Author Topic: How to properly answer a rule question.  (Read 407 times)

Offline Navcom

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How to properly answer a rule question.
« on: March 13, 2019, 11:05:35 AM »
What is the method of correctly answering a rule question? I'm struggling a bit.

Offline SJ3205

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2019, 11:39:34 AM »
Adhere to the norms and expectations of your study group or what your boss expects. In my study group the expectation is to answer with down and distance plus status of clock. Finish answer with a rules reference
Example

A 2/17 B-35  Snap  9-1-3

Hope this is what you were looking for!


Offline ElvisLives

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2019, 02:02:11 PM »

NAVCOM,
Concur with SJ3305.  Do what your colleagues expect, but, using time-honored formats for answers is usually safe.  Offer possession, down, distance, game clock status, and play clock status, and note any disqualification(s).  Referencing the applicable rule(s) and/or ARs or bulletin plays never hurts.  Example (following the traditional NCAA format established during the Nelson/Adams realm):
B, 1/10, B-25, GC:snap, PC:25.  Touchback, by 8-6-1 & 2, and 8-7-2.

When you say you are struggling, is that self-perception?  Or, have you been criticized on your responses?  If you have been criticized, perhaps you can share some examples, and we could suggest what we believe are appropriate responses, and you could use those as guides for further study or quiz questions.

Robert

Offline Navcom

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2019, 03:57:40 PM »
I'm getting only the answers that are obvious. Some are COP, Kick plays and UNS DBFs. I try to use a method, such as Result of play,  D&D , etc. I guess i'm not going as deep into the play or looking at the options.   

Offline ElvisLives

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2019, 05:54:24 PM »
Can you give us an example?
Robert

Offline Navcom

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2019, 08:17:48 PM »
 A 3/4 @ B-40.  At the snap, team A had 5 players in the backfield.  B69 intercepts a legal forward tipped pass and is tackled at the A-35.  On B69ís interception return, A44 holds B22 at the B-45.  With the crown of the helmet, B70 hits A70 at the knees while A70 is on the ground at the 50.  Ruling?

Offline Magician

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2019, 10:43:16 PM »
So you are saying you have a hard time answering them correctly or completely, not necessarily the format of your answer. If that's the case the best thing is to try to picture everything stated in the question and pretend it happens to you on the field. How would you process it there? Most quiz scenarios involve a foul so always consider the status of the ball at the time of the foul (loose ball play, running play). Then determine the basic spot based on the type of play. If there isn't a specific enforcement then consider the all-but-one to determine enforcement. If you are new focus more on the simpler plays and not plays with double/multiple fouls, multiple change of possession, and strange kick plays. You need to walk before you can run.

Offline Kalle

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2019, 05:02:53 AM »
A 3/4 @ B-40.  At the snap, team A had 5 players in the backfield.  B69 intercepts a legal forward tipped pass and is tackled at the A-35.  On B69ís interception return, A44 holds B22 at the B-45.  With the crown of the helmet, B70 hits A70 at the knees while A70 is on the ground at the 50.  Ruling?

Let me give you an example of how I work the questions.

1. Team A commits a live-ball foul at the snap. ("At the snap, team A had 5 players in the backfield.")
2. Team B gains possession before fouling ("clean hands" exception to offsetting penalties might apply). ("B69 intercepts a legal forward tipped pass")
3. Result of the play is team B 1/10 A-35. ("is tackled at the A-35")
4. Team A commits a live-ball foul while team B is in possession. ("On B69ís interception return, A44 holds B22 at the B-45")
5. Assuming that the contact by B70 occurs while the ball is live in team B's possession, this is a live-ball foul on team B while team B is in possession. ("With the crown of the helmet, B70 hits A70 at the knees while A70 is on the ground at the 50.")
6. We now have all the information from the play situation and can proceed with options.
7. Team B has the option to decline all team A penalties to keep the ball, which they will do.
8. Only remaining foul is the TGT by B70, which is basic spot enforcement, and basic spot is the spot of the foul.
9. Result: Team B 1/10 B-35. B70 is disqualified.
10. Possible but extremely unlikely result: Offsetting fouls, Team A 3/4 B-40. B70 is disqualified.
11. Game clock will start on the snap if #9 (1st down for team B), ready if #10 (clock stopped only due to penalty enforcement).
12. Play clock is 25s due to penalty enforcement.

If the TGT happens after the ball is dead, there are no offsetting penalties and team B will likely decline the illegal formation and accept the holding penalty. TGT penalty is enforced after that, so we end up at A-40, 1/10 for team B, snap, 25, disqualify B70. Theoretical alternative is team A 1/10 B-30 after team B accepts the ILF penalty, and another theoretical result is Team B 1/10 B-35 after team B declines both team A penalties.

Do note that this is a bad example as the play situation description does not have enough information for us to fully answer it.

Offline bossman72

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2019, 08:46:39 AM »
One thing that helps me is to visualize the play in my mind's eye as it's described in the question.  That helps connect words to visual actions you see.

Offline Navcom

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2019, 12:25:37 PM »
thank you boss-man.

Offline NVFOA_Ump

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2019, 04:48:12 PM »
One thing that helps me is to visualize the play in my mind's eye as it's described in the question.  That helps connect words to visual actions you see.

Great suggestion.  When I was in the training class some 20 years ago our instructor suggested just that.  If you're struggling with understanding the play in text format (the question) visualize what the play would look like with players on the field.  Makes the next step much clearer from my experience.
It's easy to get the players, getting 'em to play together, that's the hard part. - Casey Stengel

Offline SJ3205

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Re: How to properly answer a rule question.
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2019, 11:36:22 AM »
Like every other aspect of this job-- stay patient. It took me three years with the NCAA book to even become remotely comfortable with the rules in an open book quiz/test setting.