Author Topic: S-B Quiz 2022-02  (Read 1724 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ElvisLives

  • *
  • Posts: 3446
  • FAN REACTION: +161/-143
  • The rules are there if you need them.
S-B Quiz 2022-02
« on: September 09, 2022, 02:11:40 PM »
I think I slowed down a bit for this one.

1.Free Kick @ A-35. A90’s kickoff is high and deep and B21 signals for a fair catch. B44 who is positioned next to B21 catches the kick at the B-1 and the ball is declared dead at that point.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-1, snap (40 and running).
For a catch made between the B-25 and B’s goal line, the ball is placed at the B-25 following the catch after a signal (valid or invalid) is given and the signaling player made the signal. When a non-signaling player makes the catch, the ball is dead and belongs to B at that spot.

2. Free Kick @ A-35. A90’s kickoff is high and deep and B21 signals for a fair catch. B44 who is positioned next to B21 catches the kick one yard deep in the endzone and the ball is declared dead at that point.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-25, snap (40 and running).
After any player gives a signal (valid or invalid), and ANY player catches the ball in B’s end zone, the ball is dead behind B’s goal line and Team A is responsible for the ball being there. That results in a touchback, and Team B is awarded a series at the B-25.


3. 4/10 @ A-45. A90 punts and A88 first touches the ball at the B-10, and the loose ball is scooped up by B44 at the B-8. B44 returns the ball to the B-20 where he is hit and fumbles, and A80 recovers at the B-18 and is down.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-10, snap (25).
Illegal touching by A88, which gives Team B the privilege of taking possession of the ball at the spot of illegal touching.


4. 4/10 @ A-45. A90 punts and A88 first touches the ball at the B-10, and the loose ball is scooped up by B44 at the B-8. B44 returns the ball to the B-20 where he is hit and fumbles and A20 picks up the fumble at the B-20 and scores a Touchdown. During A20’s run, B70 holds at the B-15.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-10, snap (25).
No score. Because 5 and 10-yard penalties are not administered on the try or succeeding kickoff, by rule, the penalty is declined by rule (because there is no enforcement spot). Since the penalty is declined, the Illegal touching privilege is restored, and Team B will invoke that privilege and take possession of the ball at the spot of illegal touching.


5.   4/10 @ A-45. A90 punts and A88 first touches the ball at the B-10, and the loose ball is scooped up by B44 at the B-8. B44 returns the ball to the B-20 where he is hit and fumbles, and B70 holds at the B-12 during B44’s run. A20 picks up the fumble at the B-20 and scores a Touchdown.
RULING:
B, 1/10, B-6, snap (25).
No score. Since B70’s hold occurred during B44’s run (before Team A gained possession and scored), there is an enforcement spot available (the end of B44’s run). Since Team B will invoke the illegal touching privilege if Team A declines the penalty for the holding foul (thus, taking possession at the B-10), Team A will accept the penalty, which will be enforced ½  the distance from the spot of the foul (B-12), taking the ball to the B-6, where Team B is awarded a series.

6. 4/10 @ B-30. Team A lines up to attempt a long field goal, and A90’s kick is long enough but is wide to the left. B21 holds A80 at the B-16 during the kick.
RULING:
A, 1/10, B-20, snap (25).
The basic spot for fouls during a kick down is the previous spot (unless a field goal attempt is successful). All defensive holding fouls carry an automatic first down, so, even if the distance penalty did not yield a first down, Team A would be awarded a first down by penalty.

Correction. PSK applies. The PSK spot is the previous spot, and the foul is behind the PSK spot, so the penalty is enforced from the spot of the foul (B-16), taking the ball to the B-8, where team B is awarded a series.

7. Try @ B-3. A90’s kick try is successful and B-77 lined up in the neutral zone. After the ball is dead, B21 commits a personal foul.
RULING:
A, free kick, 50, free kick timing (25), OR A, try B ¾ yard line, no clock (25).
Team A’s 1-point field goal is successful and counts, and Team A declines the penalty for the offside foul. The penalty for the UNR is enforced at the succeeding kickoff; OR Team A may accept the ½ the distance penalty for the offside foul, and will then accept the ½ the distance penalty for the UNR foul, taking the ball to the B-3/4 yard line, and repeat the try. Team A would most likely elect the first option.

8. 4/12 @ A-1. A90 punts the ball from his own endzone. B44 receives the punt at the A-40 and returns to the A-30 where he is downed. A23 blocks B35 below the waist in Team A’s end zone during the return.
RULING:
B, 1/10, A-15, snap (25).
The basic spot for the illegal BBW foul is the end of the related run (A-30), and will be enforced from that spot, taking the ball to the A-15, where team B will be awarded a series.

« Last Edit: September 10, 2022, 08:33:37 AM by ElvisLives »

Offline TxBJ

  • *
  • Posts: 390
  • FAN REACTION: +9/-6
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2022, 02:46:00 PM »
Isn't #6 governed by PSK enforcement?  I have 1/10 for B at the B-8 (PSK spot is the B-30, foul behind the PSK spot).  Since it is PSK enforcement, there is no replay for Team A.

Offline ElvisLives

  • *
  • Posts: 3446
  • FAN REACTION: +161/-143
  • The rules are there if you need them.
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2022, 08:20:50 AM »
Isn't #6 governed by PSK enforcement?  I have 1/10 for B at the B-8 (PSK spot is the B-30, foul behind the PSK spot).  Since it is PSK enforcement, there is no replay for Team A.

Yeah. Just messed that up. In 47 seasons, never actually had a foul by B during the kick during an unsuccessful FG attempt. Offside, yes. But no holding, etc. Live and learn. Thanks.

