HEAR YE, HEAR YE: Speak now...or forever hold your peace..

[Ralph Damren]

NFHS 3-1-6b :Halftime intermission may be increased to a maximum of 20 minutes.
This may give some of you ammo , if you are lobbying for a shorter intermission. Maybe the band will have to omit a couple of songs  . Request : Let 'em still play 'Louie, Louie'.

Unsure what the NCAA stance is on this, but by working a game clock at several D-III schools, I'm asked to put up 20:00. Often, in a whisper, the white hat will say: "Shut it off at 1:00, we don't want to penalize  . ".

IMHO, starting the clock on RFP after OOB would be viable. It has been on the docket several times and has been ran as an experimental rule by some states. If you run an experimental rule, first you need to get NFHS permission , during the season the number of occurrences, after the season poll both coaches and officials. The poll results showed the coaches liked it while the officials didn't because of the need to change timing rules at the 2:00 mark of each half. It's usually a near 50-50 split on the floor, but needing 2/3 support , has failed. I've lobbied hard for it, and now have more ammo as 3-4-7 (offended team can start penalty on snap in the last 2 min. of each half) has been in town since 2017and we seem to be able to handle that.

Treating incomplete passes the same as OOB was experimented with by NCAA several years back. Their experiment appeared to be a failure and was quickly dropped. Manning the game clock, I recall the confusion of starting the clock on RFP after an incomplete 4th down pass.

[KWH]

Once AGAIN, Ralph, You nailed it.  The shenanigans after a score (& often repeated after the successful try) are apparently universal, although some of the same activities after an unexpected COP (fumble recovery, interception run a close second.  3rd, might be those extra last second instructions, after an anticipated COP (unsuccessful 4th down).  Apparently those instructions, assignments can ONLY be discussed and happen AFTER the opponents 4th down fails. A close 4th might be the frequent sideline instructional clinics held during (extended) intermission between periods.

The frequency of dogs running onto the field seems to have improved considerably in recent years, but that seems attributable more likely to local Animal Control than site management attention and/or focus.

I believe the 40 second clock should begin anytime the covering official gives Signal 5.
(Signal 5 is given following a successful Field Goal, Try or Touchdown)

Further, I believe the 40 second clock should start after a Free Kick, a Punt, any scoring kick and possibly a change of possession down as all of these situations would likely speed the game up.
alas, A 25-second RFP should remain following a safety, as some R's require a little extra time to change ends of the field. 

I plan to test the waters on this idea for a possible change in 2023?
What do y'all think about that one???

[HLinNC]

I believe we still don't have all the "civilian" PCO's on board the :40 clock now. 

Case in point- Week 11 game (final regular season)- I'm the WH.
CO's in our area rarely meet with us because just as the chain crew guys, "we know what we're a' doin'."   The PCO never paid one bit of attention to any of our DBS after the play.  He waited until the ball was placed on the ground by the U.  As the home team was a predominant run team, I'm thinking "ok, we'll live with it".  Then when we started having incomplete passes and he was waiting to start when the U placed a new ball down, I think "Man, I've got to do SOMETHING, we'll be here all night".  Finally we start getting rain and the U is holding the ball to keep it dry until A gets to the LOS.  I finally figure out I'm going to have to blow a RFP every play to get him to run the play clock-which I did.

We have some PCO's that won't run the :25 before a free kick after the RFP.

[NVFOA_Ump]

Case in point- Week 11 game (final regular season)- I'm the WH.
CO's in our area rarely meet with us because just as the chain crew guys, "we know what we're a' doin'."   The PCO never paid one bit of attention to any of our DBS after the play.  He waited until the ball was placed on the ground by the U.  As the home team was a predominant run team, I'm thinking "ok, we'll live with it".  Then when we started having incomplete passes and he was waiting to start when the U placed a new ball down, I think "Man, I've got to do SOMETHING, we'll be here all night".  Finally we start getting rain and the U is holding the ball to keep it dry until A gets to the LOS.  I finally figure out I'm going to have to blow a RFP every play to get him to run the play clock-which I did.

We have some PCO's that won't run the :25 before a free kick after the RFP.

IMHO looks like you had an "experienced" play clock operator who is locked in on the old RFP 25 second play clock.  In MA the clock operator(s) are officials and part of the pre-game.  In almost all games since we have gone to the 25/40 the play clock is kept by the BJ.

[bama_stripes]

I believe the 40 second clock should begin anytime the covering official gives Signal 5.
(Signal 5 is given following a successful Field Goal, Try or Touchdown)

Further, I believe the 40 second clock should start after a Free Kick, a Punt, any scoring kick and possibly a change of possession down as all of these situations would likely speed the game up.
alas, A 25-second RFP should remain following a safety, as some R's require a little extra time to change ends of the field. 

I plan to test the waters on this idea for a possible change in 2023?
What do y'all think about that one???

I’m strongly opposed to :40 preceding a free kick.  It takes a little bit for the teams to change personnel, get lined up, AND for the officials to get into position and make their count.

