S-B Quiz 2023-05

[ElvisLives]

S-B Quiz 2023-05

1. 3/5 @ B-20, 4Q. A11 carries to the B-14 where he is injured when tackled inbounds by B79. When stopped, the clock reads 0:05, and Team A has no time outs remaining.
RULING:
A, 1/10, B-14, ready (no play clock).
There is no opportunity for a 10-second subtraction because the game clock was stopped due to the award of a new series to Team A. When A11 is off the field, play will continue, and the game clock will start on the referee’s signal.
 
2. 3/3 @ B-40. A44 runs for a first down inbounds at the B-30 with 1:25 on the game clock in the 4th quarter. The Center Judge has placed the ball on the ground at the B-30. The referee waves the Center Judge away from the ball, but before he signals the ball ready for play, snapper A55 snaps the ball.
RULING:
A, 1/10, B-35, ready (25).
A55 commits an illegal snap foul for attempting to snap the ball before it is ready for play. The 5-yard penalty is enforced before the line-to-gain is established, since the foul occurred between series’, resulting in 1/10 for Team A at the B-35.

3. 3/10 @ B-17. Late in the 1st quarter, ball carrier A22 is tackled hard by B54 at the B-5, resulting in first and goal. After the ball is dead, A22 gets up and punches B54 multiple times.
RULING:
A, 1/10, B-20, ready (25), A22 is ejected.
Does this really need an explanation?

4. 3/10 @ B-17. Late in the 3rd quarter, ball carrier A22 is tackled hard by B54 at the B-5, resulting in first and goal. After the ball is dead, A22 gets up and punches B54 multiple times.
RULING:
A, 1/10, B-20, ready (25), A22 is ejected.
Does this really need an explanation?
The difference between 3 and 4 is only the duration of the disqualification. In 3, he is out for the remained of the game. In 4, he is out for the remainder of the second half, plus the first half of the next game. But, we don’t care. The assigning agencies become responsible for implementing the penalties.

5. 4/10 @ B-40. B31 catches A7's punt at the B-4 and his momentum carries him into B's end zone. He runs around in the end zone, then fumbles with B26 recovering the loose ball while grounded at the B-4. During B31's run, B18 blocked A81 in the back at the B-8.
RULING:
B, free kick, B-20, free kick timing (25).
Safety (10-2-2-2-b). This is not “momentum,” since B26 recovered the ball in the field of play. The goal line is the Basic Spot, and the penalty for B18’s BIB leaves the ball in the end zone.

6. 2/10 @ B-25. A7's pass is intercepted by B49 deep in B's end zone. While still in the end zone, A81 twists B49's face mask, causing him to fumble. The loose ball is recovered by A86 while grounded at the B-5.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-15, snap (25).
This is not “momentum,” since the ball was recovered in the field of play. The goal line is the Basic Spot, and the 15-yard penalty for A81’s FMM leaves the ball at the B-15, 1/10. The penalty awards the ball to Team B at that spot.
 
7. Free Kick @ A-35. Team A is offside, and the kickoff goes out of bounds at the B-20 after it has been touched by B80 at the B-25.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-25, snap (25) OR
A, kickoff, A-30, free kick timing (25).
No foul for an illegal kick out of bounds, since the ball was touched by B before going OB. Team B can accept the 5-yard penalty for the OFK at the dead-ball spot, taking the ball to the B-25, 1/10, OR they can have the penalty enforced at the previous spot and have Team A repeat the kickoff at the A-30.

8. 4/10 @ 50. During A90’s scrimmage kick the untouched ball is almost at rest at the B-3 when B22 blocks A80 into the ball, forcing the ball into the end zone where it touches the ground.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-20, snap (25).
The touching of the ball by A80 is ignored, since it was “forced touching” caused by B22’s blocking of A80 into the ball. Thus, the legally kicked ball is deemed to have been untouched when it touched the ground in the end zone, resulting in a touchback, 1/10 for Team B at the B-20.

[Stinterp]

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[ElvisLives]

No. 2
The entire book needs a serious scrubbing. At the applicable rules, 4-1-4 and 7-1-1-b, the penalty statements tell us that the official's signal for an illegal snap is S7 ("dead ball") and S19 ("illegal procedure'). In the first place, at direction from the NCAA/CFO, we stopped using S7 for pre-snap fouls, so S7 should be dropped from the 7-1-1-b penalty statement. Then the penalty statements tell us that the appropriate foul signal is S19 ("illegal procedure"), NOT delay of game. However, the Summary of Penalties lists S21 ("delay of game") as the appropriate signal. Also, AR 4-1-4-I indicates that this is a "delay of game" foul. OK, make up your minds. Pick one, and make all of the others match. (This ain't the only case of this kind of conflict within the book; the NCAA would be well served to have a small team of folks, knowledgeable in the rules and the English language, thoroughly vett and scrub the entire book, and get these conflicts and ambiguities cleaned up.)

