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Football Officiating => National Federation Discussion => Topic started by: FBREF on December 06, 2012, 10:52:29 PM
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Did anyone see the new Uniform Shirt that the Crew's are wearing in the Alabama Super 6? They are trying to be like the NFL guys. ^flag ^flag
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As an Alabama official who will be affected by this change, here are my questions:
(1) Is there an overwhelming reason for change?
(2) Assuming the answer to (1) is "Yes", why this particular shirt?
(3) Will the shirt be widely available from multiple vendors?
My main concern after watching the 5-A final last night is that there's not enough white to prevent officials being confused with players who are wearing black jerseys with white numerals and black pants.
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Tell you what, for FL, to my understanding, with officials shirts & pants evolving towards the state logo being pre-sewn into the shirt/pant, it's seemingly all a money-making, revenue-generating agenda.
Oh FYI. 4 of the 8 State Final games are this weekend. The Saturday afternoon game is expecting 82* at kickoff. :laugh:
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Don't know who the mfr. is but this has become a trend. I'll admit that the black pants, which I'm sure were looked at as being forced at one point, are preferable to knickers. Not sure why there is a need to replace shirts. With the NFL and NCAA's changes, we are all looking different than each other now anyway, IF that is the reason. Change, just to line somebody's pockets, is not.
RefShop.com has been selling this one for about two years. It is similar but I ahve no idea who makes it.
(https://www.refshop.com/secure/images/products/782.png)
We were told several years ago that the Evil Empire had become the "preferred vendor" for NC. It knocked the former supplier, based outside of Charlotte, straight out of business. They were never officially recognized but had come to state clinics for years with a large trailer and sold equipment. They were easy to deal with and if something wasn't right, such as the missized shorts I bought one year, they quickly made corrections. I don't think they had ever done anything to cause them to be replaced other than they were not a large, national, supplier.
I don't have a personal problem with the Big H. I purchase quite a few things from them. I just think that some of these arrangements with state associations can get a bit too "chummy" and perhaps lead to appearances of impropriety which I thought officials are supposed to avoid.
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Did anyone see the new Uniform Shirt that the Crew's are wearing in the Alabama Super 6? They are trying to be like the NFL guys. ^flag ^flag
Looks like a striped shirt with a black cape.
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As an Alabama official who will be affected by this change, here are my questions:
(1) Is there an overwhelming reason for change?
(2) Assuming the answer to (1) is "Yes", why this particular shirt?
(3) Will the shirt be widely available from multiple vendors?
My main concern after watching the 5-A final last night is that there's not enough white to prevent officials being confused with players who are wearing black jerseys with white numerals and black pants.
My understanding is One Stop Sports will handle them, and they may be the only one that has them. This shirt style because of conflicts with the NCAA and NFL on their design, don't know this for sure but heard that why. A reason for the change follow the money.
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This is kind of along the same subject line. Illinois has an agreement to use the Baden football in all playoff games. Hence, the majority of teams have went to the Baden balls. Personally, the Baden balls seem more difficult to grip. Our crew is in agreement that we have seen an increase in fumbles and muffs since the State switched to the Baden ball.
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This is kind of along the same subject line. Illinois has an agreement to use the Baden football in all playoff games. Hence, the majority of teams have went to the Baden balls. Personally, the Baden balls seem more difficult to grip. Our crew is in agreement that we have seen an increase in fumbles and muffs since the State switched to the Baden ball.
Many states have an "official" ball (or brand of ball) that must be used in post-season. Follow the money...
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This is kind of along the same subject line. Illinois has an agreement to use the Baden football in all playoff games. Hence, the majority of teams have went to the Baden balls. Personally, the Baden balls seem more difficult to grip. Our crew is in agreement that we have seen an increase in fumbles and muffs since the State switched to the Baden ball.
I used to work for the company that owned Spalding. State contracts are a big deal. The best ones for the company are those that require their ball be used in all games. There aren't many of those, mostly because the company has to pay a huge fee to get an exclusive. Some are as lax as the ball is suggested or recommended. But the majority are those that require the sponsoring ball to be used in playoff games.
Georgia is a Wilson state. Even when I could get Spalding balls for free, we still used Wilson because our QB coach didn't want the QBs to have to used to a different ball for the playoffs. Sounds like that is what is happening in Illinois.
The Baden football is awful. And Wilson is headquartered in Illinois. I'm guessing either Wilson took it for granted that they would get the contract, or Baden paid a fortune (or both). But those funds do go to the state association, which is a non-profit, so it's covering operating expenses that would have to be covered in another way without the sponsorship.
