Uncommonly enforced rules

[AlUpstateNY]

Correct. But what I had was a ball carrier jumping directly over the head of a defender who had “broken down” and was crouching in anticipation of making the tackle.

If EITHER one, or both, of the defender's feet, or knees was the ONLY body part touching the ground, in the NFHS code, it is a foul for hurdling, which at the NFHS level, is considered inappropriately dangerous.   

[CalhounLJ]

If EITHER one, or both, of the defender's feet, or knees was the ONLY body part touching the ground, in the NFHS code, it is a foul for hurdling, which at the NFHS level, is considered inappropriately dangerous.

I’m just wondering if you read the rule you posted on this very topic. Because it specifically says one or both FEET. If the opponents knee is on the ground its not hurdling.


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[ElvisLives]

For those who may not have access to an NFHS Rule Book;  NFHS 2-22 "HURDLING: is an attempt by a player to jump (hurdle) with one or both feet or knees foremost over an opponent who is contacting the ground with no part of his body except one or both feet."

I asked because some folks keep referring to the 'runner' or 'ball carrier' leaping a 'defender.' It appears to me that the rule applies to all players, in NFHS. Maybe it would be better to just reference a 'player' leaping an 'opponent.'
Again, this is a significant rule difference with NCAA (and the NFL, too, I believe). I won't offer the difference, to keep from confusing anyone. But, if you are contemplating getting into NCAA football, or are simply spectating an NCAA game, please understand that the rule is different, so you may not see it called the same way.

[Derek Teigen]

I’m just wondering if you read the rule you posted on this very topic. Because it specifically says one or both FEET. If the opponents knee is on the ground its not hurdling.


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yes Calhoun you are correct the rule book state feet or foot.  I had a game (as a wing) on a short yardage situation where it appeared the runner lept into and over a pile of linemen who were engaged and some already on the ground.  The coach of the defending team behind me was screaming 'hurdling!'.   I think that has to be a very tough call to make.

[AlUpstateNY]

I’m just wondering if you read the rule you posted on this very topic. Because it specifically says one or both FEET. If the opponents knee is on the ground its not hurdling.
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Thanks for your concern, and keen observation, which was correct.
 
A day, or so ago, I posted the exact verbiage of NFHS 2-22, for those who may not have had ready access to it.  Somehow my subsequent conversation and reference to this rule allowed the word "knees" to (incorrectly) infiltrate that response.

It's worth noting that there appears to be significant difference between the NCAA & NFL rules regarding "Hurdling" and that of the NFHS Rule, which likely takes into consideration both the Maturity and Skill Set differences between players at these respective codes.

One of the reasons, I try and remember to add quotation marks to any specific rule I reference, as such. Those stark differences between codes, as related to "Hurdling", unfortunately causes much of the confusion experienced by those not aware of the differences.

It's been my understanding that the rule "difference", at the NFHS level, is intended to dissuade players from considering/attempting to avoid opponents by jumping ("with one or both feet or knees foremost who is contacting the ground with no part of his body except one or both FEET."). 

[Magician]

One I will add that I don't think I saw here is the momentum exception. We talk about it a lot in rules meetings and clinics, but in 20 years I think it's only happened once or maybe twice in a game. I've seen some video where passes were incepted very close to the goal line so there was discussion about whether the pass was completed in the end zone or field of play.

[CalhounLJ]

One I will add that I don't think I saw here is the momentum exception. We talk about it a lot in rules meetings and clinics, but in 20 years I think it's only happened once or maybe twice in a game. I've seen some video where passes were incepted very close to the goal line so there was discussion about whether the pass was completed in the end zone or field of play.

I ran back judge for ten years and applied momentum rule twice in those ten years. Both on interceptions.


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[SCHSref]

Counted 35 fire ant beds on a field and told them ww couldn't play.

Called helping the runner my first year. Got it right. Called tripping the runner last year...kind of caught me off guard, but you know it when you see it.

[AlUpstateNY]

The definition of "TRIPPING" NFHS:2-45 was amended in 2019 to include "the runner. "NFHS 9-4-o was added in 2019.  Prior to that change, the penalty for "tripping" specifically EXCLUDED the "runner".

[sczeebra]

 Waiting for the color guard to come out for the National Anthem to be played over the loudspeakers. We waited and waited and waited a little longer finally I said let's go guys. They came over the PA system at half we will now play the National Anthem because the referees would not allow it before the game. Dang we got it wrong again!!!

[SCHSref]

The definition of "TRIPPING" NFHS:2-45 was amended in 2019 to include "the runner. "NFHS 9-4-o was added in 2019.  Prior to that change, the penalty for "tripping" specifically EXCLUDED the "runner".

Correct and I never saw it done before last year.

[Ralph Damren]

NFHS puts safety of the players first. NCAA & NFL have had tripping the runner a foul for many years. I dreaded being asked why tripping the runner wasn't a foul, too, in NFHS. Hurdling was on the docket to legalize several years ago, with a video showing a runner successfully hurdling a defender. The NFHS doctor then ran a video of several unsuccessful hurdling attempts often resulting in injury. It was soundly defeated. Hurdling doesn't have to be by the runner. Some of you may recall several years ago when Coach B sent a Patriot D-back ( who happened to be a NCAA hurdling champ) to hurdle the snapper and block the field goal attempt. It was legal in the NFL then and the following morning my phone rang off the hook with coaches asking : "CAN WE DO THAT,TOO ??" NO  (5-man crew).

