I guess it was bound to happen... your thoughts

[AlUpstateNY]

Just a constructive reminder, Newera1005, but in life, there are some places you simply, "Don't go", bringing someone's mother into a heated discussion would be one such place, but even that doesn't hold a candle to using the American Flag as a cheap prop to garner attention to your grievance (even though that Flag is a symbol of your right to do so), WHATEVER your grievance might be about, or how strongly you feel about it.

Way too many Americans, of every race, creed and political persuasion, have PAID the ultimate sacrifice to affirm the dignity and respect OUR Flag has earned, for it to be used in ANY way, for ANY purpose other than for what it is designated for.

WHATEVER your grievance, WHATEVER your complaint "Find another way", take a different direction.  Anytime someone seeks a spotlight, they must understand it will bring both illumination as well as heat, and choosing the American Flag as a cheap prop, for WHATEVER your issue is, is simply not acceptable, under ANY condition.

[FBUmp]

As a general rule, NC has not formally adopted 2" stripes but they are allowed to be used by local association adoption. Basically if all five guys have the 2" stripes and want to wear them, they can -- but that's generally not the case. The general consensus seems to be "I'm not buying a new shirt until they make me".

Local associations can choose to make the 2" shirt mandatory. We have in the Southeastern.

[FBUmp]

What is everyone so afraid of? Actually having a discussion about one of the most pressing issues our nation is facing? Or better yet, things actually changing?

Kneeling on a football field isn't having a discussion.

There's a time and place for everything.

[jason]

It's not being afraid of anything. It's acknowledging that it's not appropriate to express political opinions while on the job. It has nothing to do with BLM itself. I am equally opposed to all political statements by officials in uniform at the game site. (For the record, I also don't like when officials who are veterans hand salute during the anthem. It just feels wrong. Although, I just generally don't like the look of hand salutes outside of military uniform.)

Politics doesn't belong in sports. If you want to express an opinion on a political issue, great. Just do it on your own time and on your own dime.

Bingo.  That official should be suspended by the association through which he gets his assignments. 

[fudilligas]

I am totally of the belief that as officials we are to be completely neutral in all situations while in uniform...now let's take this picture one step further and it becomes more controversial....a predominately black school vs a predominately white school for this game...the impartiality of the officials is out the door

[The Roamin' Umpire]

On any topic, each person must weigh for themselves the importance of making a public statement versus the potential cost of doing so. This official clearly decided that the balance was in favor of making a statement in what is probably the most public venue he has available.

Similarly, each association has a policy, explicitly stated or otherwise, for officials' decorum and a means for the leadership of that organization to decide when that policy has been violated and applying the consequences. Hopefully, the policy is well-thought out and not just one person's sense of what looks right. Hopefully, the leadership acts, according to that policy, for the benefit of the group and not out of a sense of personal anger. I expect in many associations, there would be at least a suspension. In some groups, he would never get a good assignment again; in other groups, he would be expelled from the organization altogether.

Probably, this official was aware of the likely consequences of making a statement and decided to do it anyway. I can respect that choice, even if I disagree with it. I imagine that there is *something* that would cause most of us to come to a similar decision.

[yarnnelg]

There is no way that I cause any dishonor to my team. I am a member of that team by invitation and earned accomplishment. I am dressed the same, conduct myself the same, and yearn to be a part of the same. Unless, I have fully expressed my intent before the game, I will not draw attention from my team, due to my personal actions. I could care less if teams refuse to stand, fans refuse to stand. I will look exactly as the herd of zebras in which I am a part.
My first crew, every member except me, were all Viet Nam Navy Riverboat Vets. The longest tour served was six months, the shortest thirty days. Each wounded and returned home. As a military brat, nothing in this world could bring me to a point of dishonoring those members of my team.
Protest on your own time.

[BrendanP]

I became a naturalized citizen of the United States of America this past Spring and one of the best things about this nation is that we even get to have this discussion. I wouldn't say anything to a guy on my crew who did that because I'm sure someone above me with a lot more power would. As for me, I will continue to stand and place my hand over my heart. If I didn't like it here, I would have moved back north once I turned 18 and I certainly wouldn't have gone through the trouble of the naturalization process.

[prab]

I would not work any future games with an official who knelt during the playing of the national anthem.  Period, end of story!

Flag procedures have been amended to allow veterans to render the hand salute during the playing of the national anthem.  I have done this myself and would have no problem with other veterans doing the same.

Some may see these positions as being mutually exclusive.  I do not.

