Author Topic: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike  (Read 27108 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline golfingref

  • *
  • Posts: 288
  • FAN REACTION: +10/-6
LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« on: October 08, 2011, 03:27:43 PM »
First time I have seen the new rule enforced to bring back a touchdown. Curious to hear any comments on the call. Occurred as the punter was about to score a touchdown off a fake punt, last minute of the first quarter.

Offline slasc

  • *
  • Posts: 37
  • FAN REACTION: +1/-0
  • FFFA
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2011, 03:39:18 PM »
What a call !! I assume we will read and hear a lot about this call. The celebration is here, but it is not flagrant... I tought the flag was for the celebration near stands, but no...


Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2011, 03:49:12 PM »
It is not about the "celebration", it is about the taunt.  Seems pretty clear to me.  This is NOT youthful exuberance, this is taunting.

Offline slasc

  • *
  • Posts: 37
  • FAN REACTION: +1/-0
  • FFFA
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2011, 04:00:09 PM »
Taunting because he turned his head in opponents direction?
Is this still a foul if he did not looking opponents?
Just asking to understand the philosophy...

Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2011, 04:05:44 PM »
I suspect had he put his arms out like that while running and looking straight ahead without slowing at all it would not have been flagged. 

The video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ifqc95lh2VQ
« Last Edit: October 08, 2011, 04:20:39 PM by TXMike »

110

  • Guest
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2011, 08:24:15 PM »
Unless there was something said, right loud, that's way, way tickytack, IMHO.

Offline NVFOA_Ump

  • *
  • Posts: 4174
  • FAN REACTION: +107/-328
  • High School (MA & RI)
    • Massachusetts Independent Football Officials Association
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2011, 09:10:36 PM »
I agree with the flag (verbal component or not).  The runner clearly turned and looked directly at the 2 defenders who were rapidly closing on him, and knowing they were not going to catch him, gave them the "you are not going to catch me" pose (maybe added some words as well?).  No question IMO that this was directed at and intended for the opponents.
It's easy to get the players, getting 'em to play together, that's the hard part. - Casey Stengel

Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2011, 10:40:51 PM »
STEVE SHAW SPEAKS..

OrlandoSentinel.com
Taunting penalty costs LSU punter a touchdown
By Rachel George, Orlando Sentinel

BATON ROUGE, La. — Few blame LSU punter Brad Wing for not knowing about a new taunting rule that cost the Tigers a touchdown in the first half of their win over Florida.

Punting from midfield, Wing saw everyone drop back in coverage and took off running for the Florida end zone. He made it 52 yards for what seemed to be the Tigers' third TD of the first quarter, but he raised his arms in celebration at the 8-yard line.

A new NCAA rule this year erased the touchdown and gave the Tigers a 15-yard unsportsmanlike penalty from the spot of the foul. It was the first time that penalty was called in the SEC this year.

"Based on what was seen on the television replays, the LSU player turned towards two Florida players and made a taunting gesture," said Steve Shaw, SEC director of officials. "The rule as stated in the rule book was accurately applied."

Offline Welpe

  • *
  • Posts: 1860
  • FAN REACTION: +28/-11
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2011, 11:24:38 PM »
I'm glad to see this not only called but also supported by Steve Shaw and even the announcers.

MJT

  • Guest
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2011, 12:33:11 AM »
Turning towards two opponents chasing him is why it was a foul. I agree that if he had been looking straight ahead, probably no foul.

Offline blindref757

  • *
  • Posts: 562
  • FAN REACTION: +30/-17
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2011, 10:45:59 AM »
Is it just me, or is there something more in what Shaw said that might elude to the fact that he isn't pleased with the call.

Publicly, he has to say that the call is correct by rule.  But we all know that we don't always use the black and white of the rulebook in actuality...there are some grey zones where we allow a little wiggle room between the black and the white.  I'm willing to bet dollars to donuts that Walt Anderson and Steve Shaw disagree on this call.  I've heard the trickle down in my neck of the woods that Walt doesn't want it called unless it's egregious. 

This is exactly what we didn't need...a situation that is a tweener...and one that the different supervisors likely disagree on.  To take points off the board puts a tremendous responsibility on our shoulders and it should be used with great discretion.  Was that so bad that it deserves a 6 point penalty?

El Macman

  • Guest
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2011, 11:14:54 AM »
If the teams don't want to have to suffer the consequences of an unfavorable judgment, don't put the officials in the position of having to make a judgment. Simple as that.
Ler's applaud the fortitude of the calling official and the crew for making this difficult, but correct, call. Maybe the next guy will think twice about hotdogging/showboating/taunting and won't put the officials in that position. Maybe.

Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2011, 11:18:06 AM »
Is it just me, or is there something more in what Shaw said that might elude to the fact that he isn't pleased with the call.

Publicly, he has to say that the call is correct by rule.  But we all know that we don't always use the black and white of the rulebook in actuality...there are some grey zones where we allow a little wiggle room between the black and the white.  I'm willing to bet dollars to donuts that Walt Anderson and Steve Shaw disagree on this call.  I've heard the trickle down in my neck of the woods that Walt doesn't want it called unless it's egregious. 

This is exactly what we didn't need...a situation that is a tweener...and one that the different supervisors likely disagree on.  To take points off the board puts a tremendous responsibility on our shoulders and it should be used with great discretion.  Was that so bad that it deserves a 6 point penalty?

