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Author Topic: Relocating The Ball on KO  (Read 9128 times)

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Offline jra104

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Relocating The Ball on KO
« on: October 18, 2022, 09:39:16 AM »
I keep posting on the NCAA board because in Texas we use NCAA rules. 
Not my team.
 Looks like the officials called an illegal procedure on this play.  Take a look and let me know what you guys think.  Never seen this one before.
https://youtu.be/YjrZhbOLVJQ

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Offline dammitbobby

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2022, 10:11:57 AM »
JRA104, there is a specific forum for Texas high school football, called Texas Topics, located here: http://www.refstripes.com/forum/index.php?board=50.0

As for this play - it's hard to tell without sound, as we don't know whether the RFP whistle has been blown or not (likely was). That whistle should happen when all the officials are in their respective positions, and signal to the R that they are ready.  It is NOT based on when the kicking team is ready.

Rule 6-1-2-a:
...The referee will declare the ball ready for play when the officials are in position after the kicker has received the ball. After the ready-for-play signal, the ball may only be relocated after a charged timeout or
during a subsequent kick.


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Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2022, 10:14:26 AM »
Doesn't happen often, but, once the ball is positioned between the hash marks for a free kick, and the ball is ready for play, it may not be relocated between the hash marks. That is a dead-ball foul, 5 yards. So they got that right. 
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Offline dammitbobby

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2022, 10:19:29 AM »
There is a persistent belief that the ball is not RFP until it has been placed on the tee, and that is not true.  I've no idea where coaches got this idea from, but it's not true; I had this occur earlier this year with the exact same argument.
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Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2022, 10:51:56 AM »
And, by the way, if the kicker had kicked the ball on the bum-rush, it may have been illegal, if the ball wasn't in contact with the tee. If a tee is brought onto the field for a free kick, the ball must be touching the tee when the ball is kicked. It can be leaning against the tee, or on top of the tee. (Don't have an answer as to whether the tee may be on top of the ball. But why?) That would also be a dead-ball foul. 5 from the succeeding spot.
Can't tell for sure in the video, but it doesn't look like the ball is touching the tee. But, maybe.
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Offline JasonTX

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2022, 11:10:35 AM »
Quote from: ElvisLives on October 18, 2022, 10:14:26 AM
Doesn't happen often, but, once the ball is positioned between the hash marks for a free kick, and the ball is ready for play, it may not be relocated between the hash marks. That is a dead-ball foul, 5 yards. So they got that right.
The way I read the rule they have to actually kick it and then we flag and shut it down.
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Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2022, 11:15:25 AM »
Yes, that is correct.
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Offline dammitbobby

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2022, 11:50:22 AM »
Quote from: ElvisLives on October 18, 2022, 10:51:56 AM
It can be leaning against the tee, or on top of the tee. (Don't have an answer as to whether the tee may be on top of the ball. But why?)

That's a safety issue for me; I would not let them kick a ball with a tee laying on top - that tee's likely going further than the ball and that thing HURTS if you get hit with it. 
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Offline jra104

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2022, 07:02:24 AM »
Thanks... Just curious, how many of you have actually seen this happen prior to now?
Also, for those that like deep rules dives, I am trying to find the 1 pt safety play my team had years ago.  I'm sure some would be interested in seeing that. 
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Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2022, 07:46:53 AM »
Quote from: jra104 on October 19, 2022, 07:02:24 AM
Thanks... Just curious, how many of you have actually seen this happen prior to now?
Also, for those that like deep rules dives, I am trying to find the 1 pt safety play my team had years ago.  I'm sure some would be interested in seeing that.

Because that is so rare (never seen it or heard of it in 51 years, until you say you had it), if you have video of it, it would be good for us to have it, to add to our video library for training. If you find it, we'd like to get  it, if possible.
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Offline dammitbobby

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2022, 08:22:29 AM »
Happened in 2013 Fiesta Bowl between Kansas State and Oregon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp4TeP4rw0s
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Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2022, 08:35:29 AM »
Quote from: dammitbobby on October 19, 2022, 08:22:29 AM
Happened in 2013 Fiesta Bowl between Kansas State and Oregon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp4TeP4rw0s

Thanks for that. An interesting thing - did you notice the illegal froward pass by the guy who caught the kick and carried it into the end zone?

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Offline TxBJ

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2022, 08:40:11 AM »
It happened in a Big 12 game a while back.  I think it was Texas-Texas A&M.
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Offline bossman72

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2022, 08:53:30 AM »
Quote from: TxBJ on October 19, 2022, 08:40:11 AM
It happened in a Big 12 game a while back.  I think it was Texas-Texas A&M.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKLKbpWLHJ8
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Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Relocating The Ball on KO
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2022, 10:58:25 AM »
Quote from: TxBJ on October 19, 2022, 08:40:11 AM
It happened in a Big 12 game a while back.  I think it was Texas-Texas A&M.

And now, I remember that, too. Castleberry (correction) had that one. But, in looking at the video, I am reminded that the kick itself was "illegally kicking the ball," as the holder muffed the snap and the ball was rolling loose on the ground. But, that was not called. A&M would have wanted to accept the penalty, to obviate the safety through play, and end the try (with the LOD element of the penalty).
« Last Edit: October 19, 2022, 11:30:58 AM by ElvisLives »
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