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Some states, NC included, have adopted the interpretation that a lineman in a 2 point stance can not legally block below the waist as opposed to a 3 or 4 point stance in a shotgun snap.  I don't recall how many use that interp.

Otherwise you appear to be spot-on.

Thanks.

I'll be curious to see if given the rule change this year, if those states will change their interpretation or stick with it.  From what I've read, the committee was trying to get everyone on the same page, but of course, states can still interpret as they see best.
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NCAA Discussion / Re: S/B Quiz 2
« Last post by Snapper on June 14, 2021, 02:25:25 PM »
I had it as ING, even though they didn't clearly state it.  Unfortunately, we sometimes have to try to decipher what they are implying.  And with all other eligible receivers going downfield, I had assumed they wanted an ING.

That's not ideal, having to read between the lines and assume.  On the other hand, I imagine that writing quizzes is hard work.  And sometimes things are perfectly clear to the test writer, while a bit opaque to the rest of us.

Anyway, regarding your hypothetical, the QB throwing it to A20, who was covered by A88, I can't imagine an ING would ever be justified in such a case.  I can't see ever being able to justify that was intentional.  Illegal Touching, yes, but not ING in your hypothetical.
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NCAA Discussion / Re: S/B Quiz 2
« Last post by ElvisLives on June 14, 2021, 11:51:03 AM »
S/B said ING at No. 3. As I stated, it was a stretch, with the info given. If the passer is still in the tackle box, he must - in our judgment - be attempting to conserve yardage, to warrant ING. There was no indication of the passer attempting to conserve yardage, like "...under a heavy rush..." or "...about to be tackled..."  With that kind of information, yeah, we could get to ING, without hesitation. But, without it, A12 may have been thinking A70 was A20, or some other 'eligible' player.  You could even apply this to a situation with A20 catching the pass, but A20 was 'covered' at the snap, because end A88 was too far forward (supposed to be in the backfield), so, A20 isn't eligible; but A12 doesn't really know that, and there is no attempt to conserve yardage. Just ITP.

If y'all haven't noticed, S/B aren't designing unique questions. They are grabbing existing ARs and throwing them at us, some totally intact, some slightly modified. Not saying good or bad, just FYI.
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Quote
It doesn't matter in regards to blocking below the waist if the QB is in shotgun or not

Some states, NC included, have adopted the interpretation that a lineman in a 2 point stance can not legally block below the waist as opposed to a 3 or 4 point stance in a shotgun snap.  I don't recall how many use that interp.

Otherwise you appear to be spot-on.
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Ok, as somebody that doesn't know NFHS rules really well anymore, but who still observes, etc., let me try to paraphrase my understanding of the FBZ, BBW, IBB, etc.  This, of course, is with the caveat that we haven't seen the final 2021 rulebook and casebook language yet.  Corrections/refinements to my paraphrasing are welcome.  This is basically for my own use to understand the differences between Fed and NCAA.

The FBZ measures 3 yds vertically and 4 yds wide from the spot of the snap, and any part of their body puts them in the zone.  In practice, given a balanced formation and normal splits, this means TE to TE.

Offensive AND Defensive linemen in the zone at the snap can immediately block each other below the waist.  It doesn't matter in regards to blocking below the waist if the QB is in shotgun or not.  The block can be directed forward or from the side.  Immediate, as a practical matter, means the lineman directly ahead or directly adjacent to them.  They still can't CLP or CHB.

The other rule that uses the FBZ is blocking in the back.  Offensive lineman in the FBZ at the snap can legally block in the back (above the waist) any defensive players that were in the zone at the snap.  The block has to occur in the FBZ and the FBZ disintegrates when the ball leaves the zone.


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A question about blocking below the waist mechanics  - NFHS 5 & 4 man crews - who is responsible for knowing which offensive players are lined up on the LOS and in the FBZ at the snap? Is there any set philosophy other than eye-balling it? The R can align himself 4 yards from the ball laterally if the TE is on the same side as him, but what if he isn’t? Also, the R’s key is the opposite tackle. The wings, and the BJ depending on the formation, can see the TE's initial block, but they would not necessarily know if the TE was in the FBZ.

My understanding is NCAA has a “tackle box” - the 2 players on either side of the snapper determine the BACKWARD PASS dimension of the tackle box. Everyone else is not. This sets up a definitive determination as to who can block whom below the waist.

The NFHS GOM addresses the U knowing the B players on the LOS and in the FBZ, but doesn't seem to address A.  The R has the best look at the A player splits and determining who is in the FBZ.

Any further thoughts on this are appreciated.

You can fairly easily eyeball it from anywhere on the field.  It's essentially TE to TE on the LOS.  The R or U can see if the offense is in extra wide splits and alert the crew that the TE may be out of the FBZ, but that's rare.

The zone disintegrates almost immediately in shotgun, so you really don't have to worry about it as long as someone cuts as their first move out of their stance.  Plus with the rule change, the ball being in the FBZ doesn't matter anymore for cutting.
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Whenever possible, "always be nice, unless and until, it's time to not be nice." (Patrick Swayze, "Roadhouse")
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If a coach yelled to me " he was outside the tackle box" I would tell them I did not fish...
These people get their rule knowledge "as seen on TV"...
I’ve learned the hard way a snarky reply to an ignorant statement doesn’t help. I have politely told a coach who tried to apply a college rule to HS that this is Friday night and that’s a Saturday rule. Something along the lines of “Coach, if we were playing tomorrow you would be right but this is Friday night football.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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If a coach yelled to me " he was outside the tackle box" I would tell them I did not fish...
These people get their rule knowledge "as seen on TV"...
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NCAA Discussion / Re: S/B Quiz 2
« Last post by ElvisLives on June 13, 2021, 05:11:30 PM »
Agree, except 1/10, not 1/G from the B-11.

Of course. What was I thinking? Geez. Thanks.
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