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Football Officiating => NCAA Discussion => Topic started by: TXMike on November 28, 2010, 08:51:26 PM

Title: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: TXMike on November 28, 2010, 08:51:26 PM


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Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: TxSkyBolt on November 28, 2010, 08:58:26 PM
Nope.  Ball carrier was about as low to the ground as he could be and still be on his feet.  Defender initiated contact with his shoulder pad, effecting the tackle.  I can sympathize with the calling official with all the attention helmet contact fouls have gotten.  Err on side of caution, but if calling the foul is intended to teach proper tackling techniques, what did this defender learn?

Best regards,

Brad
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: RBase2 on November 28, 2010, 09:34:40 PM
I think the hit was clean...however, maybe he should have picked up another 15 for pulling the head gear off...I think I saw this a couple of times this weekend.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: NCAA-SJ on November 28, 2010, 10:31:27 PM
Technically, I think you have a foul here; but not for contact above the shoulders.  To me, it looks that he ducked his head at the last minute and led with the crown of his helmet (which is a foul from head to toe....technically).  I agree that it looks that the shoulder pad made 1st contact, but when his face went into the dirt, you could argue 'crown of the helmet'.

Now, having said that, I'd like to hold my flag on this one.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: Etref on November 29, 2010, 07:38:58 AM
 ^no
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: MJT on November 29, 2010, 08:12:36 AM
Tough one. I think you would get supported on the call either way by your supervisors. I can definitely see both points, but I'm pretty sure you'd get supported if you did have a flag down.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: Birddog on November 29, 2010, 09:21:15 AM
Suprising call for Pac 10 officials.  My un-scientific observations is they are not as prone to call these type of targeting hits as some of the other conferences. 
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: Etref on November 29, 2010, 09:30:15 AM
Another thought is the U may have been dinged the week before for missing a helmet to helmet and was not going to let it happen again.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: The Ref Thats Lef on November 29, 2010, 11:52:05 AM
Should we read anything into this by how he throws the flag. Seems like he felt the spot was not important. Of course on a defensive penalty it is not but how many of us throw our flags differently on a live ball penalty?
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: cougar729 on November 29, 2010, 01:32:33 PM
If the style of the flag throwing is anyway connected with the certainty of a foul occuring, I would say he was 100% sure it was a foul   ^flag
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: 110 on November 29, 2010, 04:38:38 PM
Good gravy, no. This isn't a foul, imho. Not even close.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: todd.gundlach@norwoodligh on November 30, 2010, 06:05:54 PM
I had a similar penalty this year, as an Umpire. The method of throwing the flag indicates dead ball as many have commented. IF he thought the progress had stopped and this hit came in, then I understand the penalty. In my case the runner was down, progress stopped and someone came in to 'clean up' and hit the runner in the head with his leading forearm (although quickly after the play ended).

I took some heat on that call; it was 3rd and long, now first down and the team eventually scored on the drive. On the ensuing KO, I purposely sought out the HC of the offending team and made sure he had ample opportunity to give me the business (I believe I could see his fingerprints and know I felt his DNA on my face) as I brought the ball up his sideline to K's restraining line.

I then casually explained to him my intrepretation of a blatant hit to a defenseless player's head after the play was dead, all of which could have warranted a DQ which we are strongly encouraged not to do.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: Curious on December 01, 2010, 10:19:08 AM
No way I see a foul here...(an IW maybe)

The runner was not down and the hit was with the shoulder.

Question: should the tackler been penalized for removing his helmet?  Boy, that might have REALLY made the Arizona coach crazy!
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: allen on December 02, 2010, 10:17:57 AM
In my honest umpire opinion, this is not a foul. Not even close.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: TxGrayhat on December 05, 2010, 05:01:09 PM
Not a foul .... hEaDbAnG  lead with shoulder. head was down because the tackle was down ... contact was at the shoulder.
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: With_Two_Flakes on December 05, 2010, 10:20:18 PM
Just my 2 cents worth to play Devils Advocate.

From Points of Emphasis
Intentional helmet to helmet contact is never legal, nor is any other blow directed toward an opponents head.


Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: scottv on December 06, 2010, 12:16:27 AM
One more for paassing on this call ^no
Title: Re: You Make the Call, Personal Foul ?
Post by: Arbitrator on December 06, 2010, 10:55:09 AM
 ^flag

Looked like shoulder pad to helmet to me! Perfectly legal in my book!   z^