Author Topic: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011  (Read 10191 times)

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El Macman

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NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« on: March 01, 2011, 04:51:52 PM »
See the attached document. Some interesting things, especially the editorial changes. It would appear that Illegal Participation is now a 5-yard penalty. And an automatic first down for B Unsportsmanlike Conduct Fouls. Still have to be approved by PROP though.

[attachment deleted by admin]

Offline sj_31

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2011, 04:57:37 PM »
I was wondering if IP was going to now be 5-yards, according to this doc. And if so, wouldn't that be an actual rule change and not just an editorial? I suppose we shall see when the book is printed.

Offline TXMike

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2011, 06:27:26 PM »
Yeah we never see an editorial change that is actually a rule change do we?    ;)

(Isn't that the same as the NFL rule on illegal participation?)

Offline FLBJ

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2011, 02:32:59 PM »
Does it necessarily mean '12 during the play' = illegal participation? Even though we've enforced it this way, could this mean 12 on the field during the play (i.e. running off, etc) is 5 yards and thus the EC is just 'clarifying' things. I find it hard to believe having 12 PARTICIPATE would now only be 5 yards, but ya' neva' know!

Hursk

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2011, 02:56:41 PM »
Mike.... on the 10 sec runoff change, it seems to me that an "ordinary" holding on a pass play within the time would NOT invoke the automatic runoff (since the nature of the foul itself doesn't mandate clock stoppage)... e.g. under 1 minute, A trailing, A 3d/4 B15: A throws a completed pass to the B10 for a 1st down, 8 seconds left at play's end.    Am I mistaken?

Bill B

El Macman

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2011, 03:21:49 PM »
We are specualting - so we could all be wrong when we get final information. But, let's think logically a moment. The statement in the document is: "The foul for twelve men on the field, whether a live-ball or a dead-ball foul, carries a 5-yard penalty."
Well, a "Susbstitition Infraction" (or Illegal Substition, whatever your term) has always been a 5-yard penalty, whether live-ball or dead-ball. There is no change there, so what could they be talking about? The only things related to substitution that were (are) 15-yard penalties are simulated replacements or substituions to confuse opponents - an unsportsmanlike conduct (9-2-2 Unfair Tactics) foul, and Illegal Participation, a 9-1-5 Illegal Interference Foul. The former does not involve 12 players on the field, so they arent talking about that one. So, they must be talking about Illegal Participation. So, by deduction, it would appear that Illegal Participation will now be just a 5-yard penalty.

The final statement in the Editorial Changes reinforces this logic. "Fifteen yard penalties are reserved for personal fouls, unsportsmanlike conduct fouls, and pass interference." That certainly reconciles with the Substitution Infraction thing.

But, moving one step forward, how does that last statement reconcile with Illegal Kicking & Batting? KCI? Delay in starting a half? Marking the ball? Changing numbers to deceive? Many others.

Obvviously, more to come.

El Macman

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2011, 03:43:26 PM »
Mike.... on the 10 sec runoff change, it seems to me that an "ordinary" holding on a pass play within the time would NOT invoke the automatic runoff (since the nature of the foul itself doesn't mandate clock stoppage)... e.g. under 1 minute, A trailing, A 3d/4 B15: A throws a completed pass to the B10 for a 1st down, 8 seconds left at play's end.    Am I mistaken?

Bill B

All speculation, but it would appear that they are looking for fouling acts that stop the clock in, and of, themselsves. Those are incomplete illegal passes. Might also be an illegal kick. But I don't think it will apply to holding, personal fouls, etc., because they aren't acts that stop the clock. This is a fine, but clear, distinction - the Referee stops the clock to administer the penalty. The act didn't stop the clock, as does an incomplete pass (legal or illegal), and an illegal kick.

Hursk

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2011, 04:20:26 PM »
El... that's my view
Was hoping that the example might get picked up (if correct) to illustrate the difference... Mr. Redding doesn't call me directly!

Offline TXMike

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2011, 04:35:27 PM »
Mike.... on the 10 sec runoff change, it seems to me that an "ordinary" holding on a pass play within the time would NOT invoke the automatic runoff (since the nature of the foul itself doesn't mandate clock stoppage)... e.g. under 1 minute, A trailing, A 3d/4 B15: A throws a completed pass to the B10 for a 1st down, 8 seconds left at play's end.    Am I mistaken?

Bill B

That is the way I read it also.  What is a bit problematic is this play:  Clock starts on the snap, 8 seconds remaining in game and A is behind.  3d and G at the 9.  QB A8 runs to the 5, is obviously going to be tackled in bounds with 3 seconds left and no timeouts.  Instead he flips a fwd pass from the 5 to A-88 in the EZ.  2 seconds are on the clock when the pass is caught in the EZ.  Run the seconds off?  If it had been incomplete, there is no question, run them off.

 

Offline Osric Pureheart

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2011, 08:28:28 PM »
The final statement in the Editorial Changes reinforces this logic. "Fifteen yard penalties are reserved for personal fouls, unsportsmanlike conduct fouls, and pass interference." That certainly reconciles with the Substitution Infraction thing.

But, moving one step forward, how does that last statement reconcile with Illegal Kicking & Batting? KCI? Delay in starting a half? Marking the ball? Changing numbers to deceive? Many others.

Obvviously, more to come.

I would expand that statement slightly and colloquialise it.  "Major penalties are for safety, individuals who are being a dick, pass interference, and cheating."

jimcore

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2011, 09:36:50 PM »
Mike,
This is the same rule that we used in Arena.  The accepted penalty for this is five and LOD from spot.  The 10 sec. runoff would be in effect so this game is over.

Offline ludoline

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2011, 03:24:18 AM »
Sorry but what's the diference between CFO and NCAA rules??

Offline Kalle

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2011, 03:30:44 AM »
Sorry but what's the diference between CFO and NCAA rules??

Nothing. CFO, College Football Officiating, is an organization that mainly concerns about officiating (mechanics, official selection, crews, etc), whereas NCAA handles the rules.

Offline ludoline

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2011, 03:44:59 AM »
Thank's for your answer Kale.

Wing4Life

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2011, 09:16:06 AM »
Guys,

Take a look at this document. . .it was initially put together by an official in the Big12 that's now in the NFL. Any suggestions or corrections that would make it better/more accurate? Thanks!

http://www.tbfoc.org/NCAA_RulesHelp2011.ppsx


Offline TXMike

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2011, 09:24:27 AM »
Any tips on how to open the file?

Offline Etref

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2011, 09:40:14 AM »
Any tips on how to open the file?

It opened right up for me.

" I don't make the rules coach!"

Offline TXMike

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2011, 09:47:11 AM »
Yep.  Opens on a puter with Powerpoint 2007 but not in 2003. Switched puters and it worked

Wing4Life

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2011, 06:39:47 PM »
here's a PDF version that may be easier to download: http://www.tbfoc.org/NCAA_RulesHelp2011.pdf.

You can right-click on it when it opens in your browser and do a "Save As".
« Last Edit: May 10, 2011, 06:41:37 PM by Wing4Life »

Offline biltheref

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Re: NCAA Rules Changes for 2011
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2011, 11:26:24 PM »
Page 17, Last line regarding Blocking Below the Waist.  Should the last line read:

Prohibited against player in possession position to receive a backward pass?