[Ralph Damren]

I've always looked at sports officiating as :
    (1) A fun way to keep in shape and involved in a game you love;
    (2) working with kids seems to make me feel younger than I am;
    (3) developing new friendships that I'll cherish for the rest of my life;
    (4) PROVIDING AN OUTLET FROM PROBLEMS OF : THE WORLD/OUR COUNTRY/OUR CITY/ETC...
         
I don't always agree with my crewmates on religion/politics/customs/etc , but I do agree with their right to disagree (we even have a few Yankee fans in our chapter). However, when we are on the field we should put our disagreements aside and make the game our most important and only focus. IMHO, working a game is a great tonic if you are having a bad day- be it at home/ at work/ or morning the Sox getting swept by the tribe.  The minute we take the field, our crew is our team, and like a team, we should act as such. IMHO, we should all leave our problems/ concerns/ heartaches in our locker room or car and enjoy the game together.

THAT'S MY RANT OF THE DAY...
   NOW IT'S TIME TO THINK POSITIVE ABOUT OUR UPCOMING ELECTION

[NewEra1005]

" O're the land of the free and the home of the brave"  Two different things. I just don't believe we are fighting on our home soil as all those soldiers did for our freedom on foreign soil. It's not just a one way street.

The real issue is...as always... being buried. Open your minds and see the other side of this issue. We are all ignorant in some way so I don't fault those who cannot see past what they have been told to believe and things they have never seen or experienced. I've been fortunate enough to experience both sides so my opinion is normally more diverse than most people I encounter.

I have military family members that support Kaepernick and those who kneel because they fought for his right to take his stance. Trying to keep those who are ready to take a stance against important issues takes away everything those who served have fought for.

[prab]

The real issue is...as always... being buried.

What is the real issue here and how does that real issue relate to high school football?

[NewEra1005]

What is the real issue here and how does that real issue relate to high school football?

The real issue is that this man has the right to show his support when ever and where ever he wants.  It doesn't have to relate to football for him to make that support public. If he made a choice not to stand then its his choice where ever he decides.

[TxSkyBolt]

The real issue is that this man has the right to show his support when ever and where ever he wants.  It doesn't have to relate to football for him to make that support public. If he made a choice not to stand then its his choice where ever he decides.

And its my choice to scratch him.


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[prab]

And its my choice to scratch him.


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10-4

[NewEra1005]

And its my choice to scratch him.


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Indeed it is your choice to try and stifle that mans standpoint. The people with the power have done so for centuries.

[AlUpstateNY]

The real issue is...as always... being buried.  I've been fortunate enough to experience both sides so my opinion is normally more diverse than most people I encounter.

Not exactly, NewEra1005, perhaps "the real issue" is YOU are just not listening.  As an American, we each have a right to form, and shape, our own opinion, but we DO NOT have any special right to shove that opinion down anyone else's throat, simply because we've decided it should be so. 

Let's not forget (totally) this whole "issue" has been proven to be a bogus exaggeration, created by those interested a lot more in anarchy than altruism.  When someone chooses to drag an icon of the ideal that America hopes to someday achieve, through imaginary mud, for the sake of garnering attention and shock value, they reach beyond their right to obscure the inadequacy of their message .

YOU simply don't get to decide what anyone else holds in highest regard.  By choosing to kneel during the National Anthem, this fool decided to seriously DISRESPECT a symbol others consider "special" and worthy of utmost, well earned, respect.  He did it to call attention to HIMSELF at the expense of something he clearly does not understand, appreciate or respect.  Doing so is far more the behavior of the ignorant and self important, than "the powerful".

YOUR OPINION is nothing more than "Your Opinion", and you have absolutely no idea whether it is more, or less diverse, important or accurate than the opinion of anyone else, unless they have specifically told you so.  You, and this fool, are simply WAY out in front of your headlights if you believe you have some intrinsic right, or mission, to challenge and disrespect whatever, whomever, has themselves decided is worthy of their personal special respect.

[scrounge]

Indeed it is your choice to try and stifle that mans standpoint. The people with the power have done so for centuries.

And this is where you lose me. No one's stifling anything...you're confusing the right to do something with the entitlement of having a certain platform to do it. I think it's entirely inappropriate for an official, who by the very nature of the position has agreed to being neutral and administrative, to make this statement in the capacity of being an official. As a player? I'm totally fine with it...I have no problem with Kapernick. I'm a veteran and it's his flag too. But yes, I think it's a much different context and obligation as an official vs. player or coach.

[NewEra1005]

And this is where you lose me. No one's stifling anything...you're confusing the right to do something with the entitlement of having a certain platform to do it. I think it's entirely inappropriate for an official, who by the very nature of the position has agreed to being neutral and administrative, to make this statement in the capacity of being an official. As a player? I'm totally fine with it...I have no problem with Kapernick. I'm a veteran and it's his flag too. But yes, I think it's a much different context and obligation as an official vs. player or coach.