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The State Association in Alabama also has a State Camp that you are required to go to if you want to work a Super 6 (State Final). For years, you would pay a lot of money and then come playoff time, the Instructors were the ones who were working the Finals. The District Directors are a joke. They expect the local associations to help pay to put on a "STATE CAMP" and then when they don't, they penalize them with a lack of playoff games. This is just one of the bonehead things the State has done. They have now gone to split crews. If a game is in east Alabama, they might send 2 from North Alabama, 2 from South Alabama and 3 from Tuscaloosa. They then will only pay $10.00 per Official travel. An they wonder why the numbers are down for Sports Officials who area already losing money doing something they love. (Step off Soap Box Now). Seriously, I have not worked HS Ball in 7 years due to my College Schedule, but the guys i know that still work are very unhappy with the way the State is being run.
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The State Association in Alabama also has a State Camp that you are required to go to if you want to work a Super 6 (State Final). For years, you would pay a lot of money and then come playoff time, the Instructors were the ones who were working the Finals. The District Directors are a joke. They expect the local associations to help pay to put on a "STATE CAMP" and then when they don't, they penalize them with a lack of playoff games. This is just one of the bonehead things the State has done. They have now gone to split crews. If a game is in east Alabama, they might send 2 from North Alabama, 2 from South Alabama and 3 from Tuscaloosa. They then will only pay $10.00 per Official travel. An they wonder why the numbers are down for Sports Officials who area already losing money doing something they love. (Step off Soap Box Now). Seriously, I have not worked HS Ball in 7 years due to my College Schedule, but the guys i know that still work are very unhappy with the way the State is being run.
They don't think out the travel well they will send 1 from area A to area B and then send 1 from area B to A. The selection process has reduced the number and desire of officials in my area. Including myself who quit after the 2011 seaon.
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Did anyone see the new Uniform Shirt that the Crew's are wearing in the Alabama Super 6? They are trying to be like the NFL guys. ^flag ^flag
I suspect the officials have nothing to do with what they're being required to wear, so I doubt they're trying to be like anyone.
BTW, I believe SC has also gone with the wider stripes.
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...I believe SC has also gone with the wider stripes.
You are correct. SC made the change last year.
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SC shirt here-
http://www.schsl.org/2012/SCFOAShirt.pdf (http://www.schsl.org/2012/SCFOAShirt.pdf)
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the shirts look good,but from what I've read bama has a GOB system as well--anyway,while watching 5A final,saw S.F. WR's doing cfl/arena stuff while in motion before snap and no flags anywhere...
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the shirts look good,but from what I've read bama has a GOB system as well--anyway,while watching 5A final,saw S.F. WR's doing cfl/arena stuff while in motion before snap and no flags anywhere...
SC shirts look nice, but do we really think it's a good idea to have individual States creating their own "look". For the most part, absolutely nobody besides your crew mates could possibly care less about the width of your stripes or the amount of black in the shirts any of us wear.
The major change from white knickers to black trousers makes sense and has been so widely acepted because the black trousers make sense on a number of very practical levels. The basic idea of a uniform is still to make everyone look the same and be readily identified from everyone else.
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The basic idea of a uniform is still to make everyone look the same and be readily identified from everyone else.
You left out " and make money for the manufacturers who have cozy relationships with state associations".
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So, how long until the NFL adopts 1-inch stripes as a way to differentiate itself from high school and college? I'll set the over/under at 20 years.
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So, how long until the NFL adopts 1-inch stripes as a way to differentiate itself from high school and college? I'll set the over/under at 20 years.
No, no, they always make the stripes bigger, not smaller! Here's the ultimate shirt:
(http://s12.postimage.org/iww3obszh/IMG_5365.jpg)
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So, how long until the NFL adopts 1-inch stripes as a way to differentiate itself from high school and college? I'll set the over/under at 20 years.
My money has it on the NFL eliminating stripes altogether, as opposed to changing the width of the stripe.
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From an Alabama official - Apparently the only supplier will be One Stop Sports which is the state endorsed supplier. They predominatley use Smitty products. The black on the new shirts appears to be faded and does not match the black pants. The entire sleeve on the long sleeve version is black. One Stop Sports supplied the shirts to the officials working the Super 6 (State finals) free of charge. We have already been told we will use that shirt next year.
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We have already been told we will use that shirt next year.
I believe it will be a local association option for 2013, and mandatory in 2014.
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My money has it on the NFL eliminating stripes altogether, as opposed to changing the width of the stripe.
Or they make Hochuli's workout mandatory and eliminate the shirts altogether... Might boost ratings in the female 35-50 category.
