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Football Officiating => NCAA Discussion => Topic started by: TXMike on September 01, 2010, 05:41:13 AM
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Neither. False starts, clear as day.
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I have a false start.
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If this wasn't flagged, the crew should be flogged.
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Coach should be flogged for teaching that BS.
pi1eOn
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All false starts. Any motion that simulates the beginning of the play has to be a false start. The quickness of the movements here clearly simulate the beginning of a play.
From "The Football Code" under the coaching ethics section (FR-13 in the 09-10 Rulebook: Shifting in a way that simulates the start of a play or employing any other unfair tactic for the purpose of drawing one’s opponent offside. This can be construed only as a deliberate attempt to gain an unmerited advantage.
And from Rule 7.1.3.4: 4. No offensive player shall contact an opponent or make a false start, which includes: (b) A shift or movement that simulates the beginning of a play. This includes the snapper who, after assuming a position for the succeeding snap and touching or simulating (hand(s) at or below his knees) touching the ball, moves to another position.
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I've got illegal shift on the second play. Ball is snapped while Team A lineman are moving.
Given that the QB is apparently sacked for a loss, Team B might be inclined to decline the penalty.
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Don't understand how we can have an illegal shift on this play. The "Illegal Shift" Movement that draws B into the NZ occurs before the snap, and as a result of that movement B is in the NZ before the snap, which does occur while B is still in the NZ and A has not yet set. If we call illegal shift now we've got a live ball foul at the snap with B already in the NZ. We've got offsetting fouls at that point.
This is clearly a "coached" technique, that by definition is illegal and IMO a virtual "automatic" false start, blow & throw. Also, IMO the coach needs a talking to based on The Football Code preface in the rulebook.
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Yep, it is a FS if before snap, an illegal motion if with the snap, and legal if after the snap starts.
Agree with the code of ethics issue.
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I agree with a False Start call here.
Someone's been watching old Dallas Cowboys video.
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Don't understand how we can have an illegal shift on this play. The "Illegal Shift" Movement that draws B into the NZ occurs before the snap, and as a result of that movement B is in the NZ before the snap, which does occur while B is still in the NZ and A has not yet set. If we call illegal shift now we've got a live ball foul at the snap with B already in the NZ. We've got offsetting fouls at that point.
I see the order of movements of the second play as 1) Team A lineman stand upright; 2) the snapper snaps the ball to the QB; 3) Team B moves into the neutral zone.
Event 1) constitutents a shift. After that shift, the ball was snapped before all those Team A linemen got set for 1 sec. That's a live-ball foul for illegal shift. Team B is in the neutral zone legally.
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After further review if you watch the 2nd play frame by frame, the ball is snapped before the A line movement but the QB who then has the ball doesn't move for a second or two and waits until the line moves, then pulls out from behind center. The motion of the A line doesn't actually start until the ball is no longer on the ground, so the 2nd play is legal.