7-3-4 scenario

[BrendanP]

This is the sort of thing I think about when I'm stuck in traffic. 

We all remember the receiver out of bounds scenario from Michigan State/Nebraska last year, but let's suppose the receiver out of bounds penalty ends up hurting the defense.

3rd and 10 at the B-40. A8 takes a shotgun snap and drops to pass. A82 goes out of bounds by his own volition, and comes back in as A8 throws the ball to him. A82 tips the ball and it's intercepted by B14 at the B-10 and returned 90 yards for a touchdown. This is still an incomplete pass as soon as A82 touches and everything that happens afterward is irrelevant, 4th and 10 at B-40, correct? Team B is just S.O.L. in this case. Boy we'd never hear the end of that one, now would we?

[Legacy Zebra]

If A82 reestablishes himself inbounds, this is will be a touchdown for Team B. Since A82 returned inbounds again before touching the pass, it is illegal touching which will be declined. If A82 leaps from out of bounds and touches the pass before reestablishing himself inbounds, it is an incomplete pass regardless of whether he went out on his own or was forced out.

[BrendanP]

Really, even though he wasn't contacted? I had thought the rule was written so that it just counts as an incomplete pass and was no longer a foul that could be declined.

[Fatman325]

Adjust your question slightly and you have this scenario.

3rd and 10 at the B-40. A8 takes a shotgun snap and drops to pass. A82 goes out of bounds by his own volition and leaps from OB. IB Defender B2 and OB A82 go up to catch the pass and the ball bounces to B3 who returns to interception for a TD. The ruling on the field is that B2 was IB and was the only player to touch the pass prior to the interception. Replays show that OB A82 was the first to touch the pass.

[DallasLJ]

Really, even though he wasn't contacted? I had thought the rule was written so that it just counts as an incomplete pass and was no longer a foul that could be declined.

  Its a foul with no yardage associated with it, you simply treat it as an incomplete pass if A82 caught the ball.  But it is still a foul, and all fouls can be declined by rule.  Since Team B actually caught the ball, they will want to decline the foul and take the ball (unless of course Team B then fumbles during the interception return and Team A recovers at the B30 -- the B will accept the foul).

[NVFOA_Ump]

  Its a foul with no yardage associated with it, you simply treat it as an incomplete pass if A82 caught the ball.  But it is still a foul, and all fouls can be declined by rule.  Since Team B actually caught the ball, they will want to decline the foul and take the ball (unless of course Team B then fumbles during the interception return and Team A recovers at the B30 -- the B will accept the foul).

We should describe this correctly and it is in fact a team A foul and fouls cannot be declined but their associated penalties can.  The penalty enforcement per the rules is team A loss of down at the previous spot.  Team B has the option of declining the penalty and taking the result of the play.

[clipdchain]

Exactly!


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[Andrew McCarthy]

You need to get it out of your mind that this is an incomplete pass.  Everything that happens after it is NOT irrelevant, including for clock status following the penalty enforcement.

[Morningrise]

Really, even though he wasn't contacted? I had thought the rule was written so that it just counts as an incomplete pass and was no longer a foul that could be declined.

Legal forward pass touched by

1. Inbounds guy who was once out of bounds
Ruling: foul, zero yards, loss of down, but not an incomplete pass
2. Out of bounds guy
Ruling: loose ball out of bounds, incomplete pass, down ends immediately, no foul
3. Airborne guy who jumped from out of bounds
Ruling: guy is still out of bounds, see #2.

This is where your confusion comes from. #3 is the same as #2, but up until a few years ago, #3 was the same as #1 instead.

But nothing has changed about #1.

[Kalle]

You want to be very careful when you use rules of thumb such as "a forward pass first touched by team A originally eligible player who became ineligible by going out of bounds is an incomplete pass" or "a kick that has not crossed the neutral zone is not a kick." These do give you guidance to the usual end result but are wildly incorrect in general.