect. IMHO
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This just plain stupid.. I have all they authority I need Under the rules to send these kids to the sideline for water. I will excercise that authority and water the kids. With or without UIL or Coaches approval. Every Year we hear of a High School Kid, College Kids, and profesional atheletes DIE because of heat and lack of hydration. I don't care one bit if the coaches UIL or anyone else has an issue with me allowing them to get water even if it gives em time to rest. That is an acceptable side effect. IMHO
+1
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^flag
I really thought that Fecci's explanation of the TASO hydration policy on KENS-TV(San Antonio) was an excellent one. The head coach who was interviewed in this piece was very supportive of it, but it was all too apparent that he was not from the UIL. Now it appears that the only "acceptable" way that this policy can be implemented with the tiphat: Good UIL Drs. blessing, is for both head coaches to agree to this policy prior to the games actual kickoff. Other than that, the UIL notice seems to have sent out the negative undertones of its message that it finds this "unneeded" policy most repulsive and unacceptable!
Methinks that sometime in the very near future, the good folks over on Manor Road will begin to think up some acceptable form of recapitulation with the issuance of a carefully-worded prepared statement of limited support, primarily because for them to try to buck TASO on this particular item will definitely not play very well in the court of public opinion; not even taking into exception that the UIL still finds itself well-entrenched in a nasty lawsuit with TASO, and objecting to something that may well have the potential to ultimately save a kids life~ well, that's just one road that the tiphat: Good UIL Dr. just really doesn't want to saunter down at this particular point in time! z^
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http://www.kens5.com/sports/Water-nolonger-sign-of-weakness-UIL-changes-water-guidelines-101394629.html
Link to the TV story
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txgray I completely agree we have the autority regardless of coaches UIL etc to do this in a game. I was taking the high road in stating we can simply ask coaches. In a 90 plus game on turf at kick off we might not ask anyone.
Bottom line is UIL did not take the high road in this message. I do not think they are smelling very rosey on this issue.
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Part of my Pre-Game Conversation with the Coach.. " Coach the Temperatures have been very high and has been hard for the kids to maintain good hydration levels over the past few weeks. We are still experiencing those same conditions this week. Under the rules I am allowed to stop or delay the restarting of the game clock anytime i feel conditions or situations warrant such actions. I fully expect to that tonight it will be necessary for me use that authority and allow a little extra time in each quarter for the kids to stay hydrated. It will be somewhere in the middle of each quarter. most likely in a change of possession when the teams are already on the sidelines substituting Offense for Defense they will just be allowed to stay on the sideline just a little longer. I don't feel this will create any noticeable increase in the length of the game nor give either team an advantage over the other nor should it effect the style of play by either team. I will/have explained this with the other Head Coach and he is aware of my intentions".
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^flag
TxGrayhat: I heartily concur. The only discernible difference in mine will be that on the hydration issue, I will make a point to interview both head coaches together. Then we should be able to find common ground and reach a firm agreement prior to my blowing the whistle for the opening kickoff! z^
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It will be somewhere in the middle of each quarter. most likely in a change of possession when the teams are already on the sidelines substituting Offense for Defense they will just be allowed to stay on the sideline just a little longer. I don't feel this will create any noticeable increase in the length of the game nor give either team an advantage over the other nor should it effect the style of play by either team.
tiphat: Hats off. That's right-on.
I know how I plan to deal with this, and how to communicated to the coaches, and it will not be an issue or even noticeable.
UIL must get them a PR firm. There is no way anyone in PR would ever allow this message to have been sent the way it was worded. They just seem to keep digging themselves a little deeper. What the UIL seems to be disregard, surprise, surprise, is that this is as much for the officials as it is the players.
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"UIL Officials" don't need water.
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I will be stopping the clock for hydration time outs with or without "permission". In fact, I may do a UIL Incident report just to let the folks on Manor Rd. know that I did it................... >:D
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I will be stopping the clock for hydration time outs with or without "permission". In fact, I may do a UIL Incident report just to let the folks on Manor Rd. know that I did it................... >:D
^flag
Now I like that! Filing a UIL Incident Report... against the UIL! That's priceless! In fact, I like that idea so much, I think that all of us need to overload their Incident Report hoppers with reports against them.
