Two plays for catch or incomplete

[Sumstine]

Play #1 http://video.yahoo.com/watch/8650057/23401052

Play #2 http://video.yahoo.com/watch/8652271/23410048

[Kalle]

I don't really see how you could rule these two differently, the level of control is almost exactly the same. I'm going with the "no cheap scores/turnovers" philosophy and rule both incomplete.

[110]

 

[Dakota Dan]

These are excellent teaching plays and demonstrates very well the difference between an upright player who completes a catch with firm control and is then contacted causing the ball to become loose versus a player contacted in the act of a catch or going to the ground on his own and losing the ball.  The receiver in both plays are upright and would have remained upright, firmly controls the ball and is then contacted by the defender. I feel in both cases that theses are a catch and then TD in video 1 and a fumble in video 2.

[chymechowder]

First one I have TD all the way.  Receiver gets two feet down in the endzone while controlling the ball. And he's not going to the ground. So the play is over at that point, in my opinion.

If nothing else, it's a great teaching tool that the two covering officials should make some eye contact (and even quickly discuss, if necessary) before signaling two different things.

Second one could go either way. I said incomplete. But part of that is because of the "no cheap scores" philosophy.

Great clips.

[mccormicw]

First one I have TD all the way.  Receiver gets two feet down in the endzone while controlling the ball. And he's not going to the ground. So the play is over at that point, in my opinion.

If nothing else, it's a great teaching tool that the two covering officials should make some eye contact (and even quickly discuss, if necessary) before signaling two different things.

Second one could go either way. I said incomplete. But part of that is because of the "no cheap scores" philosophy.

Great clips.

I agree with TD on the first play.  Player clearly had possession in the end zone and did not lose possession going to the ground.  I agree with incomplete pass on the second play.  While technically a complete pass, the philosophy of a the receiver "making a football move" is to prevent this exact situation where nothing good will come from calling it a complete pass.

[bossman72]

Incomplete in both - needs to control the ball throughout the process.

[Yakcall]

I thought the first one was good 
He has it and two feet in bounds. After that it is knocked out.

Second one incomplete