Author Topic: IW  (Read 17772 times)

Offline TxCoach

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IW
« on: September 09, 2009, 01:13:45 PM »
Close game, we kickoff, the returner catches the ball at about the 15 and the official winds his arm and hammers down on the whistle.  Most of the kids kept playing and the returner is tackled about midfield.  The officials huddle.  People from the stands are yelling "What a circus!"  Our coaches are yelling.  I felt bad for the guy.  I'm pretty sure it was a first year official...I know the wingman on our sideline was.  After our next score I told him he could feel free to blow the whistle where they catch the kickoff...I'd be fine with that.  He laughed.  I don't see how you guys do it.

RWPatten

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Re: IW
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2009, 01:30:37 PM »
I am a first year official. I was told I had my first IW at the perfect time- a scrimmage. I saw a kid grab another kid's facemask, I threw my flag and blew the whistle; just like a good basketball official would   :P. (I am a basketball coach). The kids didn't hear it, but the coaches did. Needless to say I make sure I see the play dead, before I blow the whistle. I am amazed at how many plays we don't even blow the whistle.

Offline TxCoach

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Re: IW
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2009, 01:41:21 PM »
Yeah, it's amazing how often no whistle is blown.  Personally I think the whistle should be blown every play.  It makes it a lot harder to coach effort when you can't tell them to play clean whistle to whistle.  Telling them to play 100% as hard as they can until the play is kind of over or you see his knee down and everybody else stops playing just isn't as effective.

Grant - AR

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Re: IW
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2009, 02:28:12 PM »
Yeah, it's amazing how often no whistle is blown.  Personally I think the whistle should be blown every play.  It makes it a lot harder to coach effort when you can't tell them to play clean whistle to whistle.  Telling them to play 100% as hard as they can until the play is kind of over or you see his knee down and everybody else stops playing just isn't as effective.

I found out a long time ago that many plays don't need a whistle.  A good number of plays in a game end with the runner being down and all the players stop at that point.  Of course, if some of the players don't know the play is dead (or just don't care) and are still going at it, a whistle or loud voice is very beneficial.   ;)

LarryW60

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Re: IW
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2009, 03:03:15 PM »
Many times the play ends and we have no whistle.  The old adage that the whistle doesn't end the down is ALMOST true...  The one time it does is when it's an IW.  So around our crew, you probably won't hear a whistle when the give is up the midde into a scrum.  If we don't see the ball in someone's posession, we don't blow.

My first IW happened as a second-year trainee.  Sweep to my side and the WR performs a classic textbook hook around the waist of the defender.  I'm so proud I recognized it that I throw my flag and let loose with a loud blast on the whistle... then realized what I'd done. :-[

Offline GoodScout

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Re: IW
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2009, 06:12:36 PM »
We have one Umpire who claims he doesn't even carry a whistle onto the field. Says no way to have an IW if you don't have a whistle.

Offline VALJ

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Re: IW
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2009, 10:56:02 AM »
Ah, the dreaded IW.  If an official tells you he hasn't had one, he either hasn't worked many games or he's lying to you.  :)


Offline NorCalMike

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Re: IW
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2009, 06:11:05 PM »
We have one Umpire who claims he doesn't even carry a whistle onto the field. Says no way to have an IW if you don't have a whistle.
When I work umpire, I rarely use my whistle. When the play is up the middle, it can be hard to see the ball. If I can't see the ball, I will not blow the whistle. We have a couple of local teams that are great at fakes. Sometimes they even suck me in on it. I never want to have an IW when the O faked the up the middle and took the ball outside.

Offline GoodScout

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Re: IW
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2009, 08:21:38 PM »
When I work umpire, I rarely use my whistle. When the play is up the middle, it can be hard to see the ball. If I can't see the ball, I will not blow the whistle. We have a couple of local teams that are great at fakes. Sometimes they even suck me in on it. I never want to have an IW when the O faked the up the middle and took the ball outside.
I rarely use mine either, but I wonder what my collegue does when he sees a snap infraction.

Offline VALJ

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Re: IW
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2009, 08:52:13 AM »
I rarely use mine either, but I wonder what my collegue does when he sees a snap infraction.

"HEY!!! EVERYBODY HOLD ON A SEC!!!""  :)

Offline tiger7171

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Re: IW
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2009, 09:16:02 AM »
yes i had a iw my first year.
mow in year 5 i hold on to the whislte for a second longer to make sure i saw the ball.

Offline James

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Re: IW
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2009, 01:51:56 AM »
I have one about every 100 games or so.
It has never been from having the whistle in my mouth (I don't use a lanyard).
Once it was to stop a fight - I didn't consider the play was still on, just wanted to get the players off each other.
Twice where just brain farts where I saw my qhistle coming up to my mouth, and even remember thinking 'Hmm, I should wait to blow thaPFFFFFF'.

Offline bossman72

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Re: IW
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2009, 10:32:55 AM »
Yeah, it's amazing how often no whistle is blown.  Personally I think the whistle should be blown every play.  It makes it a lot harder to coach effort when you can't tell them to play clean whistle to whistle.  Telling them to play 100% as hard as they can until the play is kind of over or you see his knee down and everybody else stops playing just isn't as effective.