[Ralph Damren]

Up here in Maine we never worry 'bout our play clock operator. That's because we know him as mister back judge. Ain't got none of them there fancy gismos on a pole like many of you fellas got, just a ReadyRef for the BJ. When he starts his 'poor man's stopwatch' (countdown) ,some may think he's waving to the chap in the next lobsterboat, but we know he tellin' them critters with the ball to git moving.

Does this seem to work OK  -AYUH

Will schools start to git them there fancy clocks  - 'Spect not

Be careful what you wish for......

[CalhounLJ]

I’m strongly opposed to :40 preceding a free kick.  It takes a little bit for the teams to change personnel, get lined up, AND for the officials to get into position and make their count.

Plus, rule 3-5-7L calls for a one minute intermission between the score and the succeeding kickoff


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[KWH]

Plus, rule 3-5-7L calls for a one minute intermission between the score and the succeeding kickoff
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Good point Calhoun, So, two options to enhance supporting Rule 3-5-7l

a) Play clock operator waits 20 seconds and then starts the 40 to be used*
Or
b) Play clock operator starts the 25 and when it expires starts the 40 to be used*
Or
c) Program a third button that give you 60 seconds on the play clock to be used* (This would be ideal but requires reprograming the play clock and while this may be a ZERO expense with Daktronics don't know about any other brand)

 *  For a one-minute intermission between the first and second period and the third and fourth periods and following a try, successful field goal, or safety and prior to the succeeding free kick!
Consider adding: After a Free kick, After a punt and after a COP.


For those concerned the white hat can always "pump the sky" when HE/SHE deems necessary

If you ever record the delays after kickoffs they are sometimes are pushing 1:30 to 2:00 (Our observers do this)
Hustling them up with the play clock would help pick up the game without changing any rules
For those concerned the white hat can always "pump the sky" when HE/SHE deems necessary to reset the running play clock to 25

This might be a grand experimental rule for a state like West Virginia which is virtually 100% on play clocks on High School Fields!

[bossman72]

Good point Calhoun, So, two options to enhance supporting Rule 3-5-7l

a) Play clock operator waits 20 seconds and then starts the 40 to be used*
Or
b) Play clock operator starts the 25 and when it expires starts the 40 to be used*
Or
c) Program a third button that give you 60 seconds on the play clock to be used* (This would be ideal but requires reprograming the play clock and while this may be a ZERO expense with Daktronics don't know about any other brand)

 *  For a one-minute intermission between the first and second period and the third and fourth periods and following a try, successful field goal, or safety and prior to the succeeding free kick!
Consider adding: After a Free kick, After a punt and after a COP.


For those concerned the white hat can always "pump the sky" when HE/SHE deems necessary

If you ever record the delays after kickoffs they are sometimes are pushing 1:30 to 2:00 (Our observers do this)
Hustling them up with the play clock would help pick up the game without changing any rules
For those concerned the white hat can always "pump the sky" when HE/SHE deems necessary to reset the running play clock to 25

This might be a grand experimental rule for a state like West Virginia which is virtually 100% on play clocks on High School Fields!

I wouldn't mess with the rule.  25 is needed after kicks because personnel is changing for both teams.  I don't think it would speed the game up that much more to be worth the confusing rule change.  The juice is not worth the squeeze here.

[KWH]

I wouldn't mess with the rule.  25 is needed after kicks because personnel is changing for both teams.  I don't think it would speed the game up that much more to be worth the confusing rule change.  The juice is not worth the squeeze here.

I here ya bossman - If they really wanted to shorten the game they need look no further than
a) not stopping the clock on 1st downs, (which would remove two or more exceptions) and/or
b) starting it on the RFP after an incomplete pass!

Either of those squeezes might just be worth it for the juice 

[AlUpstateNY]

Whos looking to dramatically shorten, a well managed HIGH SCHOOL/b]football game, and more importantly WHY?  It would be interesting to actually know how many States have total compliance with electronic/visible play clocks, compared to how many are equipped with +- 25%, or fewer.

Table 3-1 indicates "Intermission Between Periods - 1 minute"  which I presume includes retrieving the football, gathering each team to make personnel adjustments and/or last minute planning changes to get teams ready. Officials have responsibilities to attend to getting things (chain crews) ready and set.  A simple audible signal (RFP whistle) at 25 seconds has provided appropriate warning of the diminishing time left, to everyone, BEFORE reaching  "the Game is Delayed". 

If there is an unusual cause of delay, the Referee can be alerted and delay, or interrupt, his RFP depending on the nature of the interruption and act accordingly to that specific issue.

AT THE HIGH SCHOOL LEVEL, which experiences somewhat more common and unexpected confusion in most aspects, focus on specific issues and directed flexible management control  (by game officials)seems a far more practical and direct route to avoiding repetitive "excessive delays" that may well be largely location specific, than universal technical adjustments that may NEVER be fully implemented, or accounted for, although they work well at higher levels.

