This wild, wacky kicking game of ours.....

[Ralph Damren]

My Friday night game had the following zany situation : (1) 4th & 8 @ 50; (2) R rushes 10 in a block attempt ; (3) punter, under huge pressure, punts the ball STRAIGHT up ; (4) several R players yell, "clear,clear" telling their teammates to stay away from the ball; (5) ball takes a couple of bounces and is scooped up by a big ole' Bubba lineman; (6) Bubba looked back at me - the WH; (7) I was holding my whistle, wide-eyed , and considered humming "Mr. Touchdown" ; (8) one of Bubba's teammates yells, "run and see what happens"; (9) Bubba does; (10) several R players look at me and see that I begin to follow Bubba; (11) they,too, begin to chase Bubba; (12) they catch him and bring him down at R's 30. R's coach TOed and inquired ,"can he do that ?" I responed to him and the frenzed masses :  "If the kick is recovered behind the LOS, it's just like a fumble and can be advanced by either team". He seemed to understand as he scolded his players about just standing around. Question of the day : My statement of "...just like a fumble .." isn't fully true. What is the difference between a recovered punt behind the LOS & a fumble?.....

[VALJ]

Well, for one, if the punt is jointly recovered behind the line of scrimmage, the ball belongs to R, while a fumble jointly recovered behind the LOS belongs to K.

[SCHSref]

If K recovered it behind the line, they could kick again, pass, or run it.

[Ralph Damren]

VALAC wins the . Joint possession would be treated differently. Another kicking game challanger occurred locally, but not in my game. Try this : (1) Opening kickoff is muffed by R1 on R's 10; (2) Ball bounces back to R's 3 where R2 scoops it up and stumbles back into his end zone and falls down. MO' rule...or not ?....

[Atlanta Blue]

VALAC wins the . Joint possession would be treated differently. Another kicking game challanger occurred locally, but not in my game. Try this : (1) Opening kickoff is muffed by R1 on R's 10; (2) Ball bounces back to R's 3 where R2 scoops it up and stumbles back into his end zone and falls down. MO' rule...or not ?....

A kick is a kick until it's not a kick.  R2 scooped up a kick inside the 5.  It's up to the official to decide if it was his momentum that took him backwards.  Sounds like it probably was, so this is a touchback.

Although I wonder, "When does clumsiness stop being momentum?"

[maven]

The momentum exception applies to any kick caught or recovered inside the 5 where R's momentum takes him into the EZ.

Since R1 muffed but never possessed the kick, it is still a kick when R2 recovers it

Since R2's momentum took him into the EZ, where the ball became dead, the momentum exception applies.

R 1/10 @ R3, clock on the snap.

A good BJ has a bag on the R3.

[Ralph Damren]

Good points AB & M. The MO' rule would apply if he has possession of the ball as he stumbled, staggered,wobbled or whatever into the endzone. Note the difference between fumble & muff. If R-1 had possession and fumbled followed by R-2 recovering and carrying the ball into EZ, the MO' rule wouldn't apply as it has to be fumble by OPPONENTS.

[maven]

...the MO' rule wouldn't apply as it has to be fumble by OPPONENTS.

A useful reminder. Thanks!

[bama_stripes]

A good BJ  R has a bag on the R3.

FIFY (it was on a KO)

[VALJ]

Well, for one, if the punt is jointly recovered behind the line of scrimmage, the ball belongs to R, while a fumble jointly recovered behind the LOS belongs to K.

I thought of another one - if a blocked kick goes out of bounds, the ball goes over to R, while if a fumble goes OOB possession remains with A (who, if the play was a 4th down play, will then turn the ball over on downs).

[maven]

I thought of another one - if a blocked kick goes out of bounds, the ball goes over to R, while if a fumble goes OOB possession remains with A (who, if the play was a 4th down play, will then turn the ball over on downs).

I thought of that one too, but the question asked about a kick recovered behind the NZ. If it's recovered, then it's not going OOB; and if it subsequently goes out of bounds, it's not a kick.

[SanDiegoStryker]

It's up to the official to decide if it was his momentum that took him backwards.  Sounds like it probably was, so this is a touchback.

No. If you are ruling there was a momentum exception the result can never be a touchback.

[maven]

Although I wonder, "When does clumsiness stop being momentum?"

When he muffs the kick into the EZ, or he gains possession and allows any part of his body other than hand or foot to touch the ground prior to the ball going into the EZ.

[Atlanta Blue]

No. If you are ruling there was a momentum exception the result can never be a touchback.

You are correct, my fingers were faster than my brain!

Why did it take two days for someone to correct my obvious error!?!?!  Come on, you guys are better than that!

[VALJ]

Why did it take two days for someone to correct my obvious error!?!?!  Come on, you guys are better than that!

I was still looking for more ways that a punt recovered behind the LOS differs from a fumble, myself..     

[Rulesman]

You are correct, my fingers were faster than my brain!

Why did it take two days for someone to correct my obvious error!?!?!  Come on, you guys are better than that!

We've been lulled to sleep in thinking coaches know all the rules?

Hey..... couldn't resist.