Chain mechanics question

[dammitbobby]

Have a question on chain mechanics from a game last week.  1st and 10 at B 11 yard line; chop block foul and then dead ball personal foul push the LOS to B 36, 1st and 35.  Pass play towards sideline, A88 drops pass at the sideline heading out (swing pass) and box gets moved/dropped as box man gets out of the way for safety reasons.  No help from sticks, since we are well behind them.  Where is the ball spotted?  At that distance to go, is it spotted best effort/guess as to where it was before?  Or is there a specific mechanic/process/procedure to help with this?

[ilyazhito]

The Line Judge would hold the line of scrimmage. The Umpire would know what the field position of the ball on the previous down was, so the ball would be returned to the previous spot after a consultation by those 2 officials (and the Head Linesman).

[Legacy Zebra]

As a wing, part of your presnap routine should be saying the line of scrimmage and the line to gain with the down and distance so that you have it in your mind. So in this case “36 to the 1, 1st and 35.” My H also has the box man write down the down and yard line every play. Just put a strip of tape on the down box pole and give them a marker. All they have to do is write “1st +11, 1st +36...” so you have a back up.

[ElvisLives]

No great answer here, other than that is why the "lone ranger" exists.  The "lone ranger" is the auxiliary down box on the pressbox side of the field.  He holds the previous spot until the ball is ready for play for the succeeding down.  If there is no "lone ranger," there are still a couple of tricks available.  Try to get one of the chain crew to track the succeeding spot, by placing a long piece of athletic tape on the down box, or one of the stakes, and write down the yard line for each succeeding spot.  That could be done by the clip guy, too (with a clip board or small note pad).  If they are really good, they'll track the time, too, i.e., each time the clock stops until the next snap, they'll write that down, in case the clock gets started for the next down, but there was a late T/O request that got granted, or false start or something.  Finally, I have heard of box guys that drop a bean bag at the succeeding spot, just for that reason, but that means he has to pick it up each time he moves; it could be done.

Don't depend on the line judge.  The might happen to be at the previous spot, if he doesn't move.  Under most circumstances, yeah, he might 'hold' on the NZ for a while, then move to cover action as needed.  But, if he is camped on the NZ the whole game, he ain't being as much help as he should be.  Don't hang your hat on that.

The lone ranger is the best thing.  Otherwise, yeah, it may be the best guess, and that won't be fun.

Robert

[bossman72]

The only way to save this is if the down box guy puts tape on the down box and writes every down and yard line of every play.  If it moves, then you can just look at the last play he wrote down.

That's probably asking a lot of a high school chain crew though.

[markrischard]

Of course, if the H remembers it was first down, and the two penalties that got them there, he should be able to calculate the LOS.
 Why did 30 yards worth of penalties only take A back 25 yards? Was the chop block 5 yards down field?

[HLinNC]

Out of 5 guys, somebody knows where we snapped the ball from.

[dammitbobby]

Of course, if the H remembers it was first down, and the two penalties that got them there, he should be able to calculate the LOS.
 Why did 30 yards worth of penalties only take A back 25 yards? Was the chop block 5 yards down field?

I probably didn't get that part right, was just using it as a made up example as I don't recall what the exact yardline and where the foul occurred.  Those two penalties did occur though on one play and it was 1st and halfway across town for the first.  (They actually did get the first, and scored on that series as well.)

Thanks for all the replies, very useful ideas here.

[ElvisLives]

Out of 5 guys, somebody knows where we snapped the ball from.

I've seen 7 guys that didn't know that, and that is not a criticism of them.  We all have a lot of things to think about, and that is something a bit lower on the priority list than other things.  But, if you don't have a lone ranger, the chain crew can track that, and keep everybody out of the boiling pot.

Robert

[ilyazhito]

The Line Judge is not supposed to move until the ball crosses the line of scrimmage. If I understand correctly, the pass did not go beyond the line of scrimmage, so the LJ should still be on the line of scrimmage.

[Magician]

The Line Judge is not supposed to move until the ball crosses the line of scrimmage. If I understand correctly, the pass did not go beyond the line of scrimmage, so the LJ should still be on the line of scrimmage.

Not necessarily in 5-man mechanics. If it's a pass read both wing officials could possibly be drifting downfield. That being said I often see HS wing officials start to drift immediately and go 10-15 yards downfield AHEAD of eligible receivers. If this pass was nearly caught at the sideline by the box he had an eligible receiver who didn't go downfield at all. He should drift toward the offensive backfield one to get out of harm's way and two to have a wider view of the action around the receiver and the blocks in front of him. If it's a fairly quick pass into the flat the opposite side wing should stay on or near the LOS and the U should have moved toward it. There are plenty of people who should have a pretty good idea of where the previous LOS was.