Scrimmage kicks

[#92]

The other day I was explaining kicks in football to someone unfamiliar with the sport, and he asked me some questions about the difference between a punt and a FG attempt.
Afterwards, I was looking through the Rules to find the exact wordings, but I didn't exactly find what I was looking for.

A field goal attempt is a scrimmage kick. It may be a place kick or drop kick.

So we know a punt can never be a FG attempt.
But is a drop kick or a place kick automatically a FG attempt?

A field goal shall be scored for the kicking team if a drop kick or place kick passes over the crossbar between the uprights of the receiving team’s goal before it touches a player of the kicking team or the ground. The kick shall be a scrimmage kick but may not be a free kick.

So a drop kick or place kick that "passes over the crossbar between the uprights of the receiving team’s goal before it touches a player of the kicking team or the ground" is a succesful FG. But that doesn't explicitly say that any other drop kick or place kick is an FG attempt.

What if a place kick or scrimmage kick is untouched by Team B and comes to rest on B-1 (without ever crossing the plane of the goal line)? Rule 6-3-7 leaves it at B-1, but Rule 8-4-2-b leaves it at the previous spot.

It's nitpicking of course, but seeing as the Rules are super precise and explicit about some things, this seems odd.

[NVFOA_Ump]

What if a place kick or scrimmage kick is untouched by Team B and comes to rest on B-1 (without ever crossing the plane of the goal line)? Rule 6-3-7 leaves it at B-1, but Rule 8-4-2-b leaves it at the previous spot.

It's nitpicking of course, but seeing as the Rules are super precise and explicit about some things, this seems odd.

Isn't your answer "that is precise and explicit" the exception that's called out at the end of 6.3.7?

Out of Bounds Between Goal Lines or at Rest Inbounds
RULE 6, SECTION 3, ARTICLE 7. If a scrimmage kick goes out of bounds between the goal lines or comes to rest inbounds and no player attempts to secure it, the ball becomes dead and belongs to the receiving team at the dead-ball spot (Exception: Rule 8-4-2-b).

[jg-me]

I'll exaggerate your example to emphasize the point of your question. 4/10 at the A-30. A10 drop kicks the ball from behind the LOS and the kicked ball subsequently rolls OOB at the B-30, untouched by B.
Where do you place the ball for the next snap?

[Morningrise]

You could be making the same claim about place kicks, too. The rules aren't any more "explicit" for them either. But it's a fact that all place kicks are FG attempts (on scrimmage downs), and the same is true for drop kicks. Place kicks and drop kicks are treated the same everywhere (with one exception*).


*The one distinction between place kicks and drop kicks is on a free kick: A drop kick can be performed from on or behind the restraining line, while a place kick has to be exactly on at the restraining line.

[#92]

You could be making the same claim about place kicks, too.

Didn't I?

But it's a fact that all place kicks are FG attempts (on scrimmage downs), and the same is true for drop kicks.

But I was right that this fact is mentioned in the Rules?

[TXMike]

I'll exaggerate your example to emphasize the point of your question. 4/10 at the A-30. A10 drop kicks the ball from behind the LOS and the kicked ball subsequently rolls OOB at the B-30, untouched by B.
Where do you place the ball for the next snap?

The A-30 

This thread popped up when I was pondering another issue.

Why are carry over penaltes permitted for some Team A fouls on punts but not on FG attempts.  What is the logic behind that?

[Kalle]

Why are carry over penaltes permitted for some Team A fouls on punts but not on FG attempts.  What is the logic behind that?

My guess is that a typical punt is returned whereas a typical failed FG attempt is not, and the return part is the one rules makers (rightly, IMO) want to minimize due to player safety.

[Morningrise]

My guess is that a typical punt is returned whereas a typical failed FG attempt is not, and the return part is the one rules makers (rightly, IMO) want to minimize due to player safety.

That's surely part of it, maybe all of it. They might also not have wanted to give B both the 8-4-2-b-1 spot AND the penalty yardage on top. (Of course, they could have excepted *only* untouched FG attempts if they really wanted to)