B pulling down A

[dammitbobby]

https://youtu.be/6Bl_JXyxNIM?t=43
https://youtu.be/6Bl_JXyxNIM?t=2915

I've seen multiple teams (six man and 11 man) do this in the past two years, it's being coached... how do yall feel about this, a B player intentionally pulling down/slinging down an A player who is trying to block them, well away from the ballcarrier? No foul/foul for defensive holding/UNR/other?
 
Just curious what others a lot smarter and more experienced than me think.

[JasonTX]

Self defense.  You block me, I'm allowed to shed you off me.  But I have seen some where the defender goes after the team A player for no other reason and pulls them down and at first glance you'd think it was a take down hold by team A but it was really team B.  They are doing it to try and trick the officials into flagging and unfortunately it has worked.  We use those in our training sessions and want the crews to be aware and see what is actually happening.

[ElvisLives]

Self defense.  You block me, I'm allowed to shed you off me.  But I have seen some where the defender goes after the team A player for no other reason and pulls them down and at first glance you'd think it was a take down hold by team A but it was really team B.  They are doing it to try and trick the officials into flagging and unfortunately it has worked.  We use those in our training sessions and want the crews to be aware and see what is actually happening.

 

[dammitbobby]

The particular 11-man team I've seen this with, the defender would intentionally seek out the A player to engage just to throw him down... his sole interest was engaging and winning the 'battle' he was looking for with the defender. Not the slightest bit interested in actually trying to locate and tackle the ballcarrier if the play was away from his side.  And A invariably started getting tired of it and responded.

In what scenario/conditions would action like this rise to the level of being a defensive foul?

[AlUpstateNY]

The particular 11-man team I've seen this with, the defender would intentionally seek out the A player to engage just to throw him down... his sole interest was engaging and winning the 'battle' he was looking for with the defender. Not the slightest bit interested in actually trying to locate and tackle the ballcarrier if the play was away from his side.  And A invariably started getting tired of it and responded.

In what scenario/conditions would action like this rise to the level of being a defensive foul?

Are you serious? I guess it all depends on how much of this nonsense YOU are willing to put up with.  The remedy resides in YOUR choice of (a) A not so gentle warning, whispered into a helmet ear hole, (b) depending on what you've witnessed, an UNR flag, (c) if it was a REALLY CHEAP shot, a one way ticket to the locker room.  Guaranteed, you let this "Stuff" slide, you'll be dealing with a lot more of it.

[Kalle]

In what scenario/conditions would action like this rise to the level of being a defensive foul?

If it is obviously engaging just for the sake of engaging and it is not even, I'd probably throw a PF flag if it ends up with the engaging player throwing the engaged player down.

[ElvisLives]

If I throw on it (for a repeated act after a clear “knock it off” warning), I’d go UNS, and put it on his counter, as further disincentive to do it again.

[dammitbobby]

Thanks gents, this was helpful in understanding where that boundary lies.