I agree that his choice is very extreme. I just don't think we are right to judge his stance without knowing why he choose to do so. Many are speculating its because he wants attention. I  disagree. People want to start a conversation to open peoples minds.

[ALStripes17]

I agree that his choice is very extreme. I just don't think we are right to judge his stance without knowing why he choose to do so. Many are speculating its because he wants attention. I  disagree. People want to start a conversation to open peoples minds.

I find this back and forth to be quite informational, and slightly entertaining.

However, a point was brought up earlier regarding the perception of kneeling when you have two teams, each of their own distinct majority.

Although I am not a fan of making any distinction whatsoever when it comes to race, nearly all individuals involved in this discussion and in the stands/sidelines on Friday night do.

How do you view this situation as a game official when a predominantly white team now feels they have a game official with a bias viewpoint?

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[NewEra1005]

I find this back and forth to be quite informational, and slightly entertaining.

However, a point was brought up earlier regarding the perception of kneeling when you have two teams, each of their own distinct majority.

Although I am not a fan of making any distinction whatsoever when it comes to race, nearly all individuals involved in this discussion and in the stands/sidelines on Friday night do.

How do you view this situation as a game official when a predominantly white team now feels they have a game official with a bias viewpoint?

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I think most of the kids are more hip to what's really going on then some of use that are up their in age. Somewhere around 780 people have lost their lives in police violence this year alone and not all of them have been black or brown people. So to me this issue goes far and beyond blacks lives matter.

But to try and answer your question, I think if I made the choice to kneel, then yes, I might be bringing in the possibly to be viewed as bias. When you take a stand you would always expect opposition and your reputation would have to precede it I guess. It has nothing to do with what's going on the field. It's about the anthem.

Some believe that whenever the anthem is played they will show their support for those lost. I personally try to carry myself in a professional way and educate young students on how to stay out of trouble and be better examples for the world to see. That is how I've chosen to do my part in this matter as well as standing up for those who have made different choices in making a difference.

[scrounge]

I agree that his choice is very extreme. I just don't think we are right to judge his stance without knowing why he choose to do so. Many are speculating its because he wants attention. I  disagree. People want to start a conversation to open peoples minds.

That's fine...but completely irrelevant to the point as I see it, again within the context of being an official. It doesn't really much matter to me what his motivations are for doing so, I think it is wholly inappropriate for someone who has agreed to be a fair and neutral official to do anything that could imply bias or draw attention to themselves, regardless of position. I think it would be the same if the official made an ostentatious show of supporting police or wearing an 'All Lives Matter' button or something. If you have agreed to be neutral...then be neutral. In all respects.

NONE of this has any commentary or judgment on the issue driving it or motivations. He has the right to protest - he has no right or entitlement to be an official. Don't confuse the two.

[ALStripes17]

But to try and answer your question, I think if I made the choice to kneel, then yes, I might be bringing in the possibly to be viewed as bias.

This is the issue that is at hand as an official. We can support coaches, players, causes, etc - but we have a responsibility to do it in a way that will not be viewed as bias.

We are a crew and always viewed as such. The action of one can and will define the entirety. I will support a brother without question; however, those lines begin to blur (and could even be deemed as selfish) when an action by said brother puts the entire crew's perceived impartiality in question.

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[Rulesman]

I've left this thread open for a reason. But I will not tolerate name calling and personal attacks by anyone on anyone else.  You know who you are. If you don't, I have a zap button that will put and end to the thread and your right to post on this board. Take the hint. Play by the rules. I will only say it once.

[Eastshire]

I agree that his choice is very extreme. I just don't think we are right to judge his stance without knowing why he choose to do so. Many are speculating its because he wants attention. I  disagree. People want to start a conversation to open peoples minds.

Let me be clear. I think his motives are pure as the driven snow. That doesn't mean it's appropriate.

And what does it matter why he chose to do it? It's just as inappropriate if done on a lark as it is if it is done with deep contemplation.

As to starting a conversation, let me take a moment to address the tactics of the kneelers. If what you want to do is start a conversation, the best tactic is not, in fact, doing something that is perceived by the person who you want to start the conversation with as spitting in his face. So, yes, Kaepernik et al have started a conversation, but, unfortunately, it's only about the appropriateness of kneeling during the anthem. The conversation they wanted to start, how we can reduce fatal encounters with police by black men, has gotten lost in the noise created by their ill-advised tactic. Which is a shame, because it really is a conversation we should be having.

Which of course leaves me doubly frustrated with this official. One because he's being political at the wrong time and two because he is, in my view, detracting from the point he's trying to advance.