Either that, or forward the UIL's response to TASO to the various influential Texas state legislators! I would think that they would love to know exactly what's going on! z^
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Many of you have been contacted directly by the UIL with an email concerning the procedural memo I sent regarding the hydration of players and officials. In light of the contradictory memos from TASO and UIL I would like to clear up and give specific references to the UIL memo as to mine.
The term “policy” refers to procedural guidelines for TASO members only. Nowhere does my statement indicate that I am advocating or changing a UIL policy, nor creating a change or authoring a new NCAA rule.
The memo does not say to use a mandatory time out. The time out referred to as an official’s time out, is the interval where officials will verbally encourage the teams to hydrate. The actual game stoppage as was noted later in the memo is to be done during the normal dead ball interval that follows the completion of a try, after a successful field goal, a punt, or change of team possession at a time that would not affect a team’s momentum. No independent time out was indicated to be called. The noting as to approximately near the mid point of each quarter is a reference so players and officials will be encouraged to hydrate.
The extended time of the dead ball intervals, where we encourage the hydration of players and officials, were to be of standard “time out” length. However here is where official’s discretion has and can be used under rule 3-3-1a to extend the time out until the officials feel all team members have had an opportunity to be furnished liquid. Historically this has not been longer than an additional 30 seconds or so. This is what we have done in previous years with the UIL’s knowledge and acceptance. I have no knowledge that Coaches requested that this procedure be stopped or that they have a problem with us giving additional time to help safeguard their players.
This is all about common sense and good judgment. We are not implementing a mandatory time out, we are not changing the NCAA rules, and we are not setting policy. Before the game the referee should discuss with both coaches, that during a normal break, about the mid point of each quarter, we may extend the normal break to allow the teams and officials the time needed to hydrate if conditions warrant.
With this clarification I again, as my original note to the chapter presidents and secretaries’ indicated, want to reinforce the need to discuss with the coaches during pregame what our intentions are with this procedure and ask for their consent and agreement.
I find it unfortunate that my communication has caused some misunderstandings between our membership, our coaches, school administrators and the UIL. Taso Football will continue to foster a productive relationship with all concerned now and in the future.
Finally, let me be clear. I make no apology for directing the TASO Football Officials to be mindful of the conditions our student athletes must compete in. I will continue to insist that officials take whatever steps within the rules afforded us under NCAA and UIL, to keep these youngsters as safe as possible.
Thank you and best of luck for a good start to the season this weekend.
Bill Fecci,
President
TASO Football Division
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"Football Rules 68," the one right before rule 69, stipulates that as TT plays Horatio Hornblower to Dr. B, Dr. B is in no way obligated to simultaneously reciprocate, thus, 68.
Lord forgive me, I just could not help myself.
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This whole thing is priceless. The UIL couldn't make a bigger BUTT of themselves. Don't they have anyone proof read thier stuff for content and effect? This blew up in thier face because of thier own arrogance.
BTW, we implemented this practice today and both coaches were very, very, VERY supportive.
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It went fine in my game as well. We just extended the intermission after a score or held the RFP a bit longer after a punt and the coaches greatly appreciated it. This really should be a non-issue.
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Samer here. Went great and our coaches liked and even helpfully remined us of them each quarter. We simply added 30 seconds on interval to kick off or did a to after a punt. Was very easy to manage.
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First varsity game last night. One coach did not want to do the "timeout" so we obliged his request. What he didn't even realized was that we did take extra time during the normal stoppages in the game. Just take your time and they don't even notice. We had at least 8 stoppages throughout the game due to players getting cramps. During that time we sent the players off to get water as they tended to the cramping player. Both teams received ample time for water and they were all drinking it as intended.
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We had the same experience as Jason's in our game. Coaches did not want (or were told not to want). It was televised so they had all kinds of breaks (and still had cramping)
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We did it last night during our JV game. It went well with no complaints. We had a slight breeze which helped alot. I just think it would be easier to extend the quarter breaks by a few minutes than to interrupt the quarter. Adding 2-3 minutes to the quarter changeover after the 1st and 3rd would help with hydration. Most natural breaks in the game ar at the end of quarters and the halves anyway.