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1. I don't like the way they look for multiple reasons. One, mentioned above, is the shade dissimilarity to the black pants. Other reasons are the all-black sleeves, and the cut of the stripes looks awkward.
2. There was no legit reason for the change.
3. Regarding the championship games, I'm certain that attendance at a state camp is not required to be selected. But if you really want to advance, wouldn't it be in your best interest to go to the camp, learn what they have to teach, go through the experience, and check the block? An official who strives for excellence doesn't reject the opportunity for instruction, regardless of whether the reasoning behind the instruction fits into a specific mindset.
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REPLY: Regarding the uniform thing...we went through a similar crisis here in NJ two seasons ago. Some legislation in the state assembly limited the ticket prices for playoffs, lowering the revenue expectations of the state association. When they looked to increase member school dues, schools told them to pound sand. So where did they turn? Of course...all of the registered officials. With a promise of a LARGE sponsorship of the state association, a local distributor of that Michigan-based equipment company cut a deal with the state association to become the sole provider of embroidered logo'ed equipment. Formerly, they just provided patches included with your dues. For football, the logo needed to appear on every shirt and hat. For baseball (you'll love this, AB), embroidered logos needed to be on hats, shirts, jackets, and...get this...ball bags! I'm not kidding. Now, the cost: To embroider any item, it was $12 per item if that item was manufactured by that Michigan company, but $18 if it was manufactured by a competitor. Of course you could always purchase new (Michigan company) equipment with the logo pre-embroidered for a somewhat lesser premium for the embroidery. BTW...I researched and found many providers willing to embroider that many pieces of equipment at about $1.00 to $1.50 per piece. The state said that all of this equipment re-identification needed to be done by a certain date or offenders would not be allowed to work the playoffs. The equipment distributor was set up as the 'sheriff' in this deal. He had lists of all the officials and was to inform the state association of those who were compliant, and those who weren't. I personally had three hats and four shirts that would have required 're-conditioning,' only two of which were manufactured by the 'preferred' vendor. So my embroidery bill would have amounted to $114--and I only do football. The officials went absolutely bonkers. The predominant opinion was that this was simply a non-negotiated dues increase. We simply told them we weren't doing it. Since they have a sole-source contract with our association, who were they going to get to officiate their playoffs? Finally, someone pointed out to the state association that their contract with us called for them to provide the patch as the means off us identifying our affiliation with them. Requiring us to embroider at incremental cost would put them in breach. Crisis averted...except that our contract with them has just expired. I would not be surprised if "Embroider-gate" raises its ugly head again.
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From an Alabama official - Apparently the only supplier will be One Stop Sports which is the state endorsed supplier. They predominatley use Smitty products. The black on the new shirts appears to be faded and does not match the black pants. The entire sleeve on the long sleeve version is black. One Stop Sports supplied the shirts to the officials working the Super 6 (State finals) free of charge. We have already been told we will use that shirt next year.
There are actually four suppliers who have been approved to sell the shirts. Our association has already received correspondence from two of them.
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Regarding the championship games, I'm certain that attendance at a state camp is not required to be selected.
Required? No. The AHSAA takes great pains to put that in writing in their Playoff Selection Guide:
"3. AHSAA District Camp Attendance (Although not required consideration will be given to those officials who attended district camp last year.)
4. AHSAA State Camp Attendance (Although not required consideration will be given to those officials who have attended state camp within the last 4 years.)"
Take a poll of the officials who have worked championship games in the last 5 years and see how many have not gone to the state camp. I'll bet it's zero.
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I've heard the shirts provided to those officials lucky enough to work the Super 6 last year are not the exact shirts being sold/used this year. Can anyone comment on this? Sucks for those guys...they thought they were 1 shirt purchase ahead of everyone else.
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I've heard the shirts provided to those officials lucky enough to work the Super 6 last year are not the exact shirts being sold/used this year. Can anyone comment on this? Sucks for those guys...they thought they were 1 shirt purchase ahead of everyone else.
That's correct, although they will be very close. The shirts will also have the sublimated AHSAA patch.
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Required? No. The AHSAA takes great pains to put that in writing in their Playoff Selection Guide:
"3. AHSAA District Camp Attendance (Although not required consideration will be given to those officials who attended district camp last year.)
4. AHSAA State Camp Attendance (Although not required consideration will be given to those officials who have attended state camp within the last 4 years.)"
Take a poll of the officials who have worked championship games in the last 5 years and see how many have not gone to the state camp. I'll bet it's zero.
The number may well be zero. I have been to the Super 6 and I have been to state camp several times. I have learned a good bit each time I have attended camp. I suspect that what I learned at camp greatly contributed to my being a good enough to officiate in the Super 6.
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I see a small correlation here...