Offline Dbronx

  • *
  • Posts: 2
  • FAN REACTION: +0/-0
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2022, 06:12:17 PM »
For questions 3-5, what happens if B fouls during A’s run (after the turnover), but A does not score? This rule has always been tough for me.

Offline ilyazhito

  • *
  • Posts: 366
  • FAN REACTION: +11/-13
  • Without officials... it is only recess.
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2022, 08:04:29 AM »
Isn't #6 governed by PSK enforcement?  I have 1/10 for B at the B-8 (PSK spot is the B-30, foul behind the PSK spot).  Since it is PSK enforcement, there is no replay for Team A.
Why is it PSK? The approved ruling for a similar situation, where B pulls and shoots on a field goal attempt, is a 10-yard penalty with an automatic first down. Is this a timing issue (before the ball is kicked = previous spot), after kick = PSK)?

Offline ElvisLives

  • *
  • Posts: 3446
  • FAN REACTION: +161/-143
  • The rules are there if you need them.
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2022, 08:44:16 AM »
Why is it PSK? The approved ruling for a similar situation, where B pulls and shoots on a field goal attempt, is a 10-yard penalty with an automatic first down. Is this a timing issue (before the ball is kicked = previous spot), after kick = PSK)?

Exactly. Fouls before the kick are previous spot, 3 & 1 enforcement. By rule, fouls during the kick are treated as though they happened after the ball is caught/recovered by B, or the ball becomes dead without player possession.
In the case of Question 6, the field goal attempt is unsuccessful, and, by rule, the artificial "end of the kick" (PSK spot) is the previous spot.
Direction from Shaw and coordinators is to treat fouls against "flyers" as happening during the kick, even if they, technically, happened before the ball is actually kicked, as long as the ball is routinely kicked after the snap.
But, a pull and shoot by Team B right after the snap is a previous spot enforcement.

Offline Stinterp

  • *
  • Posts: 188
  • FAN REACTION: +4/-16
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2022, 09:43:05 AM »
A 4/10 from the A-40,  gunner A30 is contacted at the line of scrimmage (no flag for the contact), before the kick is made,  his helmet comes off 2 yards beyond the LOS, and he continues downfield to make a tackle (flagged for ill participation).  PSK or previous spot?

Also in NCAA is it a foul for a player to block/contact an opponent who is not wearing a helmet?  if so, what rule.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2022, 09:50:00 AM by Stinterp »

Offline TxBJ

  • *
  • Posts: 390
  • FAN REACTION: +9/-6
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2022, 10:13:44 AM »
PSK only applies to Team B fouls.  But you could just as easily ask the scenario where the Team B player blocking the gunner has his helmet come off and continues to participate.  This would be PSK.  The rules makers don't want Team A keeping possession due to fouls that happen after they have "given up" the ball by punting.  As Elvis stated, they include fouls committed against the gunner, even if it happened very quickly and was before the kick.

Offline ElvisLives

  • *
  • Posts: 3446
  • FAN REACTION: +161/-143
  • The rules are there if you need them.
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2022, 11:12:06 AM »
A 4/10 from the A-40,  gunner A30 is contacted at the line of scrimmage (no flag for the contact), before the kick is made,  his helmet comes off 2 yards beyond the LOS, and he continues downfield to make a tackle (flagged for ill participation).  PSK or previous spot?

Also in NCAA is it a foul for a player to block/contact an opponent who is not wearing a helmet?  if so, what rule.

FYI, in NCAA rules, there is no such thing as "illegal participation." Too many players on the field = illegal substitution. Continued participation without a helmet is a personal foul, and would be announced as, "Personal foul, continued participation without a helmet,..."
A player that goes/is OB voluntarily and returns into the field of play/end zones commits a foul for an "illegal return." He is not restricted in what he does when he comes back inbounds, any more or less than any other player. He has simply committed a foul by coming back inbounds.

As for a player without a helmet, there is no prohibition regarding legally blocking such a player who is continuing to participate. He is simply at his own risk. If he has ceased to participate, then he A player without a helmet is treated as an "opponent out of the play," and would be protected by 9-1-12-b.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2022, 01:00:52 PM by ElvisLives »

Offline Legacy Zebra

  • *
  • Posts: 960
  • FAN REACTION: +53/-9
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2022, 11:36:06 AM »
I disagree. A player without a helmet is out of the play by definition whether he continues to participate or not. 3-3-9-c. Blocking an opponent without a helmet is also a personal foul.

Offline ElvisLives

  • *
  • Posts: 3446
  • FAN REACTION: +161/-143
  • The rules are there if you need them.
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2022, 12:58:21 PM »
I disagree. A player without a helmet is out of the play by definition whether he continues to participate or not. 3-3-9-c. Blocking an opponent without a helmet is also a personal foul.

Not a question of disagreement; rather a question of being right, which you are! I know I'd seen that language before, but have yet to have this happen (a player without helmet getting blocked). So, not at the forefront on my mind. Now it is.
Thank you.

Offline Stinterp

  • *
  • Posts: 188
  • FAN REACTION: +4/-16
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2022, 01:24:38 PM »
Let's change my original play to B30's helmet is off and he continues downfield to block?  The question is this PSK or previous? 
The helmet came off BEFORE the kick took place. It was a rugby style kicker and he delayed in kicking the ball.

Online dammitbobby

  • *
  • Posts: 1189
  • FAN REACTION: +27/-8
  • I know just enough to be dangerous...
Re: S-B Quiz 2022-02
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2022, 01:29:51 PM »
The foul isn't when the helmet came off, it's when he continues to participate.  I'm going to rule that this should be PSK, because I don't see how, even with a little running around, that it could be before the kick - unless it's immediate and I can clearly tell. 

I think specific scenario is trying to split a very technical hair.