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At our game last night I told both coaches we were going to take the timeouts and both agreed. First quarter, one team called time out about the 7 min mark so I just made that TO longer. 2nd and third quarters we did an officials TO. Fourth quarter we had a stoppage on a score about midway and we just extended the time.
We did not have to stop for any cramps ( unless you count my umpire)
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It wasn't cramps...it was a snickers break!!!
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Similar to many of you we added 30 seconds to the breaks closest to the mid point of each quarter. Both Coaches agreed to whatever we wanted to do if it helped their players. Surprisingly we did not have any injury timeouts for cramps but a number of them for the usual dinged up player situations.
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3 Varsity and 2 JV games and so far no coach has wanted the extra time.
I love the idea of a snickers break though.
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https://www.brainshark.com/taso/vu?pi=zHez16fbTBzX2Prz0
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I know this is a very old thread but... wow. that was wild.
I personally DNGAF what UIL thinks about whether I have a 'timeout' in a game for hydration for players. In fact, if I do call a water break TO, I'll just simply tell the coaches it's so my officials can get/stay hydrated.
I am not one to normally have an attitude of 'my field, my rules' but when it's 107 outside, I'm giving kids (and officials) every opportunity to stay hydrated.
I actually think UIL would be well served to follow NFHS example (gasp!) and mandate water breaks for games in August through at least mid-September. There's no competitive advantage if both coaches know it is coming.
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So basically the climate was the same 13 years ago. HAF.
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So basically the climate was the same 13 years ago. HAF.
And as it was during the dust bowl of the 30's - long before the proliferation of oil-based energy. Yeah, we have climate change. 4 times every year. And nature makes a natural 'correction' every 100 years or so. Glad I have never had to work a game during a haboob (yet). But, thanks to Covid (natural or man-made - who knows?) we all have masks to wear in such event!
Nature will take care of herself. Just wait 'til landfills become overflowing with toxic waste from old electric car batteries. And mining for battery chemicals is pretty unfriendly, as well:
"The manufacturing processes of lithium, including the solvent and mining waste, presents significant environmental and health hazards.[139][140][141] Lithium extraction can be fatal to aquatic life due to water pollution.[142] It is known to cause surface water contamination, drinking water contamination, respiratory problems, ecosystem degradation and landscape damage.[139] It also leads to unsustainable water consumption in arid regions (1.9 million liters per ton of lithium).[139] Massive byproduct generation of lithium extraction also presents unsolved problems, such as large amounts of magnesium and lime waste.[143]
In the United States, open-pit mining, mountaintop removal mining competes with brine extraction mining.[144] Environmental concerns include wildlife habitat degradation, potable water pollution including arsenic and antimony contamination, unsustainable water table reduction, and massive mining waste, including radioactive uranium byproduct and sulfuric acid discharge."
Never mind the limited availability of these chemicals.
I'll stick with gas-powered vehicles, thank you. Now, back to football.
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I got overheated in my JV game last week and had to sit out the last minute and a half of the first half. I sat in the shade with some ice water through halftime and was able to work the whole second half. We had kicked off at 5:00 at 102F, and it’s humid here near the coast. I haven’t had any issues during scrimmages or the varsity game when we’ve kicked at 6:00-7:00, including a 3 hour 3 way scrimmage without any long breaks.
I have 3 games at 5:00 this week and would like to avoid getting overheated again. Any tips or advice? I felt like I’d been hydrating well all week. I’m thinking about cooling neck towels, a freezable cooling vest, or keeping my own bottle of ice water on the field.
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Try some of that Liquid IV. That stuff works.
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You're the second person I've heard recommend that. I'll have to give it a try.
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Ended up dunking my undershirt in ice water before heading to the game, and dunking my hat in icewater right before the game. Works pretty well. Also keep an iced down bottle of water in my pocket, and chug a bottle of the liquid IV at halftime. Much improved.