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91
NCAA Discussion / Clock question
« Last post by ElvisLives on September 19, 2018, 09:52:13 AM »
3/10, B-15, 10:00 (4), running.  A=21, B=17.

B33 pulls end A88 down to the ground just as A88 is about the touch A11's legal forward pass in B's end zone.  B27 intercepts the pass and is tackled
a) in the end zone;

b) at the B-5, in the field of play.

Give me your complete rulings, include status of both clocks.

Robert
92
National Federation Discussion / JV Game Coin Toss
« Last post by UTchad on September 19, 2018, 09:42:11 AM »
So our association is hurting for officials and that means double headers sometimes with a Freshman and JV game played on the same field right after each other. Anyways one of these game last week I was the Umpire usually I am HL.

During the coin toss the head coach of the visiting team said he would join the coin toss, so we advised the home coach and we had both coaches out there. It went something like this:

R: give opening talk
VCapt: calls heads
The toss is heads
R: You won the toss would you like to receive, defer, or kick?
Vcapt: Defer
VHC: NO we don't want to defer let's kick
R: Are you sure?
HHC: Buddy you definitely want to defer
VCapt: Coach let's defer
VHC: Nope we are kicking i'm not happy with the hustle this week so we are kicking
R: does the signaling

fast forward to halftime Visiting team is lining up to receive

We walk over to the coach and explain to him that he is kicking. He proceeds to get irate and screaming but we kicked at the beginning of the game.

Coach we tried to talk you out of that one.
93
National Federation Discussion / Re: Punt play : Did I get it wrong?
« Last post by ElvisLives on September 19, 2018, 09:24:19 AM »
I probably shouldn't be stirring somebody else's pot, but, from what I've read here, it sounds like NF and NCAA are the same on this subject, although, in NCAA, the word "force" is never used.  Nonetheless, all of the principles seem to apply for both sets of rules.

Which brings me to a point.
Somebody made the statement that impetus "...only comes into play if we are dealing with a safety or a touchback, not a touchdown." While pragmatic, that statement is incorrect.  Any time - ANY TIME - the ball is dead behind a goal line, the result is totally dependent upon who is responsible for the ball being behind that goal line, and who is in team possession when it becomes dead. 
If the defending team is responsible, and the defending team is in possession - there's your safety.  If the defending team is responsible and the attacking team is in possession, there's your touchdown.
If the attacking team is responsible, and the defending team is in possession, there's your touchback.  If the attacking team is responsible, and the attacking team is in possession, there's your touchdown.

Impetus applies any time the ball becomes dead behind a goal line.

Another point.  It also sounds like NF and NCAA are the same with respect to kicking a ball.  If that is the case, then there is no such thing as "accidentally kicking" a ball.  If the act of kicking a ball is intentional, then that is, in fact, a kick.  If a player's leg unintentionally contacts a loose ball, that is not a kick.  It is nothing more than the ball being deflected by, or off of, a player, and is just a muff.  The words "accidentally" and "unintentionally" should never be used with words "kicked" or "kicks" when discussing football rules.  The ball is either kicked (which means one thing), or it is muffed (which means something entirely different).  When describing such unintentional action, use language like, "While attempting to recover the loose ball, the ball deflects off of B55's leg."  Or, "While attempting to block B33, the loose ball bounces and deflects off of A66's leg."  That removes any ambiguity.

Robert
94
National Federation Discussion / Re: Dew-Rags
« Last post by TampaSteve on September 19, 2018, 08:51:59 AM »
agree too, BUT with County budgets, etc., they're not buying anything.
it puts officials in an interesting situation.

95
National Federation Discussion / Re: Dew-Rags
« Last post by CalhounLJ on September 19, 2018, 08:48:49 AM »
And Iím sure the clothing reps are pushing the college styled pants also.


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96
National Federation Discussion / Re: Dew-Rags
« Last post by TampaSteve on September 19, 2018, 08:47:42 AM »
Then the county should be held responsible for buying legal pants.
Absolutely agree. they SHOULD. - but the buyer probably is just processing orders the County AD passes down to them. and the County AD may only buy pants every 3 years and we're in year 2.
97
National Federation Discussion / Re: Dew-Rags
« Last post by CalhounLJ on September 19, 2018, 08:28:28 AM »
Then the county should be held responsible for buying legal pants.


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98
National Federation Discussion / Re: Dew-Rags
« Last post by TampaSteve on September 19, 2018, 08:27:09 AM »
the thing with the pants is (around these parts) the County buys the uniforms/equipment...and doesnt buy pants every year.
So while 2/3 of the team doesnt have compliant pants, the coaches' hands are tied because he has no control.
Then, if he makes a request at the jamboree, it will take the county 4 months to get what he needs - if the County approves it.
99
National Federation Discussion / Re: sunglasses
« Last post by AlUpstateNY on September 19, 2018, 08:18:40 AM »
I want to work with officials who hustle, communicate, study the rules, strive to get better, care about the players and the game, and have fun.  I don't care if they wear sunglasses, have beards, or have false teeth.

Sounds reasonable.
100
National Federation Discussion / Re: Punt play : Did I get it wrong?
« Last post by CalhounLJ on September 19, 2018, 07:32:06 AM »
Chasing the pink elephant here a bit, an accidental kick could result from an attempt to gain possession of a bouncing ball -- aka, a muff. While we often think of the ball bouncing off of somebody's hands, there's no restriction as to which body part touches the ball in a muff.

Of course, all of this is irrelevant to the initial play since "Possession of a live ball in the opponent's end zone is always a touchdown" is the most important Football Fundamental. How it got there is not relevant.
I almost agree with everything you said. How it got there is relevant if it got there by an illegal kick. True, the result of the play would still be a TD, but Iím sure if the illegal kick was by B, A would want to take the penalty and get the ball back.


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