Arrested in the Middle of a Game

[neilfish]

Here's the official statement from the GNOFOA

http://www.wwltv.com/news/Football-association-supports-refs-arrested-in-Northshore-game-227758651.html

[Mad Mike]

Does anybody have video from the game that is available?

[Rulesman]

...If the spectators are in the restricted area and the game administration won't help control the situation, then the officials need to refuse to officiate...

I'm being told from what I consider a reliable source close to the LHSAA the officials asked (rather than demand) the cop for help and were told to worry about the game instead of the sidelines. It was at that point they said the game would not continue until game management took care of the problem. That's when the cop decided to throw his weight around after which the situation quickly deteriorated.

[TXMike]

Even the statement from the official's association indicated the official tried to order the officer out of the stadium.    Bad move Exlax

[Rulesman]

Even the statement from the official's association indicated the official tried to order the officer out of the stadium.

I believe that should be taken in the context with which it was written. The statement actually occurred after the cop decided to act like Barney Fife and probably should not have been made. But at that point those who are not going to assist in solving the problem are a part of the problem in and of itself.

[TXMike]

No different than when the coach starts acting the fool.  We can't go off half -cocked and assume an authority we do not possess.  There is no way a high school football official can order a uniformed law enforcement officer ON THE JOB to leave, no matter how crappy a job he may be doing or how much of an arse he may be making of himself

[InsideTheStripes]

Even the statement from the official's association indicated the official tried to order the officer out of the stadium.

I think you're reading into the comment. Radcliffe was still trying to get the unauthorized spectators back and off the field of play. When he included the officer in the group he was still just trying to get them all off the field of play and out of the way.

I don't read anywhere in the statement that indicates the officials were trying to throw anyone out of the stadium, spectator or LEO.

[TXMike]

From their own official statement:  "Radcliffe then told the officer that he needed to leave as well, and that he would go talk with home management. As Radcliffe was beginning to do that, the officer called him back and placed him under arrest."

http://www.wwltv.com/news/local/Football-association-supports-refs-arrested-in-Northshore-game-227758651.html

I am not reading too much into it.

[Mad Mike]

Just because he is a uniformed officer, he does not have license to be in the restricted area anymore than a HC . It seems the referee was walking away to get home game management to take care of the problem the police officer would not (mainly because it was his friends and relatives that were down there). The R did not make it back over to the AD or Game Manager because the officer placed him and LJ under arrest.

Sounds like to me words were probably exchanged, no resolution was taking place and the R, correctly, was going to get game management to handle it. No Ex-lax needed here. I would have done the same thing as these guys did. 

[TXMike]

He was uniformed and ON DUTY.  He can certainly be  outside he sidelines.  If he is in that restricted area IMMEDIATELY off the sideline then you might ask him to step out of that THAT area for both his and your safety.  But other than that, he can be wherever. 

[CenTexTM]

So if a LEO takes up residence in the middle of the field, no official should approach him or say anything to indicate that he should move so that the game can continue?  And if they do say something to the effect of "We need you to move" or "Please stand behind this line so we can play the game" they should be arrested?  LA Rev St 14:122 defines public intimidation as the use of violence, force or threats.  There's no indication that the officials engaged in violence or attempted to use force from what I've read.  As a peace officer, would you say the threat of contacting game management rise to the level of an arrestable offense? 

I have no doubt the officials probably said something stupid or in some other way attempted to exceed their authority and lost the genitalia-sizing contest to the man with the gun.  I'm having a much harder time believing they actually offended against the peace and dignity of the State in a manner to warrant the restriction of their liberty and criminal charges resulting from the arrest.

[FBUmp]

http://www.naso.org/go/pressreleases/013_GNOFOA_email.html

[Rulesman]

The ref's association is weighing in.   Newsflash to them...based on the comments I have seen on this and other officiating forums from experienced officials around the nation, hard to say they did nothing wrong.

It's equally as hard to say they did anything to be arrested, either.

[Rulesman]

Gentlemen, I am only going to say this once.... keep this discussion clean; keep this discussion civil. Those who persist in making their point by attempting to bypass the banned word censor, or with acronyms that don't belong here - should prepare themselves for a charged time out.

[FBUmp]

Sure there is. Why should they be treated any differently than anyone else arrested?  Most jails have an area where people are held temporarily pending an initial appearance with a magistrate/JP/etc.  They are not designed to be permanent housing facilities so do not have beds.  What happens if you have 10 -15 arrestees pending the initial appearance and the cell has only 4 - 5 beds?  Use your imagination. 

