Strange Non Kick Play

[FLAHL]

One of the strangest plays I've seen happened on Friday night:

4/10, K lined up in a scrimmage kick formation. The player lined up deep to receive the snap (can't call him the kicker) caught the snap, took one step forward, and launched a forward pass. High, long, and straight down the middle of the field.  Next thing I know, an R player is running the ball back, and the coaches are yelling that the pass hit the ground (which it did).  I didn't blow my whistle (I'm the R) because I didn't know if the pass was incomplete or intercepted - same with the U. The BJ and LJ didn't blow it dead because they didn't know it was a pass, not a kick. Maybe the HL should have seen both the pass and the incompletion, but he didn't.

Once the runner was tackled, we sorted it out and gave the ball to R at the previous spot. I'm waiting for the film to show up on HUDL to see what we probably missed. Intentional grounding?  Ineligible downfield? 

[wvoref]

Have never seen this play run but have had several coaches mention it in the pregame under "do you have any unusual plays" section.  The purpose of the play in their case is they expect to draw a defensive pass interference call due to R blocking the gunners/pass receivers while the pass/fake kick is in the air. I'm surprised the offensive coach wasn't screaming for DPI instead of just pointing out it was incomplete. As stated I've been told of the play many times but never had it run. I believe NCAA rules address this somehow.

[Kalle]

I believe NCAA rules address this somehow.

Yup, a pass thrown high and deep from a scrimmage kick formation absolves team B from DPI.

[ncwingman]

Yup, a pass thrown high and deep from a scrimmage kick formation absolves team B from DPI.

Not familiar with the NCAA rules myself, but if the pass is directed towards a gunner who is looking for the pass -- you'd still call that DPI, right?

I can see if the pass is "uncatchable" by the gunners, you'd ignore it (again, I'm not sure if "uncatchable" is defined in NCAA rules)

[Kalle]

Not familiar with the NCAA rules myself, but if the pass is directed towards a gunner who is looking for the pass -- you'd still call that DPI, right?

I can see if the pass is "uncatchable" by the gunners, you'd ignore it (again, I'm not sure if "uncatchable" is defined in NCAA rules)

If it is a "normal" trajectory for a pass then yes, you still can have DPI, and yes, catchability is always an issue regarding DPI.

[FLAHL]

Good points about a possible attempt to draw DPI. Given that the passer threw the ball down the middle of the field and not toward either gunner, I'd have trouble calling DPI per 7-5-11c.

Coach never mentioned this during pregame. I do ask about unusual or trick plays. Guess this is another good point to add to our pregame.

It was the defensive coaches yelling Incomplete to make sure they got the ball at the previous spot. Offensive coaches didn't say anything - at least to me.

Thanks guys. Film still isn't up n HUDL.

[theunofficialofficial]

I'm the BJ on Friday night lights, and it's not that hard to know kick/pass. You can hear that 'thump' of the ball leaving the foot. Also, I've got a take a quick peak at direction. I'd have a discussion with your LJ/BJ about what made them think it's a kick instead of a pass? Did he just throw it up like a "lobbed" pass cause otherwise punts and passes typically have very different trajectories..

[HLinNC]

I have seen it twice.  First time it fell incomplete and nobody was fooled. 2nd time I had OPI as apparently one of the receivers was not in on the plan and blocked downfield.

[Jim D]

I had it once - the coach warned up before the game and they pulled it off.  We had DPI and an automatic first down (at the time).  I didn't like it - I thought it's was a cheap play , but we had no choice but to call it DPI.

[VALJ]

Remember that pass interference doesn't apply when a B player makes contact in a direction "obviously away" from the direction of the pass, per 7-5-11-c.  If the "gunner" is running straight down the sideline, and the ball is thrown down the center of the field, it could certainly be argued that the contact was obviously away from the pass.

[Ralph Damren]

Over the years we've had a few coaches advise us of this in our pre game conference (musta' been in some coaches mag ). My response to the coach was : "  IMHO, this could be an illegal forward pass under 7-5-2c (A pass intentionally thrown into an area not occupied by an eligible offensive receiver) and couldn't be DPI under 7-5-11c (Contact by B is obviously away from the direction of the pass). So I'd have to decide if to just return in to the LOS and give B/R the ball or to march off 5 and then give B?R the ball after the loss of down penalty."

Their interest in using that play dwindled considerably thereafter.

[wvoref]

Over the years we've had a few coaches advise us of this in our pre game conference (musta' been in some coaches mag ). My response to the coach was : "  IMHO, this could be an illegal forward pass under 7-5-2c (A pass intentionally thrown into an area not occupied by an eligible offensive receiver) and couldn't be DPI under 7-5-11c (Contact by B is obviously away from the direction of the pass). So I'd have to decide if to just return in to the LOS and give B/R the ball or to march off 5 and then give B?R the ball after the loss of down penalty."

Their interest in using that play dwindled considerably thereafter.

Playing devils advocate here. I could see coach arguing that if pass was thrown high down middle of field one of the wide receivers could get to it if they weren't being blocked by R. Or even just arc high pass towards one of the hash marks it would still look like a punt but definitely would qualify as being in the vicinity of an eligible receiver minus the contact.  However like your explanation to coach if it prevents this play from being run. However like NCAA rule even better as it gives us rule support to prevent this without any debate.

[FLAHL]

Game film showed up on HUDL today.  4 of the 5 down linemen were blocking behind the LoS.  Snapper wasn't touched, and he drifted about 2.5 yards downfield before the pass.  The gunners were not touched, and the pass overthrew the closest gunner by 8 yards.