Author Topic: True or False  (Read 1092 times)

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Offline sj

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True or False
« on: December 21, 2025, 12:01:05 PM »
With the changes that have been made is it true or false to say that in the NF book, it wouldn't change anything and would now be accurate if, in every case where the term "basic spot" is used they replaced it with "enforcement spot?" 

Offline ncwingman

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Re: True or False
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2025, 09:42:09 PM »
I believe the intent of the revision was to make that true, but I don't believe it is.

10-4-3 defines the basic spot for PSK fouls as the spot where the kick ends, then immediately makes fouls behind the basic spot "spot fouls". By the clear as mud wording of the rule, the basic spot and enforcement spot may not be the same in this situation.

Offline bossman72

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Re: True or False
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2025, 08:45:10 AM »
With the changes that have been made is it true or false to say that in the NF book, it wouldn't change anything and would now be accurate if, in every case where the term "basic spot" is used they replaced it with "enforcement spot?" 

This is one of my biggest gripes about the NFHS book is that they don't know the difference between the two words.  They use it interchangeably which is wrong.  I'd say 85% of the time they mean enforcement spot.  In my re-write, I address this:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VfAbdZuj7K_UVWBU4USpklLXoeIlifWGmGxZ-IPeXv8/edit?usp=sharing

Offline NVFOA_Ump

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Re: True or False
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2025, 09:22:00 AM »
I believe the intent of the revision was to make that true, but I don't believe it is.



Have to agree here in that it's false.  I've seen bossman72's suggested re-write and IMHO he's on the right track to both clarify and simplify the current wording.
It's easy to get the players, getting 'em to play together, that's the hard part. - Casey Stengel

Offline dch

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Re: True or False
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2025, 02:25:36 PM »
Now that we don't have the "old way" 3 & 1 or all-but-one enforcement from the Basic Spot --- it seems obvious to me that the Rules just need to clearly state where to enforce things for the various scenarios.  The term "Basic Spot" is really confusing and totally unnecessary in today's Rules.  It shouldn't be in the book.  It shouldn't be a term that is used.
 
There aren't all that many "Enforcement Spots" to deal with.  Off the top of my head the list includes:  Previous Spot, Succeeding Spot,  Spot where a Run Ends, PSK Spot, Spot of Foul, Inbounds Spot.  Free Kick out-of-bounds has some options.  I'm sure there will be others. 
Please, please, please ---  eliminate the term Basic Spot from the rules and just use consistent words to say what is intended. 
I, for one, find the Penalty Table or Chart helpful.

Offline NVFOA_Ump

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Re: True or False
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2025, 04:08:04 PM »
Now that we don't have the "old way" 3 & 1 or all-but-one enforcement from the Basic Spot --- it seems obvious to me that the Rules just need to clearly state where to enforce things for the various scenarios.  The term "Basic Spot" is really confusing and totally unnecessary in today's Rules.  It shouldn't be in the book.  It shouldn't be a term that is used.
 
There aren't all that many "Enforcement Spots" to deal with.  Off the top of my head the list includes:  Previous Spot, Succeeding Spot,  Spot where a Run Ends, PSK Spot, Spot of Foul, Inbounds Spot.  Free Kick out-of-bounds has some options.  I'm sure there will be others. 
Please, please, please ---  eliminate the term Basic Spot from the rules and just use consistent words to say what is intended. 
I, for one, find the Penalty Table or Chart helpful.


We can all agree that a penalty chart is "helpful" but for the last few rulebook revisions the changes have been very much less than helpful.  In fact IMHO, they have made it more difficult to figure out.
It's easy to get the players, getting 'em to play together, that's the hard part. - Casey Stengel

Offline bossman72

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Re: True or False
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2025, 07:56:01 PM »
Now that we don't have the "old way" 3 & 1 or all-but-one enforcement from the Basic Spot --- it seems obvious to me that the Rules just need to clearly state where to enforce things for the various scenarios.  The term "Basic Spot" is really confusing and totally unnecessary in today's Rules.  It shouldn't be in the book.  It shouldn't be a term that is used.
 
There aren't all that many "Enforcement Spots" to deal with.  Off the top of my head the list includes:  Previous Spot, Succeeding Spot,  Spot where a Run Ends, PSK Spot, Spot of Foul, Inbounds Spot.  Free Kick out-of-bounds has some options.  I'm sure there will be others. 
Please, please, please ---  eliminate the term Basic Spot from the rules and just use consistent words to say what is intended. 
I, for one, find the Penalty Table or Chart helpful.

IMO, they just need to use "basic spot" properly.  I agree with your assertion that it's confusing, because it is (the way it's written).  The editorial committee simply does not know how to write Rule 10 and use proper terminology.  I agree that if they're not going to use All-but-one, then yes, take out the word basic spot since it's meaningless without all-but-one.

I don't like your suggestion of mapping out every possible scenario, as that's impossible to memorize and really hard to teach.  I don't think the rule book should continue down that path.

Using the basic spot and All-but-one is a formula.  You can plug in any scenario and get the play right.  Just remember a couple exceptions and it's easy breezy.

I think we all can agree that what's in the current rulebook is just utter garbage.  Not only do they conflate basic spot and enforcement spot, but they also do it with succeeding spot and end of the run.  Succeeding spot enforcement has always been a term used for dead ball fouls and live ball fouls treated as dead ball fouls.  To use succeeding spot as a term for regular live ball fouls is incredibly confusing.

I don't like the way it's currently written.  They need to put it in reverse and do something else instead of continuing to drive off the cliff in this current direction.