Safety on try

[SCHSref]

So, can A get a safety on a try?

A1 takes the hand to hand snap from the center.  He puts the ball in the gut of A2 and pulls it back out when he sees the end crash in on the back.  As he is running around the left side of the line, B2 meets him rather abruptly and jars the ball loose and out of A1's hands.  The ball comes to a rest on the 1 and B3 attempts to pick it up but as he tries,  the ball squirts backwards into the endzone.  B4 jumps on the ball.  The LJ slaps his hands together in a triangle shape. 

What say you?

[Atlanta Blue]

One point for A.

[bbeagle]

We had this exact same thing in a game last year. The score was 36-0 late in the 4th quarter in a pop warner 14 year olds game. We discussed it and just called it a failed try instead of spending all this time talking to coaches and having them think we're idiots.

On a varsity game, or in a close game, we'd have to give the offense 1 point.

When we saw this play, it seems like it would happen more often. Running back rolls out to one side, fumbles, ball is not really moving any direction, defense in attempting to recover ball squirts it back into their own end zone where they fall on it.

[bkdow]

Is "squirts" new force or a muff?

[bkdow]

Rule: 8-3-3

ART. 3 . . . During a try, A may score two points from what would be a touchdown or one point for a field goal or safety by B under rules governing play at other times during the game. Only A may score during a try.

[wvoref]

If you rule B forced the ball into the endzone it's basically going to be one or two points for A. The only way B can get the ball out of their endzone on a try would be to successfully "muff" the ball back into the field of play because as soon as they recover it the ball is dead by rule. Have always wanted the rule changed to the ball becomes dead on a try when B possesses the ball in the field of play. That way they would at least be afforded the chance to recover the ball and advance it out of their endzone to avoid the one point safety.

[bkdow]

It's going to need to be extremely obvious that B provided new force.

[Ralph Damren]

It's going to need to be extremely obvious that B provided new force.

Agreed, IMHO, only if the ball was bouncing away from B's EZ or laying still.

[wvoref]

Agree. We always instructed that if even the tiniest doubt it was NOT a new force.

[Atlanta Blue]

It's going to need to be extremely obvious that B provided new force.

Agreed, but look at the original post.  The ball was AT REST at the 1, and in attempting to pick it up, B "squirted" it into the EZ.  I think it's pretty clear SCHSRef was trying to write a scenario where B clearly applied the force that put the ball in the EZ without coming right out and saying so.

If that's the case, this is a one point safety.  Yes, A put the ball on the ground.  But B "erred" by trying to pick it up and failed to do so.  B had no reason to pick it up.  Falling on it would have ended the try.  If B is trying to make a dumb play and gets themselves in trouble, don't bail them out.

[SCHSref]

Agreed, but look at the original post.  The ball was AT REST at the 1, and in attempting to pick it up, B "squirted" it into the EZ.  I think it's pretty clear SCHSRef was trying to write a scenario where B clearly applied the force that put the ball in the EZ without coming right out and saying so.

If that's the case, this is a one point safety.  Yes, A put the ball on the ground.  But B "erred" by trying to pick it up and failed to do so.  B had no reason to pick it up.  Falling on it would have ended the try.  If B is trying to make a dumb play and gets themselves in trouble, don't bail them out.

Correct.  It has to be ruled a new force by the covering official.