The NFL may have since changed their rule. 

[SCHSref]

NFHS puts safety of the players first. NCAA & NFL have had tripping the runner a foul for many years. I dreaded being asked why tripping the runner wasn't a foul, too, in NFHS. Hurdling was on the docket to legalize several years ago, with a video showing a runner successfully hurdling a defender. The NFHS doctor then ran a video of several unsuccessful hurdling attempts often resulting in injury. It was soundly defeated. Hurdling doesn't have to be by the runner. Some of you may recall several years ago when Coach B sent a Patriot D-back ( who happened to be a NCAA hurdling champ) to hurdle the snapper and block the field goal attempt. It was legal in the NFL then and the following morning my phone rang off the hook with coaches asking : "CAN WE DO THAT,TOO ??" NO  (5-man crew).

The NFL may have since changed their rule.

Had that happen in a varsity game. We caught it and flagged it. Threw the coach and the kid for a loop

[HLinNC]

the following morning my phone rang off the hook with coaches asking : "CAN WE DO THAT,TOO ??"

At least they called to ask Ralph.  Most here would just run the play and then look at us aghast after they got flagged for it.

[ncwingman]

Waiting for the color guard to come out for the National Anthem to be played over the loudspeakers. We waited and waited and waited a little longer finally I said let's go guys. They came over the PA system at half we will now play the National Anthem because the referees would not allow it before the game. Dang we got it wrong again!!!

I had a similar event happen a few years ago, but they didn't blame us (at least out loud). Week 1 of the season, so there's a lot of "new" floating around, band is on the sideline ready to play the anthem, and then everybody just stands around waiting for everybody else's cue -- the band was waiting for the announcers, and the announcers were waiting for the band.

Eventually, the home team just took the field and we all decided to play the game. The anthem was eventually performed at halftime.

[AlUpstateNY]

The "Anthem" is "THE ANTHEM", it's "unique" and a moment of thanks and respect we pay to those whose sacrifices allow us able to gather together and watch a game we enjoy. 

If there's a delay, it's worth waiting until whatever is causing the delay can be dealt with.  Despite delay, the game clock will still remain at 12:00, so waiting a little to pay respect for our ability to gather, really doesn't, and shouldn't matter. 

[KWH]

The "Anthem" is "THE ANTHEM", it's "unique" and a moment of thanks and respect we pay to those whose sacrifices allow us able to gather together and watch a game we enjoy. 

If there's a delay, it's worth waiting until whatever is causing the delay can be dealt with.  Despite delay, the game clock will still remain at 12:00, so waiting a little to pay respect for our ability to gather, really doesn't, and shouldn't matter.

I unequivocally agree with ALF!
(only the 2nd time in 15 years)

[refjeff]

So isn't a player who has clearly been beaten on a play intentionally tackling an opponent who is in a clear position to catch a pass before the ball arrives committed a flagrant act?

flagrant = blatant, conspicuous, egregious, glaring, gross, obvious, patent, pronounced, rank, striking

2.16.2.c  Flagrant - a foul so severe or extreme that it places an opponent in danger of serious injury, and/or involves violations that are extremely or persistently vulgar or abusive conduct.

IPI doesn't meet that test.

[ncwingman]

2.16.2.c  Flagrant - a foul so severe or extreme that it places an opponent in danger of serious injury, and/or involves violations that are extremely or persistently vulgar or abusive conduct.

IPI doesn't meet that test.

Honestly, in order for most/any of us to actually call IPI, it would probably have to be flagrant.

[Derek Teigen]

Hi Ralph, are we saying that any fumble forward into the endzone is illegal or is it a judgment call? 

[Ralph Damren]

Hi Ralph, are we saying that any fumble forward into the endzone is illegal or is it a judgment call?

Only if deemed intentional. On a 4th & goal situation, if the runner was stopped short of goal, I would be suspect if he shoveled the ball into the endzone.

[CalhounLJ]

Only if deemed intentional. On a 4th & goal situation, if the runner was stopped of goal, I would be suspect if he shoveled the ball into the endzone.

Me too. I’d probably call it a illegal forward pass in that situation. 


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[AlUpstateNY]

Me too. I’d probably call it a illegal forward pass in that situation. 


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It's really NOT Rocket Science, but you need to understand, and be able to recognize, the difference between NFHS: 2-18 and 2-31-1.

[CalhounLJ]

It's really NOT Rocket Science, but you need to understand, and be able to recognize, the difference between NFHS: 2-18 and 2-31-1.

Yes I agree. Thank you for point that out. This is precisely why I would probably rule it IFP as opposed to a forward fumble. The language “shoveled the ball” implies intentional forward motion being exerted on the ball as opposed to simply losing control. True, forward motion could be applied in a forward fumble, but not intentionally. Perhaps you could shed the light on the difference. Maybe you could help me understand it better by and by.


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[PABJNR]

One of the most uncommonly enforced rules in my opinion is illegal equipment.  Normally if we see a player with incorrect eye black, play card on belt, wearing wristbands high on his arms or on his legs we just send them out instead of banging the head coach for 15 like rule 9 says.