One size STILL never fits all.

[Ralph Damren]

Where it seems that length of games is a hot topic, I dug back into my notes to see how many changes have been made on my watch.....

KEY : + lengthened game, - shortened game, Y/N how I voted, OTO officials time out

1993 : 3-1-1  mercy rule to allow states to have running time   ----   Y
1994 : 3-5-7h heat/ humidity  OTO/ safety ++                                 Y
1996 : 3-3-3c IW gives untimed down +                                          Y
          3-4-3b,c clock starts on snap after COP +++                          Y
2004 :3-1-4  state's choice on weather delay +                                 Y
2005 :3-3-4 no untimed down if loss of down -                                  N
2008 :3-5-1 no carryover TOs into OT-                                              Y
2009 : 9-8-1g Coach=USC if late for 3 min. warmup -                        Y
2010 : 3-1-2  TIPS suggested for mercy rule -                                   Y
          3-2-2 no capts. needed prior to 2nd half -                                Y
2012 : 3-5-3 player losing hat must leave OTO/safety +                     Y
2017 : 3--4-7 penalty w/I 2 min can start on snap +                          N
2019 : 3-6-1 added 40 sec. play clock  ??                                          N

Some of you may feel I'm all wet on all, some mostly wet, some only a little wet. I'd enjoy ( maybe) hearing your opinions…..

                                            

[AlUpstateNY]

Where it seems that length of games is a hot topic, I dug back into my notes to see how many changes have been made on my watch.....KEY : + lengthened game, - shortened game, Y/N how I voted,

Some of you may feel I'm all wet on all, some mostly wet, some only a little wet. I'd enjoy ( maybe) hearing your opinions…..
                                       

Actually, your record suggests you've managed to stay pretty dry, and likely warm, on those often chilly & likely damp NE Fall evenings.  It would seem that many of those rule adjustments left differing amounts of field Official's managerial discretion allowance to fit/address unique/unusual/site or circumstance situations.

Precise perfection is a laudable objective, but as V. Lombardy advised, "PERFECTION is NOT attainable, but if we chase perfection we can (may) catch excellence", which will hopefully be within our grasp.   

[Bubba Ump]

Honestly, what I'd like to see is a much shorter JV game before the varsity game.  We adopt our own timing rules like winding the clock on a COP when the ball is inbounds, but that doesn't do much.  When I started... 27 years ago... there was a Varsity crew, JV crew and a freshman crew.  Frosh and JV played on Thursday and Varsity played on Friday or Saturday.  A move to the North Bay.. Crab Cake City.. and JV and Varsity play on Fridays with the Varsity game starting 30 minutes after the JV game..  5 man crew does both games, 15 minute halves, unless homecoming, and we rarely leave the field before 10:00.  Then it's off to the nearest Crabblebees and I'm usually home by Midnight...  We're 40 guys short.  We have first year guys doing Varsity games.  Youth football actually pays more but I'd rather 3 putt then work youth.   Got to work State with some great officials from Sacramento. Last season they worked 4 man across the board and they have some huge programs over there.  Something has to change...  We do have some new guys and girls who are getting better but they don't have the 4 or 5 years of lower level games you need to be a decent varsity official.  Many get discouraged and are one and done.  Even sadder state is basketball.  I went to a meeting last month and I was the youngest guy there and I'm pushing 60...  I don't know if any rules can help the crisis of lack of officials but I would try to remind the rules committee that everything they pass needs to keep that in mind. 

[HLinNC]

I don't know if any rules can help the crisis of lack of officials but I would try to remind the rules committee that everything they pass needs to keep that in mind.

 

[Ralph Damren]

I don't know if any rules can help the crisis of lack of officials but I would try to remind the rules committee that everything they pass needs to keep that in mind.

 

I rule or law that might help is to post the fields with : NO FIREARMS, ALCHOL, OR CELLPHONES .

In daze of yesteryear, bad calls might be chatted about briefly around the pickle barrel . Today ,half of the frenzied masses will have shown the bad call to the other half via their cellphones. A new official needs a much thicker skin.
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[Rich]

I would not be in favor of using the 40 before a free kick, but maybe a POE on starting the 1:00 clock as soon as the try ends? And hitting the RFP at the end of the 1:00? Crews could do more to speed this part up.

The 40 would be great after punts or other changes of possession.  There's no reason a team can't get out fast enough -- I watch them do it every Saturday.  Will some teams struggle at first? Yes.  Will they adjust? Also, yes.

[AlUpstateNY]

I rule or law that might help is to post the fields with : NO FIREARMS, ALCHOL, OR CELLPHONES .

In daze of yesteryear, bad calls might be chatted about briefly around the pickle barrel . Today ,half of the frenzied masses will have shown the bad call to the other half via their cellphones. A new official needs a much thicker skin.
\

Actually, we may not be experiencing significant growth in really STUPID people, but it's obvious we have a LOT MORE otherwise rational, normal people willing to pay added attention to REALLY STUPID people.