Loss of down penalty beyond line to gain

[#92]

Late 4th Q; score is A0-B6; A: 3/10 B-40. A12 advances the ball to B-10 where he throws a backward pass out of bounds to conserve time, which crosses the sideline at B-11.
Penalty: 5 yards from the spot of the foul; also loss of down if by Team A before team possession changes during a scrimmage down.

What with the loss of down? Is the succeeding play then A: 2/10 B-15? Or does the loss of down not apply between series, so it's A: 1/10 B-15?

And is it a 40 or 25 seconds play clock? I suppose 40, since the game clock stopped for the ball out of bounds, which isn't included in Rule 3-2-4-c?

Game clock starts on the ready, regardless of whether there are 2 minutes, or less, or more on the clock, because of Rule 3-4-3. Correct?

[NVFOA_Ump]

What with the loss of down? Is the succeeding play then A: 2/10 B-15? Or does the loss of down not apply between series, so it's A: 1/10 B-15?

Loss of down in full is "Loss of the right to repeat the down", so here, since after the penalty is enforced the ball is still beyond the line to gain we have a 1st and 10 at the spot where the penalty enforcement leaves the ball, the 15.  The loss of down component in the penalty statement is ignored if the penalty enforcement leaves the ball beyond the line to gain.

And is it a 40 or 25 seconds play clock? I suppose 40, since the game clock stopped for the ball out of bounds, which isn't included in Rule 3-2-4-c?

The clock also stopped to enforce a penalty here so the play clock would be set at 25 seconds.

Game clock starts on the ready, regardless of whether there are 2 minutes, or less, or more on the clock, because of Rule 3-4-3. Correct?

Correct, the game clock will start on the ready after penalty enforcement.

[BlindZebra]

Given the verbiage of the question, I'm assuming that there is a 10 second runoff in effect.  Course we don't know, but let's say the score is tied and B elects to decline the runoff, are we still starting the clock on the ready?

[bossman72]

What with the loss of down? Is the succeeding play then A: 2/10 B-15? Or does the loss of down not apply between series, so it's A: 1/10 B-15?

And is it a 40 or 25 seconds play clock? I suppose 40, since the game clock stopped for the ball out of bounds, which isn't included in Rule 3-2-4-c?

Game clock starts on the ready, regardless of whether there are 2 minutes, or less, or more on the clock, because of Rule 3-4-3. Correct?

Always replace "Loss of Down" with the phrase "The down counts".  You'll never get confused again!

[NVFOA_Ump]

Given the verbiage of the question, I'm assuming that there is a 10 second runoff in effect.  Course we don't know, but let's say the score is tied and B elects to decline the runoff, are we still starting the clock on the ready?

I'm not a fan of assuming, but if the 10 second runoff is applicable here then no, per 3.4.4.c.   After the penalty is administered, if there is a 10-second runoff, the game clock starts on the referee’s signal. If there is no 10-second runoff, the game clock starts on the snap.

[#92]

Why do they call it "ZAP 10" by the way?

Also, am I correct in interpreting Rule 3-4-4-b as DPI (for instance) not triggering a runoff? Because it itself doesn't stop the clock?

The 10-second rule does not apply if the game clock is not running when the foul occurs or if the foul does not cause the game clock to stop (e.g., illegal formation).

[Magician]

Why do they call it "ZAP 10" by the way?

Also, am I correct in interpreting Rule 3-4-4-b as DPI (for instance) not triggering a runoff? Because it itself doesn't stop the clock?

Correct. The main thing the rule was trying to address was situations where a team could potentially try to stop the clock intentionally to conserve time. A hold or DPI aren't fouls they would commit for that reason. When you understand the why for fouls it helps greatly with the what.

Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

[bossman72]

Why do they call it "ZAP 10" by the way?

Just an abbreviation.  I think Rom Gilbert coined the phrase

[bossman72]

Also, am I correct in interpreting Rule 3-4-4-b as DPI (for instance) not triggering a runoff? Because it itself doesn't stop the clock?

It's not a catch-all, but it's pretty close.  The way I help myself remember if it's a runoff- "If I had to throw my flag to blow my whistle to stop the clock, it's a runoff."

EG:  False Start - The foul caused me to both throw my flag and blow my whistle.  Runoff
EG:  Holding - The foul caused me to throw my flag, but the play ending normally caused me to blow my whistle.  No runoff.
EG:  Intentional grounding - The foul (the incomplete pass) caused me to both throw my flag and blow my whistle.  Runoff

[#92]

Just an abbreviation.  I think Rom Gilbert coined the phrase

Of what? :-)

[Kalle]

Of what? :-)

"Additional penalty option for the offended team to subtract 10 seconds from the game clock"

[#92]

"Additional penalty option for the offended team to subtract 10 seconds from the game clock"

I'm not seeing how that abbreviates to "zap"?

[goodgrr]

Not an abreviation really, other than as short hand to say remove : http://www.thefreedictionary.com/zap

[NVFOA_Ump]

Just an abbreviation.  I think Rom Gilbert coined the phrase

Rom did use the term Zap but it tracks back to the "vintage" Batman and Robin comic books where the superheroes would "Zap!" someone (or something) and it would go away.

[BlindZebra]

I'm not a fan of assuming, but if the 10 second runoff is applicable here then no, per 3.4.4.c.   After the penalty is administered, if there is a 10-second runoff, the game clock starts on the referee’s signal. If there is no 10-second runoff, the game clock starts on the snap.

And I concur!  Just keeping people on their toes during off-season.