Whether it's the norm or not doesn't make it right.  Based on everything else we've heard about the actions of the Covington Police Dept., I doubt very seriously that it wasn't intentional.  It's a crap.

[InsideTheStripes]

From their own official statement:  "Radcliffe then told the officer that he needed to leave as well, and that he would go talk with home management. As Radcliffe was beginning to do that, the officer called him back and placed him under arrest."

I am not reading too much into it.

Edit: After reading AB's comment and the article he mentioned, this post seemed silly.

[RMR]

He was uniformed and ON DUTY.  He can certainly be  outside he sidelines.  If he is in that restricted area IMMEDIATELY off the sideline then you might ask him to step out of that THAT area for both his and your safety.  But other than that, he can be wherever.

Actually, he was not on duty, he was part of the paid security detail.  It's not exactly the same thing.

[Atlanta Blue]

Nowhere in that sentence, or the article for that matter, does anyone imply that Radcliffe told the "LEO" that he needed to leave the stadium.

From a witnes statement in the original article:

"The second referee told the police officer, nose-to-nose with the police officer, 'you're out of the game...get outta here.' "

Sounds like an "ejection" to me.

I think there was plenty of blame on both sides here.  I think what started as a reasonable request turned into a testosterone explosion on both sides, and ultimately, the guy with the badge has the last word that evening.

I'll bet the entire case gets dropped.

[InsideTheStripes]

From a witnes statement in the original article:

"The second referee told the police officer, nose-to-nose with the police officer, 'you're out of the game...get outta here.' "

Sounds like an "ejection" to me.

I'll be the first to admit that I haven't read EVERY article on the subject. If that's the case, I was a poor move on the officials part. 

[Rulesman]

From a witnes statement in the original article:

"The second referee told the police officer, nose-to-nose with the police officer, 'you're out of the game...get outta here.' "

I haven't seen that alleged statement in any subsequent writing, making me wonder about the credibility of the witness and the accuracy of the quote.

[InsideTheStripes]

I haven't seen that alleged statement in any subsequent writing, making me wonder about the credibility of the witness and the accuracy of the quote.

Is going nose-to-nose a physical confrontation?  I ask because the Covington mayor has indicated that their was no physical confrontation:

"Cooper wouldn't go into specific details of his conversations with West and Short about the incident, but said both admitted there was no physical confrontation between the officials and Short. He said Short arrested them "more or less (because of) words and maybe actions. It was a question of authority, and there's probably a gray line there. ... "

http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/2013/10/covington_mayor_mike_cooper_on.html

[Atlanta Blue]

From the Mayor:

" After talking to both sides during the past few days, Cooper said he has learned 'there are three stories: there's their story, there's police officials' story, and somewhere in there is probably the truth.' "

Personally, I don't think anyone is blameless here.  Sounds like egos got involved on both sides, and there was no graceful way for anyone to back down.

In writing that last sentence, I realized I also described our current situation in Washington!

[InsideTheStripes]

Cooper said the police investigation is being led by Capt. Jack West, who was on the sideline next to Short when the arrests were made and has been interim police chief.

At least we know the investigation is being taken seriously.   

[FBUmp]

From a witnes statement in the original article:

"The second referee told the police officer, nose-to-nose with the police officer, 'you're out of the game...get outta here.' "

Sounds like an "ejection" to me.

If I'm not mistaken, the "witness" was the President of Mandeville Booster Club, one of the fans who was invited to the sideline by the officer and one of the fans who was in the restricted area.  I tend to take anything he says with several grains of salt.

[Johnponz]

I am always kind of amazed on discussion boards that some officials seem not to support other officials.  It is true that the officials may not have treated the officer with the utmost respect after they asked the officer to move the crowd back.  Just because a police officer is treated with a lack of respect does not justify an arrest.  There is still something in this country called the first amendment that allows citizens to express their opinions to public officials (freedom of speech).  There is nothing in these actions that justified an arrest period, and certainly those two brother officials did not deserve to spend the night on a concrete floor.  For some on this board to somehow say the officers were even remotely correct in this situation is an offense to fellow officials.

There is something called the Blue Line which implies that police officers will always stick together in these situations (often even when they are wrong).  As officials we should follow their lead and have a solid Zebra Line.  These officials deserve our support.  I hope this never happens to me because some police officer perceives a lack of respect on my part.