Dead Ball Foul After Change of Possession or 1st Down

[red viking]

How is this enforced? For example:

A) A returns a kick, interception, or fumble to their own 40 and is flagged for UC bringing ball back to own 25. Is it 1st and 10 or 1st and 25?

B) Team A gets a 1st down and Team B is flagged for a sideline warning (5 yards) immediately after the play is done and before the chains have moved. Is it 1st and 5 or 1st and 10 from the new location?

Thanks

[HLinNC]

Welcome Red Viking.

Are we talking NFHS rules ?  If so, the only way these plays will not be 1st and 10(or goal) is if the next ready for play has been marked.

[Kalle]

Same in NCAA.

[VALJ]

The spot where the chain is set is not established under NFHS rules until the RFP has been blown.  If flag for a DB foul is thrown after the chains are physically placed but before the RFP, you would move the chains after enforcing the foul.

[red viking]

Thanks. Sounds pretty straight forward.

[red viking]

So here's another one. Team A runs for 10 yards on 2nd & 5 and is then flagged for unsportsmanlike conduct. So it would then be 2nd & 10 on the next play? 

[Legacy Zebra]

NFHS or NCAA?

[red viking]

NFHS

[HLinNC]

No, LTG was reached.  Will be first and 10 after marking off the 15 yard USC penalty.

If all your play questions are all NFHS rules related, you should post in the NFHS board section.  That will save asking NF or NCAA.

[red viking]

Oh yah. Thanks. I didn't see that one. Will do that from now on. Hopefully the moderator can move this one over there. So it sounds like these situations are always 1st & 10 in NFHS if there is a change of possession or reaching yard to gain followed by a penalty.

[Ralph Damren]

The confusing DB/chains one is, while in a hurry-up offense, A snaps the ball prior to RFP after a 1st down. Temptation is for it to become 1st & 15 , but you need to resist temptation and move the chains along with the ball = 1st & 10 after  stepping off 5.

[AlUpstateNY]

The confusing DB/chains one is, while in a hurry-up offense, A snaps the ball prior to RFP after a 1st down. Temptation is for it to become 1st & 15 , but you need to resist temptation and move the chains along with the ball = 1st & 10 after  stepping off 5.

Thank you Ralph, that situation was a landmine quietly waiting for a crew in a hurry.

[VALJ]

The confusing DB/chains one is, while in a hurry-up offense, A snaps the ball prior to RFP after a 1st down. Temptation is for it to become 1st & 15 , but you need to resist temptation and move the chains along with the ball = 1st & 10 after  stepping off 5.

Oh, yeah - I hadn't even thought that far, but that's right - since the DoG flag on Bubba is before the RFP, the chains are not set yet.  Good catch!

[OkieZebra]

The confusing DB/chains one is, while in a hurry-up offense, A snaps the ball prior to RFP after a 1st down. Temptation is for it to become 1st & 15 , but you need to resist temptation and move the chains along with the ball = 1st & 10 after  stepping off 5.

When I reffed intramural flag football, canny teams playing less smart teams abused this rule at regional tournaments.

They'd generally do it on the 20 yard line going in. Just get over for a first down at the 17 or so. Intentionally snap before the RFP so they could move back to the 22. Try and make defense aware that it would be first and two yards to go. They accept anyways. Now a good team has 1st down, with the 20 as the line to gain, then another four downs once they reached it. And the sad thing is, most teams that would pull that stunt successfully didn't need to do it.

[Ump33]

When I reffed intramural flag football, canny teams playing less smart teams abused this rule at regional tournaments.

They'd generally do it on the 20 yard line going in. Just get over for a first down at the 17 or so. Intentionally snap before the RFP so they could move back to the 22. Try and make defense aware that it would be first and two yards to go. They accept anyways. Now a good team has 1st down, with the 20 as the line to gain, then another four downs once they reached it. And the sad thing is, most teams that would pull that stunt successfully didn't need to do it.

1st & 2 at the 22 ... Try to explain this to me.

As Ralph stated ... since the DB Foul happened prior to the Ready, mark off the foul and reset the chains. 1st & 10 at the 22

[Bwest]

1st & 2 at the 22 ... Try to explain this to me.

As Ralph stated ... since the DB Foul happened prior to the Ready, mark off the foul and reset the chains. 1st & 10 at the 22

Flag football has pre-set lines to gain. Crossing the 20 will always get you a first down, whether you get possession at the 5 or 15.

[Ump33]

Flag football has pre-set lines to gain. Crossing the 20 will always get you a first down, whether you get possession at the 5 or 15.

Thanks, I did not know that.