Author Topic: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt  (Read 8750 times)

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Offline bctgp

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Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« on: April 29, 2019, 11:59:13 PM »
4th and 2 from the B-2. The Team A FG attempt is blocked by TeamB behind the LOS and goes backward where the kicker bats the ball forward from the B-7 toward the end zone. The ball hits in the end zone and rolls out across the end line before any other player touches it.

What is the foul and possible enforcement option(s)?




Offline Kalle

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2019, 02:03:05 AM »
Result of the play is an unsuccessful field goal attempt out of bounds behind the team B goal line. There is a foul for an illegal bat during the kick.

Possible enforcement spots are the previous spot or the PSK spot, which is B-20. This meets the criteria for PSK enforcement, so the result of enforcing the penalty is Team B 1/10 @ B-30.

Team B did not touch the ball after it crossed the NZ, so by declining the penalty team B could take the ball at B-20.

The enforcement is obvious, team B will take the penalty.

Offline DJW201

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2019, 07:34:46 AM »
The batting foul was on A, not B, so this would not qualify for PSK enforcement.  Although the field goal attempt crossed the LOS (the bat did not change the status), there is no tack-on option for an unsuccessful field goal.  Options would be a touchback or 10-yard penalty from the spot of the bat and LOD. Since the penalty enforcement would be 1/10 for B at the B-17, B will take the touchback. The LOD applies on this scrimmage kick because the bat occurred behind the LOS.

Offline Legacy Zebra

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2019, 11:19:41 AM »
Agreed, DJW. Also, the ball is dead as soon as hits the ground in the end zone because it is still a scrimmage kick untouched by B beyond the neutral zone.

Offline bctgp

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2019, 11:59:16 AM »
Great feedback -- thanks!

Offline Sonofanump

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2019, 12:11:20 PM »
Agreed, DJW. Also, the ball is dead as soon as hits the ground in the end zone because it is still a scrimmage kick untouched by B beyond the neutral zone.

As a B, that would be a very cognizant whistle realizing untouched by B beyond.

Offline Legacy Zebra

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2019, 12:28:39 PM »
Absolutely. It’s irrelevant if it goes out of bounds (barring end of period timing issues). And if it is recovered, it would be one of those you need to get together as a crew and talk about exactly what everybody has. Hopefully at that point somebody would recognize the situation.

Offline ElvisLives

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2019, 01:16:46 PM »
Absolutely. It’s irrelevant if it goes out of bounds (barring end of period timing issues). And if it is recovered, it would be one of those you need to get  together as a crew and talk about exactly what everybody has. Hopefully at that point somebody would recognize the situation.

Yes.  Although the wings would have the best view of the whole picture, and could make this call in real time, without having to consult, they should actually be more focused on their keys, and blocking action.  The R and/or C will know about the kick block and the batting, but they should not know when/if the ball lands in the end zone.  The deep guys and U may know about the ball landing in the end zone, but they probably shouldn’t know anything about the blocked kick or batting.

Let it play out, then confer and piece it together.  The thing to be sure to ‘fix’ is the game clock, if it didn’t get stopped when the ball first landed in the end zone.  The CO can’t stop it on his own, and the deep guys won’t necessarily know it should stop.  But somebody - an ‘off’ side guy - should check the game clock and advise the crew on the time on the game clock when the ball landed in the end zone. Then, after the dust settles, the R can apply the 5/5 philosophy and put time back on the clock, as necessary.

An unusual-to-rare situation.  Get video. :)

Offline Sonofanump

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2019, 04:30:10 PM »
I think that 12.3.3.i would allow RO to let us know if we do need that help. 

Offline bctgp

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2019, 05:16:34 PM »
I do have the video. Need to figure out how to upload MP4 file.  The crew ended up enforcing it as a 15yd PF against the kicking team. They enforced it from the B-20 (probably based on it resulted in a touchback).  Was Team B 1st & 10 from the B-35.

Unfortunately, the MP4 is 76MB so I am unable to upload. Will see if I can put it out on YouTube or similar. Stay tuned
« Last Edit: May 01, 2019, 05:44:21 PM by bctgp »

Offline goodgrr

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2019, 05:55:45 AM »
Could you put it onto Dropbox and share the link?

Offline Grant - AR

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Re: Penalty Enforcement Question on FG Attempt
« Reply #11 on: May 09, 2019, 08:58:32 AM »
I do have the video. Need to figure out how to upload MP4 file.  The crew ended up enforcing it as a 15yd PF against the kicking team. They enforced it from the B-20 (probably based on it resulted in a touchback).  Was Team B 1st & 10 from the B-35.

Unfortunately, the MP4 is 76MB so I am unable to upload. Will see if I can put it out on YouTube or similar. Stay tuned

If you can find somewhere I can download it, I could put it on the Refstripes server and we could link it from here.