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Football Officiating => NCAA Discussion => Topic started by: CenTexTM on September 01, 2012, 10:19:38 AM
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Team B recovers a fumble and during their long touchdown run the HL has to detour around a player or coach in the field of play but does not make contact. The HL drops a flag for sideline interference. Several questions arise...
What is the proper enforcement? What determines whether this is a 5 or 15 yard variety? Is this enforced as a live-ball-treated-as-dead foul, and does the opposing team have the option of enforcing on the try or kickoff? Does this negate the touchdown?
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It is treated as a dead ball foul. Enforce at the succeeding spot. Try or Kickoff. The first 2 occasions it is a 5 yard penalty. All those after the first two are 15 yards. There have been discussions that suggest to enforce 15 yards if contact is made with someone who is in the restricted area.
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5, 5 then 15 yards succeeding spot.
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You can never foul and have the score count, b ball 5 from the flag. First down b, assuming the dodge on the sideline was before the td, if it was after dead ball foul, 5 on try or kickoff.
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You can never foul and have the score count, b ball 5 from the flag. First down b, assuming the dodge on the sideline was before the td, if it was after dead ball foul, 5 on try or kickoff.
I agree it seems weird to have the foul and the touchdown, but is there any situation where a non-player can do something that would result in a spot foul? It seems like this would have to be analogous to an UNS by a non-player; no choice but to enforce as a dead ball foul from the succeeding spot.
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Take it a bit farther, try down b intercepts, coach happy as all get out, steps into linesman going down the sideline, would you let the two points for b stand, no live ball foul, score does not count, play over, next is kick off. In the situation stated only difference is try down. Rule book may be odd at times but no where is something legal and illegal for same foul. Assuming in this play happy coach is b coach. If it was a coach, points count, enforce on succeeding spot.
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You can never foul and have the score count, b ball 5 from the flag. First down b, assuming the dodge on the sideline was before the td, if it was after dead ball foul, 5 on try or kickoff.
Unfortunately, you are way wrong, Cowman.
First, let's clarify that dodging a "player" - in the field of play or out of bounds - is nothing. Just part of the game. Dodging coaches, squad members or other non-players, in the restricted area or outside the team area is however, cause for possible punitive action.
While the ball is in play, for those folks mentioned above, simply being in the restricted area, or outside the team area is, technically, a foul. This is a foul to be used judiciously, though. With no disruption or distraction to the sideline guys, this is a firm "talk to" with the offender(s). That usually takes care of the problem. But, if they continue to encroach, a conversation with the HC is in order. That almost always cures the problem. If the problem continues, then you'll have to invoke 9-2-5, which, by the penalty statement, is a dead-ball foul. So, a TD would, unfortunately, count.
The worse scenario - interference (contact or other disruption/distraction) by those persons mentioned above - should have far less tolerance. The penalty statement allows the R latitude in penalty enforcement, but AR 9-2-1-VIII gives clear direction that such live-ball acts are to be penalized as dead-ball fouls. So, again, unfortunately, the TD counts.
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And that is just like saying he held, but just a little. A good talking to will fix things right up.
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Why did we have lawsuits, team areas, and all the grief of a coach and a player running together, one seriously injured, and the old side line warning thrown completely out the window, if we just gonna give him a good talking to??
Guys a lot higher up on the totem pole write the rules for us lower ones to enforce, not to use our discretion as to the severity of the infraction.
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And that is just like saying he held, but just a little. A good talking to will fix things right up.
Actually, it is like saying he held, but not at the point of attack. Do you flag all holds in your games? If so, do the last less than five hours?
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..., not to use our discretion as to the severity of the infraction.
That's precisely what we are to do. Was the restriction enough to warrant a PI call? A holding call? How about KCI? UNS?
How about illegal formations? If linemen are not quite breaking the line through the snapper's waist on their first series of the game, do you call it? Or give them a warning? I'll tell you that the best in the business not only do the latter, they are expected to do the latter. And they get excellent results.
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Best I remember, the side line areas and all that could happen in it was a point of emphasis not too long back, the lawsuit in Texas affected every sport, every call we make.
The state championship game where winning td was scored on an illegal formation, the brawl where helmets were being used as weapons, and NO one was ejected, the constant deal that "they don't call that in Waco, Austin, ElPaso,
This is why the NCAA refs are having a hard time in the NFL, they call the blatant and let the little slide, now they are needed to call everything and anything, they come up short on national tv.
I realize the 7th grade d game game isn't the place for 20 illegal formation penalties, but a coach stepping
into me as I run down the sideline not watching where I'm going, or by chance I see him and miss the clip that costs a good athlete the rest of his career, Gentlemen, THAT DESERVES A FLAG., and when he falls on me a second.
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It is treated as a dead ball foul. Enforce at the succeeding spot. Try or Kickoff. The first 2 occasions it is a 5 yard penalty. All those after the first two are 15 yards. There have been discussions that suggest to enforce 15 yards if contact is made with someone who is in the restricted area.
Contact with an official is definitely 15 yards. This was in a video bulletin last year.