No. 5
The rule reference is correct - 10-2-2-d-2-b. But that rule clearly states that the Basic Spot is the Goal Line - not the end of the related run - when the COP occurs in the FOP, and the related run ends in the EZ (as it did, in this case). The result is the same, I grant you. But, let's be accurate. The Basic Spot is the Goal Line. Per 3 & 1, the enforcement spot for the 10-yard penalty for the BIB foul by the defending team that occurred beyond the Basic Spot is the Basic Spot. The penalty for that foul - enforced from the Basic Spot (goal line) would leave the ball in the defending team's end zone, resulting in a safety.
Understanding the difference is important. If we accepted the statement that the Basic Spot was the end of the related run, then fouls by the attacking team would be enforced from the end of that run - somewhere in the end zone. And that is clearly incorrect. Please don't ever let that happen.

[Covid 22]

While the accuracy of the written rule is important, it isn't necessary for every word or phrase to be debated.   Translating interconnecting rules so that they flow seamlessly must be a tedious and thankless job.

Elvis, in your discussion of question #2, you tie the Referee's signal completion to S19 (illegal procedure).  To my best recollection (and I downloaded the 2023 NCAA Football Rulebook) there is no such thing as Illegal Procedure as a foul or a signal. 

Debating these nuances is great reading on a message board.   That's why I come back every day.

[ElvisLives]

While the accuracy of the written rule is important, it isn't necessary for every word or phrase to be debated.   Translating interconnecting rules so that they flow seamlessly must be a tedious and thankless job.
In my business, if I don't get the words right, I end up having to pay to change or correct something. Do that enough times, and you learn to be accurate with every statement you make. IMHO, this is very similar, although it may not hit folks in the pocketbook like failing to specify the correct accessories for a ceiling system. I can't help but think back to the John Adams days. He had a way of using the fewest words to completely cover a rule. And then he would thoroughly vett the entire book to make sure that any rule change fully coordinated with other rules, and the ARs. "Tedious and thankless?" Yeah, probably so. But that's the nature of the job. And every rules editor knows that before he accepts the job. But, help is available, if he/they want it. Like I said, a small team of folks knowledgeable in the rules, the book, and the English language could get this cleaned up in 6 months or less. They just have to have the will. And some of those folks might lend their time at no cost. They just have to ask.

Elvis, in your discussion of question #2, you tie the Referee's signal completion to S19 (illegal procedure).  To my best recollection (and I downloaded the 2023 NCAA Football Rulebook) there is no such thing as Illegal Procedure as a foul or a signal.
Guilty. You are correct, and I need to remove that terminology from my football word bank. Those of us that witnessed folks like Donny Anderson play have that expression ingrained in our brains, although we don't use it with announcements, etc. I don't have my older rule books with me here at the office, but I 'think' that signal may have been labeled such "in the old days," which may be why it is so entrenched in my gray matter. I will check when I get home. That may be the reason, but it isn't an excuse. We get better every day that we try. And I am still trying.  

Debating these nuances is great reading on a message board.   That's why I come back every day.

[JasonTX]

I remember a time when there were editorial changes and bulletins made based on discussions that we had right here on this forum.  Somebody was apparently watching while we dissected rules.

[Covid 22]

If I am not mistaken, the older rulebooks showed S19 with the current fouls but the bottom line in () said Illegal Procedure - NFHS only.

[ElvisLives]

If I am not mistaken, the older rulebooks showed S19 with the current fouls but the bottom line in () said Illegal Procedure - NFHS only.

Yeah, probably. But that was when the NCAA and NFHS started sharing signals illustrations. (I go back to well before then.) Methinks before that, it may have been the description for the signal in the NCAA book, as well. I shall investigate upon my return to my humble abode this earthly evening. (Sorry. I get carried away from time to time.)

[ElvisLives]

If I am not mistaken, the older rulebooks showed S19 with the current fouls but the bottom line in () said Illegal Procedure - NFHS only.

Between 1972 and 1994 the signal was described as “Illegal Procedure / False Start / Illegal Formation / Encroachment Offense (NCAA)”. In 1995, it was changed to say “Illegal Procedure (NF) / False Start / Illegal Formation / Encroachment Offense (NCAA)”. So, at least during my career, we had 23 seasons of “illegal procedure” indoctrination. Those days ended 29 seasons ago, so I should know better than to use the “i.p” terminology. Moving forward.

And it looks like the NCAA stopped publishing officials signals in the rule book as being 'shared' with the NF in 2013.