Assisting The Runner Penalty

[muddlehead]

What is the correct call here? Saturday San Diego Sate vs Cal Bears. I was at the game. Just a bit confusing. Ball at SDSU 36. Runner ran 5 yds before being pulled/aided by an offensive lineman for another 4 yds. Call on the field was: penalty, SDSU, aiding the runner, 5 yds, first and 5, ball at 41. 
 
From CalBears.com play by play:

SDSU 1st and 10 SDSU 36
19-PUMPHREY, Donnel rush for 9 yards to the SDSU45 (2B-Broussard, Nate;27-Drew, Damariay),
PENALTY SDSU helping runner (46-GORDON, Dakota) 4 yards to the SDSU41.

SDSU   1-5   at SDSU 41

My guess is replay first down, 5 yd penalty, first and 15 from SDSU 36.

[BoBo]

Not seeing the play I am going to guess the actually aiding of the runner occurred beyond the previous LOS so it became a 5 yard penalty from the spot of the foul and in this case replay the down.

[muddlehead]

Thanks. So in this case it should have been first and 10, not first and 5. Makes sense. Sort of. What if the runner, before being aided is well past yard to gain, say, all the way down to the 20 before being aided into the end zone for an apparent touchdown. Spot of foul is the 20. It is now first and what?

[DallasLJ]

Thanks. So in this case it should have been first and 10, not first and 5. Makes sense. Sort of. What if the runner, before being aided is well past yard to gain, say, all the way down to the 20 before being aided into the end zone for an apparent touchdown. Spot of foul is the 20. It is now first and what?

  1st and Ten.  Just like a Block in the Back downfield.  Or Illegal Forward Pass.  Give the Runner the benefit of the yards he gained on his own.  5 yards from the spot of the foul -- where the aid happened.  If the ball is still beyond the line to gain, then 1st down.

[BrendanP]

We had a situation like this in a JV game I worked last season. Ball carrier tripped over his own feet, and an offensive lineman bear hugged him from behind to keep him from falling. 

Helping the runner, 5 yards from the spot of the foul (foul happened 10 or 15 yards downfield), result of the play is a first down.

[TxSkyBolt]

We had a situation like this in a JV game I worked last season. Ball carrier tripped over his own feet, and an offensive lineman bear hugged him from behind to keep him from falling. 

Helping the runner, 5 yards from the spot of the foul (foul happened 10 or 15 yards downfield), result of the play is a first down.

Izzat a foul?



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[BrendanP]

Izzat a foul?



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NFHS rule states,

9-1   Pushing, pulling or lifting the runner to aid his forward progress

By bear hugging him, I'd say he pulled and lifted the runner to prevent him from going down, ending the play. I didn't throw the flag, but I had no problem marching off the yardage either.

[pjsaul]

Anyone have a video? I've been dying to see one of these in the real world!

[TxSkyBolt]

NFHS rule states,

9-1   Pushing, pulling or lifting the runner to aid his forward progress

By bear hugging him, I'd say he pulled and lifted the runner to prevent him from going down, ending the play. I didn't throw the flag, but I had no problem marching off the yardage either.

Gotcha, but this is the NCAA forum.

[Legacy Zebra]

It would be a foul in NCAA rules as well. Teammates I the ball carrier can not "grasp, pull, or lift" him (9-3-2).

[bkdow]

I love the difference between high school and college:  "Push" 

[DallasLJ]

I love the difference between high school and college:  "Push"

  We had "push" until a few years ago.  They decided, rightly, that we don not want to penalize pushing the pile, or the back pushing the other back through the pile on the short yardage play.

[Legacy Zebra]

Whether you think taking "push" out of the rule was the right thing might depend on whether you were a USC or Notre Dame fan...

[Osric Pureheart]

Anyone who thinks it was a good thing should find out more about the 1905-1912 period, the reason there's a rule against assisting the runner; it was a major part of the mass-momentum plays that had politicians and university officials threatening to ban football unless the game could be made safer.  The last thing football's image needs right now is for someone to get seriously hurt because they fell the wrong way in the middle of a pile that was being pushed.

[ncwingman]

Whether you think taking "push" out of the rule was the right thing might depend on whether you were a USC or Notre Dame fan...

At least USC didn't end up winning that game.

... several years after the fact....

[Joe Stack]

In MOST cases, there is no reason to flag this. Just blow the whistle and shut the play down. Forward progress implies on his own -- for plays on the field of play. If there is a situation where the offender keeps the runner from going out of bounds or pulls him into the EZ, then yeah, flag that. And I'm not saying never flag the above, just blow it dead and tell the players/coach it was either that or a flag. In cases where you feel the offender gained an advantage, by all means flag that as well.

[Legacy Zebra]

We talked about this and so of course I had it happen in a JV game last Thursday. Team A was backed up against their own goal line and fumbled the ball about the 6. A Team B linebacker recovered the fumble and was falling to the ground. As he was going to the ground, about three of his teammates grabbed him and drug him 6 yards across the goal line. I put a flag on it and we backed Team B up and played 1st and 10 from the 11. Of course the coach's reaction when I explained the flag was "You're gonna flag 'em for being good teammates? That's just wrong!" (It was in good fun with a smile on his face)