Frankly, based on some other things demonstrated by Big XII guys this year I am not sure Mr Anderson's viewpoints are really significant any longer, unless of course you are in or want to be in, the Big XII

Offline zebra99

  • *
  • Posts: 605
  • FAN REACTION: +30/-3
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2011, 11:18:21 AM »
my take is this is exactly what we needed for the first one - an act which isn't huge - now we know where the bar is set which is good for us because the so called "tweeners" which we all discussed in the off season are now cleared up.

Offline JasonTX

  • *
  • Posts: 2985
  • FAN REACTION: +113/-59
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2011, 10:34:36 PM »
my take is this is exactly what we needed for the first one - an act which isn't huge - now we know where the bar is set which is good for us because the so called "tweeners" which we all discussed in the off season are now cleared up.

You are right on with this.   :thumbup

mbyron

  • Guest
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2011, 06:15:47 AM »
I'm glad to see this not only called but also supported by Steve Shaw and even the announcers.
Did you watch the entire clip? They reversed their support for the call, on the grounds that the foul wasn't "egregious," (which somebody told them was how the rule would be interpreted, plus they didn't want LSU fans flaming them for the next 9 weeks).

Offline Welpe

  • *
  • Posts: 1860
  • FAN REACTION: +28/-11
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2011, 07:54:45 AM »
No I didn't, guess I spoke too soon!

Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2011, 10:40:39 AM »
From LSU Coach Miles:

Miles agreed with the call and hopes that the rest of the team learned a lesson for future
 
“It was absolutely correct,” said Miles. “What a great lesson it will be to our guys to have points taken off.”

Offline TxSkyBolt

  • *
  • Posts: 2007
  • FAN REACTION: +45/-46
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2011, 11:04:42 AM »
From LSU Coach Miles:

Miles agreed with the call and hopes that the rest of the team learned a lesson for future
 
“It was absolutely correct,” said Miles. “What a great lesson it will be to our guys to have points taken off.”

Pretty easy words to say when you win by 30 points. yEs:

Offline bama_stripes

  • *
  • Posts: 3145
  • FAN REACTION: +124/-29
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2011, 01:17:48 PM »
Steve Shaw was on a B'ham radio show this morning, and took great pains to remind the listeners that it was a committee of coaches that implemented the enforcement change.

Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2011, 01:23:45 PM »

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/15715340/weekend-review-grobes-wonders-lsu-punters-blunder-defy-explanation

1. The SEC stands by the "unsportsmanlike" call at LSU: On Sunday I reached out to Steve Shaw, the SEC supervisor of officials, to discuss the unsportsmanlike conduct call on LSU punter Brad Wing during Saturday's game against Florida in Baton Rouge. In case you didn't see it, Wing, a redshirt freshman from Melbourne, Australia, took a fake punt and ran 52 yards for an apparent touchdown late in the first quarter. But before Wing scored he eyed the Florida defender and raised his arms in that direction. Wing was flagged for unsportsmanlike contact and, under the new rule, the penalty was marked from the spot of the foul and there was no touchdown. "When I first saw it I wondered if that was one we should have let go," said Shaw. "But I talked to the official on the play and watched it closely. It was the correct call. It was textbook."

I just thought it was hilarious. Why? We knew that somebody would get called for this before the season was over. But what were the odds that it would be a punter? And what were the odds that the punter would be from Australia? Maybe we need to brush up on our Australian rules football.

Oh, by the way. When the folks out there are beating up on the officials over this, remember that it was the coaches who wanted this rule and pushed for its passage.



ABoselli

  • Guest
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2011, 04:24:51 PM »
If that is truly where the bar is set, there should have a bunch of scores taken away already and there will now be a bunch more that will be questioned.

I don't think this one rose to the level that RR implied at all.

Offline TXMike

  • *
  • Posts: 8773
  • FAN REACTION: +229/-268
  • When you quit learning you quit living
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2011, 04:38:09 PM »
Do you not see this act as being directed AT an opponent?  Do you see it just as him  celebrating what he knows is about to come, the TD?

Offline TxSkyBolt

  • *
  • Posts: 2007
  • FAN REACTION: +45/-46
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2011, 05:14:32 PM »
Do you not see this act as being directed AT an opponent?  Do you see it just as him  celebrating what he knows is about to come, the TD?

Can't tell 'cause apparently there was a major malfunction at mike's command central and no clip has been forthcoming.  Time to clean house in that operation if you ask me :)

Brad

ABoselli

  • Guest
Re: LSU live ball Unsportsmanlike
« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2011, 05:49:23 PM »
Do you not see this act as being directed AT an opponent?  Do you see it just as him  celebrating what he knows is about to come, the TD?

I think there is doubt as to his intent and if it was intented toward the opponents, I just don't think a 1 second (if that) arms open motion to an oncoming opponent warrants that flag. High step, somersault into the end zone, hold the ball out toward them, flip them off, throat slash, change stride before entering the end zone, salute, bow at the waist, hand to ear, turning around and backing into the EZ, finger up to the mouth as if to say, "shhh" - these are all things that would qualify in my opinion. These are the kind of acts that are so clear to everyone that there is no discussion when they occur.

Could he have been gesturing to his teammates as if to say, "Hey - can you believe we pulled this off for a 50 yard score?!! This is great! " ? Maybe. There's no black and white standard to this one, so it kind of falls into that senator's description of pornography decades ago; to paraphrase, "I can't really describe it but I'll know it when I see it".

I think this just bought us a whole lot of unneeded grief down the road when slight acts such as this will go (rightfully, in my opinion) unpenalized.

But, hey - that's why we get the big bucks.