White hat mirroring signals?

[JerseyLJ]

For the white hats…do you mirror the TD signal to the press box at the conclusion of a score?   I took over last year for my old WH and he always mirrored, which I have copied.  I’ve watched other crews recently and have noticed some WH do not.  Our mechanics manual only dictates that we do not mirror tries or FGs, but TDs aren’t specified.  Thanks for any feedback. 

[lukez]

Mirror might be the wrong word here.  No official should immediately mirror a TD signal just because another member of the crew gave such a signal.  Once the R has confirmed the TD and that there are no fouls, they should signal toward the press box.  Some TDs are blatantly obvious, but other TDs aren't and not everybody will see the TD signal from the wing that's standing 6+ feet behind the sideline.  It's good to be consistent.  The NFHS officials' manual recommends this too (see: Goal-Line Play).  Which mechanics manual do you follow?

[HLinNC]

Yes.  Just because a wing or BJ gives a TD signal doesn't necessarily mean there is a score.  The U or other official may have a flag that will negate it.  The R should scan the field before signaling the press box of a score.

[Ralph Damren]

Yes.  Just because a wing or BJ gives a TD signal doesn't necessarily mean there is a score.  The U or other official may have a flag that will negate the it.  The R should scan the field before signaling the press box of a score.

                                                                   

[bossman72]

I think it's an empty mechanic.  Is there any question what the result of the play is when a runner goes untouched into the end zone and the officials on the goal line signal touchdown?  99 times out of 100, no.  Unless there is confusion, there is no need to signal to the press box, IMO.

[Ralph Damren]

I'm probably gui;ty of 'over-signaling'  as on PATs , I usually signal #5 or #10 followed by  #3 + taping of chest. When signaling #2 to start the clock I assume that I'm from inside the clock , looking out , so the frenzed masses will see the signals as clockwise. My favorite signal is #14 ,end of period. 

[bama_stripes]

I still mirror on PATs.  It’s a carryover from my early days as a WH in four-man crews when the WH actually determined whether a kick try was successful.

And, as they say about old dawgs....

[refjeff]

As many know Ohio has it's own Gold Book of mechanics.  The only things anybody ever mirrors, including the R, is stop the clock and touchback on kickoffs.

The hardest habit for me to break was blowing my whistle.  When I started a half century ago i was taught that when one blows his whistle everybody blows his whistle. 

[Etref]

Think of it this way. The R is not mirroring the TD signal, he is CONFIRMING the scoring attempt.

[lawdog]

Think of it this way. The R is not mirroring the TD signal, he is CONFIRMING the scoring attempt.

Shouldn't he then confirm incomplete?  Or what about confirming winding of the clock when a play ends in bounds?

This is needless signaling and should not be done. 

[AlUpstateNY]

Shouldn't he then confirm incomplete?  Or what about confirming winding of the clock when a play ends in bounds?

This is needless signaling and should not be done.

I don't think it's necessary for the Referee to "confirm" an incomplete signal on a pass play, but he should definitely signal (or repeat) any (other) official's signal to stop the clock (each & every time) as should the other field officials as well.  A football field is a relatively big place and there is often action going on away from the actual spot a pass, or play ends.  It's ALWAYS a good idea to let EVERYONE, EVERYWHERE know a play has ended.

Nothing "good" has ever happened from players (innocently or not) continuing action after a play has been ended, ANYWHERE on the field, and well worth the minimal effort of a "confirming" signal, or alerting whistle. 

[refjeff]

Shouldn't he then confirm incomplete?  Or what about confirming winding of the clock when a play ends in bounds?

This is needless signaling and should not be done.

Oops, in OHio we mirror that too.

[HLinNC]

Right or wrong, I think many civilian ECO's, particularly new ones, are told to look for the white hat.  I'm not going to "mirror" every incomplete signal nor every stop clock signal.   I am going to give a confirmation signal to the press box for a score or if a try is no good.

If one thinks it is over signaling then "you do you".....

[Ralph Damren]

Under our 40" clock we tell the ECO to watch for the silent wind on a new series by A. I see nothing wrong with that and give signal #2 as if I'm from ithe inside of a clock looking out so my signal shows clockwise to the pressbox and frenzy masses.  .

TYNNK (THINGS YOU NEED NOT KNOW) : CLOCKS WERE INVENTED IN THE NORTHERN HEMISPHERE
                                                              THE HANDS OF A CLOCK TURN CLOCKWISE FOR A REASON
                                                                SUNDIALS CAME BEFORE CLOCKS
                                                                  THE SUN ON A SUNDIAL  MOVES CLOCKWISE IN THE NORTHERN HEMISPHERE

.If I can think of more useless information that you need not know, I won't pass it on. 

[bama_stripes]

Shouldn't he then confirm incomplete?  Or what about confirming winding of the clock when a play ends in bounds?

This is needless signaling and should not be done.

We have a number of stadiums where the lighting is suboptimal.  On plays which end on the far sideline, especially near either goal line, it’s often difficult for the ECO to see what the covering official is signaling.  I have no problem with the WH confirming winding or stopping of the clock, especially when in time-sensitive situations.

[CalhounLJ]

We have a number of stadiums where the lighting is suboptimal.  On plays which end on the far sideline, especially near either goal line, it’s often difficult for the ECO to see what the covering official is signaling.  I have no problem with the WH confirming winding or stopping of the clock, especially when in time-sensitive situations.

That coupled with the fact that the view from most press boxes leave something to be desired. In some places the eco can’t even see the officials near the goal line. As a wh I mirror my fellow officials calls all the time. It’s not wasted motion, it’s good officiating.


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[dammitbobby]

Think of it this way. The R is not mirroring the TD signal, he is CONFIRMING the scoring attempt.

IMO incomplete passes, etc do not need to be mirrored, but scoring plays do, because it's confirmation to the scoreboard operator to change the score.  That may or not be the PCO or even GCO.  Them throwing points on the board because they saw a score, but not the flag that was down, is a good way to get people excited.

[AlUpstateNY]

That coupled with the fact that the view from most press boxes leave something to be desired. In some places the eco can’t even see the officials near the goal line. As a wh I mirror my fellow officials calls all the time. It’s not wasted motion, it’s good officiating.
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For those who seem seriously concerned about identifying, "How many angels can actually dance on the head of a pin." do we really know, care or does it matter if angels even dance? 

For those of us, who have actually been "in a booth", there is an infinite variety of unexpected situations/reasons one may not instantaneously see important field signals, and crewmates routinely "mirroring" significant such signals  is a great asset towards avoiding/minimizing problems that may arise from unnecessarily missing/delaying appropriate crew signals. Doing so is an "OFFICIALS" "tool" to insure consistent information sharing.  If you're nor part of THAT crew, it's not your concern.