Author Topic: Switching sidelines at halftime  (Read 1470 times)

Offline KWH

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #25 on: December 01, 2017, 11:20:58 AM »
Statistics show in HS football, the majority of fouls are called on the team on the other side of the field.
Interesting?  Can you share where, when and how you found these statistics?
I and many others would be interested in reviewing them.

Offline KWH

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2017, 11:22:48 AM »
Still looking for a logical, practical or even rational reason for doing so.

Many of us are looking with you. Perhaps we need to Follow the Yellow Brick Road!

Offline Magician

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #27 on: December 01, 2017, 01:46:11 PM »
Interesting?  Can you share where, when and how you found these statistics?
I and many others would be interested in reviewing them.
I know I've seen actual studies on this, but I don't remember where or when. It was just online speculation. There was a notable statistic that showed more fouls were called against the team on the opposite sideline by wing officials, but I don't remember that it was significant.

We've been doing it for 3 or 4 years in NCAA. It's not a bad thing and we've never minded it. I just don't see a huge need for it. The biggest issue is when reviewing video and identifying who would have had which key we have to know which half it was. Within the game itself it hasn't been an issue. Would I be heartbroken if we went back? No. Would I throw a fit if HS decided to do this? No.

Online ElvisLives

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #28 on: December 01, 2017, 01:49:09 PM »
Statistics show in HS football, the majority of fouls are called on the team on the other side of the field.

And here I thought Yoga Berra was dead and gone.  This is kinda like the card that says "See other side." on both sides.

Paraphrasing Yogi:
That restaurant is so crowded, nobody goes there any more.

It ain't over 'til its over.

Those are all I know...

Offline Rich

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #29 on: December 03, 2017, 02:49:34 PM »
I consider my position on the Rules Committee as representing both my state and that of officials. If a proposed rule improves either the safety or fairness of the game, I support it knowing that it'll require new training and mechanics of officials.

IMHO, both flip-flopping wings and adding the 40 second play clock will add a lot of busy work for officials ,not to mention confusion and consistency ,with very little improvement to our game.

While I'll be an opponent to either, should they pass, I would support adding them to rule 1-7       (the "state's right rule).

 :sTiR:

How much weight do you give to the survey (which I've completed)?

My biggest problem with rules committees is that personal preference seems to rule how many people vote.....that and people sit on the committee way too long.

The 40 second clock may take some additional learning to administer, but in my experience as an assigner / observer and also as an R, it's amazing the inconsistency in pace of the R giving the RFP.  I'm quick....and no apologies from me for that.  Others I've watched are downright pokey.  Having a 40 second clock takes that away from the R....and would be a positive change to the game IMO.

Offline jason

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2017, 06:26:05 AM »
I know I've seen actual studies on this, but I don't remember where or when. It was just online speculation. There was a notable statistic that showed more fouls were called against the team on the opposite sideline by wing officials, but I don't remember that it was significant.

We've been doing it for 3 or 4 years in NCAA. It's not a bad thing and we've never minded it. I just don't see a huge need for it. The biggest issue is when reviewing video and identifying who would have had which key we have to know which half it was. Within the game itself it hasn't been an issue. Would I be heartbroken if we went back? No. Would I throw a fit if HS decided to do this? No.

We tracked fouls with a sideline switch in my local association over the course of two years. Both years had a negligible difference in comparison to the previous two years' fouls. Having said that, some officials had anomalous results, which is not necessarily an indication of anything other than one team simply fouled more.

Offline jason

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2017, 06:27:35 AM »
How much weight do you give to the survey (which I've completed)?

My biggest problem with rules committees is that personal preference seems to rule how many people vote.....that and people sit on the committee way too long.

The 40 second clock may take some additional learning to administer, but in my experience as an assigner / observer and also as an R, it's amazing the inconsistency in pace of the R giving the RFP.  I'm quick....and no apologies from me for that.  Others I've watched are downright pokey.  Having a 40 second clock takes that away from the R....and would be a positive change to the game IMO.

I understand your point, but new guys usually run the clock. And they screw up far more than they should. Having them try to figure out when it's 25 and when it's 40 would be a nightmare, IMO.

Offline Magician

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #32 on: December 04, 2017, 10:17:50 AM »
I understand your point, but new guys usually run the clock. And they screw up far more than they should. Having them try to figure out when it's 25 and when it's 40 would be a nightmare, IMO.
It's not hard at all. For the most part it is set to 40 and started at the end of a play. Unless there is some kind of administrative stoppage (i.e. score, penalty enforcement, change of possession, injury, time out). Then it's 25. We've been experimenting with it in Indiana for the past 2 years and have had almost zero issues. The most common issue we've had is since the R doesn't have to blow his whistle to start the game clock after a first down in bounds, the game clock operator misses it. That seems to be operator specific though because it either happens several times during a game or not at all. But the play clock has rarely been any more of an issue than when it's just 25. We do have visible play clocks in almost every stadium (I've never worked in one that didn't) which I know is not common.

Offline UTchad

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2017, 02:57:09 PM »
In Utah they make the HL and LJ swap at halftime. Reasoning... coaches wanted to get a different referee on their sideline. My position is HL, so I do the first half as LJ and then second half as HL.  All the officials I know complain about it, but it is a requirement in Utah.

Offline yarnnelg

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #34 on: January 05, 2018, 10:31:42 PM »
When we did this in Semi Pro, the Head Linesman took the chains with him. Our crew trashed the idea. I want one relationship with one Head Football Coach. It's not an open marriage.

Offline KWH

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #35 on: January 12, 2018, 12:46:58 PM »
It's not hard at all. For the most part it is set to 40 and started at the end of a play. Unless there is some kind of administrative stoppage (i.e. score, penalty enforcement, change of possession, injury, time out). Then it's 25. We've been experimenting with it in Indiana for the past 2 years and have had almost zero issues. The most common issue we've had is since the R doesn't have to blow his whistle to start the game clock after a first down in bounds, the game clock operator misses it. That seems to be operator specific though because it either happens several times during a game or not at all. But the play clock has rarely been any more of an issue than when it's just 25. We do have visible play clocks in almost every stadium (I've never worked in one that didn't) which I know is not common.

So Brian -
There are many states that do not have visible play clocks. 
The idea of going to a 40/25 second "INVISIBLE" clock seems not only foolhardy, but a bit askew! 
As such, I would not support this change.
In fairness to you however I agree, with VISIBLE clocks, 40/25 is clearly the way to go.

« Last Edit: January 12, 2018, 12:49:19 PM by KWH »

Offline Kalle

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #36 on: January 12, 2018, 01:17:10 PM »
The idea of going to a 40/25 second "INVISIBLE" clock seems not only foolhardy, but a bit askew! 

I've had zero problems with running a 40/25 second clock on fields with no visible play clocks. I rarely have to give a 15-second warning, which I give if the offense is still in a huddle and not about to break it. I've absolutely loved it, even though I was against the change.

Offline KWH

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #37 on: January 14, 2018, 06:26:12 PM »
Still looking for a logical, practical or even rational reason for doing so.

Keep looking,I don't believe anyone can actually produce one!

Offline Ralph Damren

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Re: Switching sidelines at halftime
« Reply #38 on: Yesterday at 08:53:53 AM »
Keep looking,I don't believe anyone can actually produce one!

"THE GRASS/FIELD TURF ALWAYS LOOKS GREENER ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FENCE/FIELD"

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