Coach has illustrated the double edged sword we have here.  Yes coach, ideally we would like to blow the plays dead so everyone knows the play has ended.  However, as you've probably read, we need to PHYSICALLY SEE THE BALL before we blow our whistle.  This is so we don't have any inadvertent ones like when someone picks up a fumble and starts running for six and one official blows his whistle when he sees the pile hit the ground.  That's why there is no whistle.

Offline TxCoach

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Re: IW
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2009, 02:01:55 PM »
I know and fully understand why the whistle doesn't get blown every play and that you don't want to blow it until you've seen ball in possession and possessive player down...but I've also had officials flag a lineman for finishing a pancake when the play was over and there was no whistle.  IMO if you're not blowing the whistle, you can't flag honest late hits.  (I'm not talking about the cheapshots).

Offline Welpe

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Re: IW
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2009, 02:28:37 PM »
  IMO if you're not blowing the whistle, you can't flag honest late hits.  (I'm not talking about the cheapshots).

This depends entirely on the situation.  Maybe not in your situation, but there are times when the players should know when a play is over (the play essentially kills itself).  Whistle or not, if they commit a bonehead late hit in that situation, they are getting flagged for it.

Offline TxCoach

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Re: IW
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2009, 12:27:39 PM »
If the play kills itself, why wouldn't a whistle be blown?  If the whole theory behind not blowing a whistle is that you can't see the ball clearly and aren't sure when they are down, how is my player (who could very possibly have his back to the play) supposed to know when the play is over when the officials arent sure its over? 

LarryW60

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Re: IW
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2009, 02:10:54 PM »
Well, when everyone else has stopped and your lineman is still "finishing a pancake" because you coached him to "play until the whistle", it's going to look mighty obvious.  In the case of our crew, we'll use our voices before throwing a flag, but some of those lineman don't listen to voices and continue action after the play.  THEN they get a flag.  "I didn't hear the whistle" is not a valid excuse if everyone ELSE managed to realize the play was over and had stopped action.

Offline Welpe

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Re: IW
« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2009, 02:34:41 PM »
If the play kills itself, why wouldn't a whistle be blown?

Maybe it will be but the official, practicing good mechanics, is slow on the whistle to ensure he does not commit an IW.  Maybe the pass is well over thrown and obviously out of bounds but the defender hits a defenseless receiver anyways.  Maybe the ball carrier is 5 steps out of bounds but the defender levels him before the official can whistle him out of play. There are numerous scenarios.  On the opposite end of the coin, if there is a clean hit that might be a split second late committed by a player that wouldn't be aware of the play ending, I think most good officials will let that go.


The point is, a whistle is not the action that kills a play (unless it is an IW).  The players have to be aware of what is going on. 

Offline bossman72

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Re: IW
« Reply #18 on: September 15, 2009, 10:05:11 PM »
I know and fully understand why the whistle doesn't get blown every play and that you don't want to blow it until you've seen ball in possession and possessive player down...but I've also had officials flag a lineman for finishing a pancake when the play was over and there was no whistle.  IMO if you're not blowing the whistle, you can't flag honest late hits.  (I'm not talking about the cheapshots).

Agreed.  If it's away from the ball or ball carrier, then yes.  However, if it's something late on the ball carrier or near enough where they know the play is dead, then yes, we're getting that.

Offline Livin' in the pit

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Re: IW
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2009, 02:06:01 PM »
When I work umpire, I rarely use my whistle. When the play is up the middle, it can be hard to see the ball. If I can't see the ball, I will not blow the whistle. We have a couple of local teams that are great at fakes. Sometimes they even suck me in on it. I never want to have an IW when the O faked the up the middle and took the ball outside.

If you can't see the ball, don't blow the tweeter. Seems mostly simple - now.

Had a rookie crew (total five games experience between there of my officials, plus a solid third-year guy.) 
Guess who had the IW?
The third-year. Ball was free on a fumble behind the LOS, with three defenders about to dive on it when Bubba (at ump) blew it dead.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2009, 02:10:02 PM by 110 »

Offline VALJ

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Re: IW
« Reply #20 on: October 12, 2009, 02:38:30 PM »
Maybe he saw a Snickers bar near the football, and wanted to make sure that it didn't get flattened.

Offline Livin' in the pit

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Re: IW
« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2009, 03:09:53 PM »
Maybe he saw a Snickers bar near the football, and wanted to make sure that it didn't get flattened.

He's still quite thin. New to the pit, this one was.

Offline Aussie-Zebra

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Re: IW
« Reply #22 on: October 29, 2009, 12:28:30 PM »
a
« Last Edit: September 30, 2015, 09:58:34 AM by Aussie-Zebra »
For every coach that thinks we got it wrong there's another that thinks we got it right.

Offline yarnnelg

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Re: IW
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2009, 06:43:36 PM »
Keep telling new officials to keep the whistle out of their mouths. Those that a real hard headed get a senior official that stays on top of them during color games and scrimmages. I walked up to one young official one afternoon and explained right after he had been knocked off his feet on a run into the sideline ..... "The next time you have your whistle in your mouth and forget to get behind the runner instead of in the middle of his flight path ...... you may be picking up teeth instead of equipment off the ground." I guess the thought of losing teeth was enough ..... he no longer plays basketball Ref on a football field.

Offline JugglingReferee

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Re: IW
« Reply #24 on: November 02, 2009, 09:04:21 AM »
The whistle does not end the play - the play ends by RULE

Um, TxCoach knows that.