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Football Officiating => Texas Topics => Topic started by: lonnieritch1981 on August 16, 2022, 01:33:44 PM
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Okay, i know this has been discussed before, so please excuse my delay in getting involved in it. As for defensive holding carrying an automatic first down, I assume this does not include holding a shooter on 4th down. But it would not exclude holding a guard or tackle. Is this correct?
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I’m assuming by “shooter” you mean the player going downfield to cover the kick. Because it is a foul that qualifies for PSK, it is no longer DH and is now OH.
Holding a guard so a teammate can go through the gap and block the kick, that is DH and would carry an auto first.
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Okay, i know this has been discussed before, so please excuse my delay in getting involved in it. As for defensive holding carrying an automatic first down, I assume this does not include holding a shooter on 4th down. But it would not exclude holding a guard or tackle. Is this correct?
I'm guessing that by "...shooter..." you mean a "gunner", or "flyer," as I knew it during my FBS days, which is the outside player of team A that, at the snap, runs as fast as he can down field to cover a punt. On that assumption, fouls against a shooter/gunner/flyer tend to occur after the ball is kicked, and fouls that occur during the kick qualify for PSK enforcement. That means Team B gets to keep the ball, with the penalty enforced from the appropriate 3 and 1 spot, with the Basic Spot being the end of the kick.
On a legal scrimmage kick down, the automatic first down applies to fouls that occur before the ball is kicked. Yes, just as with holding an interior lineman, it is certainly possible for a flyer to be dragged down immediately, or shortly after the ball is snapped - but before the ball is kicked - and that holding foul would be penalized at the previous spot and carry the automatic first down. When in question as to when the foul occurred, rule that is occurred during the kick, for PSK enforcement.
The down number has nothing to do with this. This could happen on any down, although it would certainly be most common during a 4th down scrimmage kick (punt or field goal attempt).
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Steve Shaw actually covers this in one of his training videos. The gunner's being held they want to make that PSK even though the hold might be just before the ball is kicked. Those players are essentially on offense so he says to make that PSK. As for the "pull and shoot" holds, those are defensive moves and will be previous spot enforcment.
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Thanks to all of you who responded. I thought Shaw had covered this in the video and was pretty sure holding on the gunner/shooter was PSK. What I was fuzzy on was why. You guys were a big help.